Stoke

[Sings4Speedway]

Im thought i saw something over the winter about management restructuring and a new PR person coming on board?

The issues at Stoke have been long discussed and long known, what might help save their situation is some actual press releases or admittance that things are just no good enough at present but we are looking to rectify within our means......both fans and riders will be more understanding if clubs put their hands up and say we need to address X, Y & Z. At present Stoke just have their heads buried in the sand and it is only making matters worse. 

[GWC]

The bspa or SCB should be all over Stoke and there track after Saturdays farce.

There’s home advantage and then there’s dangerous.

[teaboy279]

I d suggest, the next time someone gets hurt there, it could lead to a compensation claim. After the amount of injuries this year.

Speedway us dangerous enough without riders having the extra worry about the race surface falling apart underneath them. I am dreading my lads riding there tomorrow tbh.

[Sings4Speedway]

Come on Stoke. This is your biggest night of the year ahead. Perfect week of weather in the lead up so forget the result and just serve up a consistent track surface with limited dust, get the meeting run within a respectable 2 hours and allow the 2nd half meeting to actually be completed. If you can achieve this it will be considered a great success if Stoke fail to deliver on these basic items i fear their whole existence will be in great jeopardy.

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

1 hour ago, teaboy279 said:

I d suggest, the next time someone gets hurt there, it could lead to a compensation claim. After the amount of injuries this year.

Speedway us dangerous enough without riders having the extra worry about the race surface falling apart underneath them. I am dreading my lads riding there tomorrow tbh.

I suggest the sport should look into riders using bikes that they can’t control, tracks haven’t really changed some have always been rough, however bikes have and not for the better, but far be it from me to point out the obvious 

[teaboy279]

1 hour ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:

I suggest the sport should look into riders using bikes that they can’t control, tracks haven’t really changed some have always been rough, however bikes have and not for the better, but far be it from me to point out the obvious 

Can't disagree with that, but the engine configuration is set by the authorities, not the riders.

You often hear the comment, "the throttle works both ways" which 20 years ago was valid, you roll off the the throttle now and initially accelerate.

Uprights were safer and more rider friendly, but the same as anything in life it's hard to go backwards.

[teaboy279]

Meeting cancelled due to track conditions. Gutted for all those who had booked hotels to go to this and the 4's but overall glad we don't have to worry about our riders getting hurt needlessly.

 

[Sings4Speedway]

15 minutes ago, teaboy279 said:

Meeting cancelled due to track conditions. Gutted for all those who had booked hotels to go to this and the 4's but overall glad we don't have to worry about our riders getting hurt needlessly.

 

Sounds like common sense has finally prevailed although shame it has come this far. Fingers crossed Stoke get everything sorted quickly and can move passed this.

[Halifaxtiger]

3 hours ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:

 suggest the sport should look into riders using bikes that they can’t control, tracks haven’t really changed some have always been rough, however bikes have and not for the better, but far be it from me to point out the obvious 

You mean Ben Morley, one of the NL's top riders ? He fell twice in three races on Saturday. Word I got from IOW was that it was so bad they did not want to send their riders out.

Trying to pass the buck and blame riders is not just a cop out, its a sham  -  and it could be seen as an attempt to get promoters whose tracks are dangerous off the hook. 

If this were happening everywhere and there were multiple fallers and unacceptable levels of riders leaving stadiums injured as a result of the track surface you might have a point. 

It isn't, though, and no other track in Britain has a reputation for such incompetence as Stoke - and that's by a long chalk. 

The sooner the SCB get involved, the better. 

 

 

[uk_martin]

2 hours ago, teaboy279 said:

Meeting cancelled due to track conditions. Gutted for all those who had booked hotels to go to this and the 4's but overall glad we don't have to worry about our riders getting hurt needlessly.

 

Eh? Speedway abandoned due to the wrong sort of shale?...according to the Potties own web site.  Add that to the wrong kind of snow, leaves on the tracks, etc etc.

How come that of the 27 tracks in the UK, Stoke is the only one that's got the wrong material on the track? Was it provided by the lowest bidder, by any chance, maybe in exchange for a couple of club house ceiling tiles, or something?

Glad that the SCB have stepped in to oversee the resurfacing of the track. High time too. I'd feel sorry for the visiting fans who may have lost money for their hotel expenses etc, except that I doubt that anyone would be daft enough to risk a trip to Stoke under any circumstances these days, so I doubt if anyone has suffered a loss.

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

1 hour ago, Halifaxtiger said:

You mean Ben Morley, one of the NL's top riders ? He fell twice in three races on Saturday. Word I got from IOW was that it was so bad they did not want to send their riders out.

