stevebrum Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 Sorry but you cannot go from heat 4 to heat 10 without a grade. The Polish Extraleague have it right. 4 heats then short grade/watering. 3 heats short grade /watering 3 heats short grade/watering 3 heats short grade / watering Break for last 2 heats rider nominations and grade/water. Meetings are normally done and dusted in about 1hr 45 mins. The parade is always bang on 10 mins before start time and 1st race is always on start time. Meetings I've watched at Wolves and other tracks seem to follow the 4 heats grade, then every 3. That is needed. The start time and presentation should be clearer tho. Advertising as "tapes up 7.30" is false advertising particularly if it's parade at 7.30 and 1st race at 7.45. Most people can be in by 7.30 so I see no reason why racing can't start then with parade at 7.20. Personal preference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted November 15, 2017 Report Share Posted November 15, 2017 Meetings I've watched at Wolves and other tracks seem to follow the 4 heats grade, then every 3. That is needed. The start time and presentation should be clearer tho. Advertising as "tapes up 7.30" is false advertising particularly if it's parade at 7.30 and 1st race at 7.45. Most people can be in by 7.30 so I see no reason why racing can't start then with parade at 7.20. Personal preference. Boil my piss when I rush to a track for 7.30 for them to have the first race at 7.45 or 7.50. If you advertise 7.30 then start at 7.30! And then be finished in about 90 minutes. Not all of us living within 10 minutes of the track and having rushed out of work we want to get home at a reasonable time as we have work the next day too and we're already running low on energy having had to tolerate a crap burger from the van on the back straight! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g13webb Posted November 15, 2017 Report Share Posted November 15, 2017 Are you saying the riders try harder cos of the away scoring system??? Surely they get paid for scoring..so I doubt the scoring system makes not the slightest difference. What a load to tosh  The only load of old tosh here, is your ability to see what's in front of you. If an away team was 10 points adrift with a few heats to go, the match is as good as over. Whereas, if there was a chance of scoring a solidary point when finishing within a 6pts deficit, the goal would be more achievable and racing would be more competitive....   Sorry but you cannot go from heat 4 to heat 10 without a grade. The Polish Extraleague have it right. 4 heats then short grade/watering. 3 heats short grade /watering 3 heats short grade/watering 3 heats short grade / watering Break for last 2 heats rider nominations and grade/water. Meetings are normally done and dusted in about 1hr 45 mins. The parade is always bang on 10 mins before start time and 1st race is always on start time.  A lot would depend on the weather. On a hot sunny day, probably more water would be needed as the track dries out. But when running on cold damp evenings, the watering is not necessary. From my experience far too much time is spent grading the track, that does nothing but slow the meeting down. .Remember, the Ref can't put the 2mins on until the track is clear....  I'd like to wager that at most meetings at Lynn, there is more time spent grading the track than the actual racing. Its no wonder fans get fed-up.... 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted November 15, 2017 Report Share Posted November 15, 2017 Â The only load of old tosh here, is your ability to see what's in front of you. If an away team was 10 points adrift with a few heats to go, the match is as good as over. Whereas, if there was a chance of scoring a solidary point when finishing within a 6pts deficit, the goal would be more achievable and racing would be more competitive.... Â Â Â A lot would depend on the weather. On a hot sunny day, probably more water would be needed as the track dries out. But when running on cold damp evenings, the watering is not necessary. From my experience far too much time is spent grading the track, that does nothing but slow the meeting down. .Remember, the Ref can't put the 2mins on until the track is clear.... Â I'd like to wager that at most meetings at Lynn, there is more time spent grading the track than the actual racing. Its no wonder fans get fed-up.... U prefer meetings where there is a huge build up of dirt on the outside of the track so riders really are dicing with death going into it, I don't. The more material on our small tracks the more grading is needed imo... