Pay Rates Mystery

[waytogo28]

Spoke about 3 years ago with a sponsor of a rider who was at the time at a good HL level in both Leagues and rode only in Britain..

 

He earned between £90 - £95k from riding...

 

"Not much left" after paying out for kit and the general everyday cost of 12 months living was the comment..

 

Outlay was approx £20 - £25k each season for total start up to buy three new bikes and equip van with spare equipment etc..

 

This was offset to a degree by selling off the bikes at the end of the Season, but obviously this doesn't bring in the same value and would often only cover the years additional running costs of fuel, tuning, insurance etc etc

 

Obviously riders as we know could take other jobs during the winter, but many don't so rely solely on Speedways income..

 

Didn't Woffy say a couple of years ago in an interview that his costs were well over £100k a year?

 

Need a fair old income to do that...

 

And that £90k was not added to by the sponsor? I thought a sponsor/s might well cover a lot of or even all of his kit?

 

I can't imagine that Woffy has much less than £500k net income per season including sponsorship income and it could easily be nearer £1,000,000. The sky is the limit for established world class riders who have "made it" in Poland.

[clambo71]

Nothing against this mystery rider but here lays the majority of the problem. NL riders should be looking at their earnings as subsidising a sport they enjoy whilst still holding down a full/part time job. Riders of higher divisions and with more matches to complete are fully entitled to be a full time rider but should only be looking to cover the costs of living & racing a sport they enjoy. Everyone would love the opportunity to be paid to do the thing they love most but there are far too many riders trying to make a fortune out of the sport rather than embracing the opportunity to be paid to do something they enjoy and are good at.

could not disagree more the problem is clubs insisting on riding seven days a week.

Try holding down a job and asking the boss for time off sometimes three times a week to compete from

Manchester to Plymouth to Kent and all points inbetween. I once worked with a cyclist who rode for GB

abroad and allways used his holidays to compete. Then one year two international competitions came in the

same year ,he used his holidays for the first one and asked for time off for the second,they refused and told him

if he competed he would lose his job.And that was to ride in something like the Olympic games what chance a rider in the

third tier an a minority sport like speedway.

[waco]

Most riders negotiate their own pay rate which varies considerably according to ability and regulated by promoters income which also varies from track to track ,and league they are in,,...Those on the lowest rates could not survive without sponsers and outside help..

Edited October 20, 2017 by waco

[martinmauger]

Riding speedway sounds like beer & skittles basically, but being a motorsport it can go wrong very quickly. One bad spill and bike can be written off, along with a month or so of earnings. Then when repaired or replaced the rider may not score as well due to resulting niggling injuries (often the worst to get over) and / or the 'new' bike may not rerform as well as the previous one. Spoke end of season to one rider (name witheld but a Premier League 2nd string) who admitted his scoring had tailed off somewhat, team doing zip so no real biggie. His only bike needed a tune / service and he had a buyer lined up who was aware of the impending service, but if he crashed or blew the bike up the sale would fall through and with it his chance to break even over the season. He was reluctant to tune his existing bike or replace it without a firm team offer for the next season. This wasn't forthcoming and so the rider sold his bike and all other speedway equipment and retired and does a more conventional job, though is still seen at tracks from time to time. Probably happens more than one might otherwise think....

[Fromafar]

There are plenty riders make a lot more money than the average 9-5 jobs person.Not bad for 10 min racing a week ,remember this is a sport they are not forced to do it for a living.

[martinmauger]

There are plenty riders make a lot more money than the average 9-5 jobs person.Not bad for 10 min racing a week ,remember this is a sport they are not forced to do it for a living.

True and good luck to them. Neither praising nor criticising, just sayin'....

[Jonny the spud]

I don't ask how much my son earns as it's none of my business, I do know however that he does occasional work during the season when he can fit it in, works whenever he gets back to France every year, in the past has had to sell his moto x bike ( which he rides to keep fit in the close season) and sell off equipment etc... just to get to the tapes the following year.