Trying to pass the buck and blame riders is not just a cop out, its a sham  -  and it could be seen as an attempt to get promoters whose tracks are dangerous off the hook. 

If this were happening everywhere and there were multiple fallers and unacceptable levels of riders leaving stadiums injured as a result of the track surface you might have a point. 

It isn't, though, and no other track in Britain has a reputation for such incompetence as Stoke - and that's by a long chalk. 

The sooner the SCB get involved, the better. 

 

 

Yes it is happening everywhere , there are so many restarts in national league it’s ridiculous, I’m not blaming the riders but the modern bike is so unforgiving , you put young riders on them who haven’t been brought up using throttle control and what do you expect, I could point to loads of tracks that were a lot worse than stoke, somerton park Newport, dreadful track ,Weymouth ist year  has ruts a foot deep Carmarthen ist year was like sand but all were ridden ok, I  had a conversation a few weeks ago with a top official and he was talking about a well publicised recent event in which the track/promotion was blamed but even the main rider involved who is a huge name in the sport said the modern bike just doesn’t work on rough surface so what chance does young riders have ? I’m not justifying the stoke track but riders riding bikes that they can’t control is a far bigger issue than stoke 

Edited June 22, 2018 by THE DEAN MACHINE

[screm]

3 minutes ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:

Yes it is happening everywhere , there are so many restarts in national league it’s ridiculous, I’m not blaming the riders but the modern bike is so unforgiving , you put young riders on them who haven’t been brought up using throttle control and what do you expect, I could point to loads of tracks that were a lot worse than stoke, I had a conversation a few weeks ago with a top official and he was talking about a well publicised recent event in which the track/promotion was blamed but even the main rider involved who is a huge name in the sport said the modern bike just doesn’t work on rough surface so what chance does young riders have ? I’m not justifying the stoke track but riders riding bikes that they can’t control is a far bigger issue than stoke 

I agree with you Dean, riders these days have the throttle either shut or on full gas and when they are on a track that is iffy once they hit any grip they are a passenger. That`s not to excuse the track conditions at Stoke last Saturday.

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

23 minutes ago, screm said:

I agree with you Dean, riders these days have the throttle either shut or on full gas and when they are on a track that is iffy once they hit any grip they are a passenger. That`s not to excuse the track conditions at Stoke last Saturday.

If you put national league riders out on a temporary track like cardiff after 10 heats when the ruts apear it would be carnage, the top riders lift and bounce around but it’s still raced because they can handle their bikes “just”

Edited June 22, 2018 by THE DEAN MACHINE

[cityrebel]

I'm not defending stoke in any way, but quite a few tracks have struggled to get decent shale this season. Poole, Somerset & The IOW are three that spring to mind.

[Halifaxtiger]

10 hours ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:

Yes it is happening everywhere , there are so many restarts in national league it’s ridiculous, I’m not blaming the riders but the modern bike is so unforgiving , you put young riders on them who haven’t been brought up using throttle control and what do you expect, I could point to loads of tracks that were a lot worse than stoke, somerton park Newport, dreadful track ,Weymouth ist year  has ruts a foot deep Carmarthen ist year was like sand but all were ridden ok, I  had a conversation a few weeks ago with a top official and he was talking about a well publicised recent event in which the track/promotion was blamed but even the main rider involved who is a huge name in the sport said the modern bike just doesn’t work on rough surface so what chance does young riders have ? I’m not justifying the stoke track but riders riding bikes that they can’t control is a far bigger issue than stoke 

I don't agree that bad control is a bigger issue than track surfaces.

Looking at the most recent meetings at all NL tracks on updates :

Belle Vue 2 falls, no injuries, 15 heats. Birmingham 4 falls, no injuries, 15 heats. Buxton, 4 falls, no injuries, 15 heats. Coventry 3 falls, no injuries, 15 heats. Cradley no falls, no injuries, 15 heats. Eastbourne, 4 falls, no injuries, 15 heats. IOW, 3 falls, 1 injury, 15 heats. Mildenhall, 4 falls, no injuries, 15 heats. Plymouth, 8 falls, no injuries 15 heats.

The one injury was Adam Roynon, - one of the best and most experienced riders - whose throttle stuck open. Plymouth's track surface was described as 'inconsistent'.

And then we have Stoke.

13 falls, 3 injuries, 10 heats. Meeting abandoned due to the state of the track, following meeting cancelled a day before hand due to  track issues. 

The above very much suggests to me that the issue here is not about poor throttle control at all, but a dangerous track surface in which all riders - and not just the young and inexperienced ones(I repeat, Ben Morley fell twice) - were unable to cope.  