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g13webb Posted November 15, 2017 Report Share Posted November 15, 2017 U prefer meetings where there is a huge build up of dirt on the outside of the track so riders really are dicing with death going into it, I don't. The more material on our small tracks the more grading is needed imo... Â The knack is not to put too much shale on the track. That was the massive problem that caused all the trouble at the Poole match. Obviously you have learnt nothing from that fiasco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted November 15, 2017 Report Share Posted November 15, 2017 Â The knack is not to put too much shale on the track. That was the massive problem that caused all the trouble at the Poole match. Obviously you have learnt nothing from that fiasco Yes that is true but a rider of Chris Holder's class shouldn't have a problem with it though, there is always a temptation to put too much shale on the track, it happened under Wagstaff as well remember a meeting at Kings Lynn when only Crump was capable of riding it because it was so deep and an hour later after a lot of work,we had racing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted November 15, 2017 Report Share Posted November 15, 2017 Â The knack is not to put too much shale on the track. That was the massive problem that caused all the trouble at the Poole match. Obviously you have learnt nothing from that fiasco It was the non binding of the new material with the base material that was reportedly the problem as I understood it... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g13webb Posted November 15, 2017 Report Share Posted November 15, 2017 Yes that is true but a rider of Chris Holder's class shouldn't have a problem with it though, there is always a temptation to put too much shale on the track, it happened under Wagstaff as well remember a meeting at Kings Lynn when only Crump was capable of riding it because it was so deep and an hour later after a lot of work,we had racing. Â Surely the idea is to have a track enabling everybody the ability to race, not try to create one to suit certain riders..... I still believe the track was rideable that day as proved by those who were prepared to try. Holder, along with Batchelor, made themselves look silly that day, but speedway was the biggest loser... Â If all tracks and toppings were of similar construction, I sure the racing would be far better received and appreciated... I see no fun or gain by watching riders in difficulties because of bad track preparation... 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CookieIpswich Posted November 16, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 To keep the league closer say 12 teams, home and away once so 22 meetings  2 points for a win 1 point for a draw 0 points for a loss 1 bonus point for aggregate win  Would make the league table closer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CookieIpswich Posted November 16, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 Maybe someone with time and knowledge can work out what the league table would have looked like this season under that scoring system Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldyman Posted November 16, 2017 Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 It would be good if they made some rules and stuck with them for say 10 years..so every club knows what will be happening the following seasons and they can build their budgets and business plans around that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfsbane Posted November 16, 2017 Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 It would be good if they made some rules and stuck with them for say 10 years..so every club knows what will be happening the following seasons and they can build their budgets and business plans around that. Nice idea. Trouble is the BSPA don't know what they're doing tomorrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midland Red Posted November 16, 2017 Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 Nice idea. Trouble is the BSPA don't know what they're doing tomorrow Or what they did yesterday! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil The Ace Posted November 16, 2017 Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 So the AGM is tomo. Looks set to be set race nights (mon & Thursday) there for stopping missing riders  So.......  What day would you prefer????? Mon or Thurs  And if it was the same team week in week out with no guest (excluding injuries of course) do you think the crowds would improve????  For me i'd go with Monday for belle vue  And  I think the crowd could improve. And if only 1 rider is Injured then I think they should have to use R/R no matter where in the team they are.  All teams should have to name a no8 at start of season and if a reserve is injured then the no8 replaces 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Najjer Posted November 16, 2017 Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 So the AGM is tomo. Looks set to be set race nights (mon & Thursday) there for stopping missing riders  So.......  What day would you prefer????? Mon or Thurs  And if it was the same team week in week out with no guest (excluding injuries of course) do you think the crowds would improve????  For me i'd go with Monday for belle vue  And  I think the crowd could improve. And if only 1 rider is Injured then I think they should have to use R/R no matter where in the team they are.  