 

There really are some fantasist ideas on here as to how much a rider earns. Sponsorship is very hard to come by as well.

[Lord Skid]

The good Sponsors have all had their fingers burned, which spoils it for the honest Riders today.

Speedway is about being a good Businessman, as well as a Rider, unfortunately very few are good at the business side of things.

[Bruiser McHuge]

Well my brother in law was a rider..and he's done well out of it...I think a lot of riders will always complain..and a lot of riders waste a fortune on fancy vans, fancy kit and ridiculous engine tuners...but the fact is if you do it sensibly and are decent as a rider there should be no way you shouldn't do ok out of it...

[waytogo28]

Well my brother in law was a rider..and he's done well out of it...I think a lot of riders will always complain..and a lot of riders waste a fortune on fancy vans, fancy kit and ridiculous engine tuners...but the fact is if you do it sensibly and are decent as a rider there should be no way you shouldn't do ok out of it...

 

I am mostly interested in doubling up riders in the UK only. I based my calculations on a rider doubling up and scoring 8 points ave. in the Premier League and at least 8 in the Championship ( i.e. the Top 20 who are doubling up and scoring 300 points in each league ). I did miscalculate but I still believe that the Top 20 doubling up riders are earning £150,000 gross from their points in UK speedway racing. Depending on their Premier League deal this could be between 150k and 250k for the top riders. Plus sponsorship but obviously less kit costs.

 

From what I have been told it is at least £200 per point ( or above for the "top" riders ) in the Premier and £100 per point min. n the Championship. The extent to which their equipment costs are covered by sponsors obviously varies but again the higher averaged riders usually have more sponsors who cover a lot of kit.

 

I estimate that at leat 30% of riders are making a good living - at least 4x the average wage or double what most qualified people earn e.g. a teacher. Another 30 - 40% ( so around 75% of all riders in the UK ) are "making it pay" i.e. earning above the average wage for something they have chosen to do and enjoy. Thats's great! I have no complaint, they are heroes on track and still love to watch them in a good, close , exciting races. I just feel that some riders claim they "can't make it pay" without doubling up when it is likely that only 25% are failing to earn from speedway, at least the average wage. Even those not doubling up. Quite a number work for their sponsor or someone who is a fan of speedway in the winter, thus adding to their annual income.

 

Some do suffer equipment misfortune and of course some suffer from injury and that may mean that they are out of pocket for their efforts but it is a business for them and there are no guarantees of commercial success in business.

[clambo71]

I am mostly interested in doubling up riders in the UK only. I based my calculations on a rider doubling up and scoring 8 points ave. in the Premier League and at least 8 in the Championship ( i.e. the Top 20 who are doubling up and scoring 300 points in each league ). I did miscalculate but I still believe that the Top 20 doubling up riders are earning £150,000 gross from their points in UK speedway racing. Depending on their Premier League deal this could be between 150k and 250k for the top riders. Plus sponsorship but obviously less kit costs.

 

From what I have been told it is at least £200 per point ( or above for the "top" riders ) in the Premier and £100 per point min. n the Championship. The extent to which their equipment costs are covered by sponsors obviously varies but again the higher averaged riders usually have more sponsors who cover a lot of kit.

 

I estimate that at leat 30% of riders are making a good living - at least 4x the average wage or double what most qualified people earn e.g. a teacher. Another 30 - 40% ( so around 75% of all riders in the UK ) are "making it pay" i.e. earning above the average wage for something they have chosen to do and enjoy. Thats's great! I have no complaint, they are heroes on track and still love to watch them in a good, close , exciting races. I just feel that some riders claim they "can't make it pay" without doubling up when it is likely that only 25% are failing to earn from speedway, at least the average wage. Even those not doubling up. Quite a number work for their sponsor or someone who is a fan of speedway in the winter, thus adding to their annual income.

 

Some do suffer equipment misfortune and of course some suffer from injury and that may mean that they are out of pocket for their efforts but it is a business for them and there are no guarantees of commercial success in business.