[Halifaxtiger]

10 hours ago, uk_martin said:

 

Eh? Speedway abandoned due to the wrong sort of shale?...according to the Potties own web site.  Add that to the wrong kind of snow, leaves on the tracks, etc etc.

How come that of the 27 tracks in the UK, Stoke is the only one that's got the wrong material on the track? Was it provided by the lowest bidder, by any chance, maybe in exchange for a couple of club house ceiling tiles, or something?

Glad that the SCB have stepped in to oversee the resurfacing of the track. High time too. I'd feel sorry for the visiting fans who may have lost money for their hotel expenses etc, except that I doubt that anyone would be daft enough to risk a trip to Stoke under any circumstances these days, so I doubt if anyone has suffered a loss.

To be fair, they are not. As CR has said, Isle of Wight, Somerset and Poole have all had problems with defective shale.

Isle of Wight was dusty when I was there recently but it didn't cause carnage, which suggests that Stoke's problems are not down to the shale alone.

Edited June 23, 2018 by Halifaxtiger

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

8 hours ago, Halifaxtiger said:

 - were unable to cope.  

And yet you can’t see the difference between being unable to cope and to cope is the very engines being used 

[Halifaxtiger]

17 hours ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:

And yet you can’t see the difference between being unable to cope and to cope is the very engines being used 

I would see the difference is clear from the meeting listings I have posted.

After all, its the same engines at all the above tracks isn't it ?

If that's the case, why is it that those engines cause 3 or 4 fallers and no injuries in 15 heats at almost every NL track and then 13 fallers and 3 injuries in 10 heats at Stoke ? 

Do they suddenly disastrously misbehave when they get to Staffordshire ?

Or is it quite simply that the track is in such dreadful condition there that even the best and most experienced riders in the NL can't stay on ? 

Bluntly, its insulting, unsubstantiated and unjustifiable to claim that the carnage at Stoke the other night was caused by rider incompetence and, worse, it  attempts to deflect the blame away from a club absolutely notorious for their shoddy practices.

 

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

2 hours ago, Halifaxtiger said:

I would see the difference is clear from the meeting listings I have posted.

After all, its the same engines at all the above tracks isn't it ?

If that's the case, why is it that those engines cause 3 or 4 fallers and no injuries in 15 heats at almost every NL track and then 13 fallers and 3 injuries in 10 heats at Stoke ? 

Do they suddenly disastrously misbehave when they get to Staffordshire ?

Or is it quite simply that the track is in such dreadful condition there that even the best and most experienced riders in the NL can't stay on ? 

Bluntly, its insulting, unsubstantiated and unjustifiable to claim that the carnage at Stoke the other night was caused by rider incompetence and, worse, it  attempts to deflect the blame away from a club absolutely notorious for their shoddy practices.

 

 I’m not defending stoke’s track the other night, but rough tracks have been around for years and always will be but the modern bike just isn’t forgiving and this is the result, it’s also why there are far more rain offs because the engines are wrong, I spoke with a rider last night who was in the meeting in question at stoke v iow and his words were “the track situation was blown out if proportion and the meeting should of finished, he said some riders need to understand occasionally you need to ride rough tracks, they are not all smooth” his words not mine 

Edited June 24, 2018 by THE DEAN MACHINE

[Halifaxtiger]

14 minutes ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:

And as I’ve said if you chose to listen I’m not defending stoke’s track the other night, but rough tracks have been around for years and always will be but the modern bike just isn’t forgiving and this is the result, it’s also why there are far more rain offs because the engines are wrong, I spoke with a rider last night who was in the meeting in question at stoke v iow and his words were “the track situation was blown out if proportion and the meeting should of finished, he said some riders need to understand occasionally you need to ride rough tracks, they are not all smooth” his words not mine 

What sticks in my craw is that you are attempting to say that this is down to riders, not the track and I'd say that it is difficult to see how that is not a defence of Stoke (as is quoting that rider). You're certainly not condemning a club that had a meeting abandoned due to the surface and who then cancelled their next meeting 24 hours before hand for the same reason and without any adverse weather (unlike everyone else on this thread).  

Care to do so now?  I think we can both agree that as bad a position as speedway is in it would be far worse if such circumstances were a regular occurrence.

The rider quote I saw in respect of this meeting described Stoke as a 'sh*thole' (his words, not mine), I know Isle of Wight asked for the track inspection because they did not want to send their riders out and its clear the referee thought the meeting had to be abandoned.  

That (taking also into account the number of falls and injuries) sounds like the track was not merely rough, but dangerous. There's a difference.