All teams should have to name a no8 at start of season and if a reserve is injured then the no8 replaces  A squad system of sorts is the way to go, or at least 2 riders doubling up to share one position in a team. At least it creates an association between riders and teams, not just any tom dick or harry turning up! I'm amazed this hasn't been operated for a number 1 also. You could have Nicki Pedersen and Greg Hancock (for arguments sake) sharing a no.1 berth. They only need to do half as many meetings like they want, the fans get a proper number 1, no guests and everyone is happy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveLyric2 Posted November 16, 2017 Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 If its Mondays and Thursdays - as is strongly suggested - then surely clubs will run on both nights over the course of a full season?! If they are away on a Monday then a home meeting on a Thursday is surely the best option rather than wait for a fortnight. Â A squad system of sorts is the way to go, or at least 2 riders doubling up to share one position in a team. At least it creates an association between riders and teams, not just any tom dick or harry turning up! I'm amazed this hasn't been operated for a number 1 also. You could have Nicki Pedersen and Greg Hancock (for arguments sake) sharing a no.1 berth. They only need to do half as many meetings like they want, the fans get a proper number 1, no guests and everyone is happy! Can't possibly see the BSPA agreeing to that 'cos Matt Ford proposed it about 5 years ago on the back of Chris Holder and Darcy Ward suggesting the same option!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cheese Posted November 16, 2017 Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 Maybe someone with time and knowledge can work out what the league table would have looked like this season under that scoring system  Assuming the first fixture home and away is the 'A' fixture; Swindon 49 Wolves 47 Belle Vue 45 Poole 37 Rye House 35 Somerset 25 Kings Lynn 21 Leicester 19  Doesn't include the point from the first meeting between Rye House and Kings Lynn which was tied on aggregate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted November 16, 2017 Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 (edited) So the AGM is tomo. Looks set to be set race nights (mon & Thursday) there for stopping missing riders  So.......  What day would you prefer????? Mon or Thurs  And if it was the same team week in week out with no guest (excluding injuries of course) do you think the crowds would improve????  For me i'd go with Monday for belle vue  And  I think the crowd could improve. And if only 1 rider is Injured then I think they should have to use R/R no matter where in the team they are.  All teams should have to name a no8 at start of season and if a reserve is injured then the no8 replaces Agree re RR Phil... They should just make RR fit for purpose..  Eg if No1 missing then the next two in the averages should be able to take all programmed rides..  If the second averaged rider is missing, then the No1 takes one ride and the third and fourth averaged riders can take the rest between them if the Manager wishes...  Same rules apply for third, fourth and fifth averaged riders missing ie rider immediately above takes one ride, two riders below three between them.  Number six rider missing and the fifth averaged rider takes two and the number seven takes two.....  Number seven missing and number six takes two and a designated number eight takes two..  All riders can have a Max of seven outings per night..  Missing a No1 invariably means a guest under the current RR system as your second string will be taking a ride which is a high risk given the differential in capability. This way the next best two riders can cover it.. Edited November 16, 2017 by mikebv 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfsbane Posted November 16, 2017 Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 (edited) Purely from a Wolves perspective all home would have to be monday due to dogs thursday. That being said, when would the 'off'' race night be? Tuesday has been used in the past but then you run into Swedish clashes so the original availability problem resurfaces. How's that look from other track's 'off' racenights? Clashes/track unavailability? Edited November 16, 2017 by Wolfsbane Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CookieIpswich Posted November 16, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 Separate race nights will increase doubling up but obviously at the same time separating clashes so it only benefit the promoters and riders not the credibility of the sport  R/R I agree with if a rider is missing no guests  Each team should name a number 8 from the national league to cover in a sort of squad system for another reserve missing  A job share at no.1 should happen if fixed race nights, might encourage the odds top rider but no matter what the question is they will want ££££££££££££££ and British speedway can't afford it  And promotors like the one at photo will likely announce that Dudek is guesting at no.1 then pack everyone into the stadium to only find out last minute it's r/r coz he's missed his flight  Credibility and integrity is what has to come from the AGM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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