Not sure why this is such an important issue with you but you need to downgrade your

100 pound per point min figure in the championship.A rider I know has ridden in that division

for 6/7 seasons and rising at times to No1 and at no time has been paid anywhere near

that figure.

[MattK]

From what I have been told it is at least £200 per point ( or above for the "top" riders )

Thank about it. If a team scores 45 points the cost will be £9k. That is for a single meeting. A team rides two meetings (home and away) for every one amount of income, so they have to pay £18k in points money alone from a single home meeting's gate revenue. Most Premiership clubs only get around 1,000 supporters at about £12 net, so if your average pay is correct teams are losing £6,000 a week in points money alone?

 

I'd say your averages are out by as much as double, otherwise the numbers simply don't add up.

[Tsunami]

Thank about it. If a team scores 45 points the cost will be £9k. That is for a single meeting. A team rides two meetings (home and away) for every one amount of income, so they have to pay £18k in points money alone from a single home meeting's gate revenue. Most Premiership clubs only get around 1,000 supporters at about £12 net, so if your average pay is correct teams are losing £6,000 a week in points money alone?

 

I'd say your averages are out by as much as double, otherwise the numbers simply don't add up.

Quite agree. Pay is a personal issue for riders, and what they get is nowhere near the ridiculous figures suggested by some wasting bandwidth on here.

[waiheke1]

 

I am mostly interested in doubling up riders in the UK only. I based my calculations on a rider doubling up and scoring 8 points ave. in the Premier League and at least 8 in the Championship ( i.e. the Top 20 who are doubling up and scoring 300 points in each league ). I did miscalculate but I still believe that the Top 20 doubling up riders are earning £150,000 gross from their points in UK speedway racing. Depending on their Premier League deal this could be between 150k and 250k for the top riders. Plus sponsorship but obviously less kit costs.

 

From what I have been told it is at least £200 per point ( or above for the "top" riders ) in the Premier and £100 per point min. n the Championship. The extent to which their equipment costs are covered by sponsors obviously varies but again the higher averaged riders usually have more sponsors who cover a lot of kit.

 

I estimate that at leat 30% of riders are making a good living - at least 4x the average wage or double what most qualified people earn e.g. a teacher. Another 30 - 40% ( so around 75% of all riders in the UK ) are "making it pay" i.e. earning above the average wage for something they have chosen to do and enjoy. Thats's great! I have no complaint, they are heroes on track and still love to watch them in a good, close , exciting races. I just feel that some riders claim they "can't make it pay" without doubling up when it is likely that only 25% are failing to earn from speedway, at least the average wage. Even those not doubling up. Quite a number work for their sponsor or someone who is a fan of speedway in the winter, thus adding to their annual income.

 

Some do suffer equipment misfortune and of course some suffer from injury and that may mean that they are out of pocket for their efforts but it is a business for them and there are no guarantees of commercial success in business.

So you e gone from 6 point rider earning 250k to 8 ptvrider earning 150k. But your figures are still out.

Assuming the rider takes 5 heats per meeting, then from 30 top flight meetings at 200 quid a point they would earn 60k.

Assume they ride 35 2nd tier meetings at 150 a point then thats around 52k (or 35k if you use 100 per point)So 95-112k total.

Now, thats of course before u get to the fact that the likes of Harris and lambert, who most would consider to be among the top double uppers, averages below 8 in the PL. and of course that figure has extensive costs to come out.

Not saying riders cant make a living, but Id say its fantasy that any are making 250k from Britain alone.

[NeilWatson]

From what I have been told it is at least £200 per point ( or above for the "top" riders ) in the Premier and £100 per point min. n the Championship.

I suggest you listen to different people - your figures are nonsense.

[OldRacer]

Comparing gross income to a salary is naive and wrong.

 

Each rider is effectively running a small business throughout the season and the money earned is the business income. There are significant overheads from equipment, consumables, etc which must be covered before the rider as an individual sees a penny. It'd be interesting to know the ratio of 'staff' costs to other overheads. For example in my line of work, about a third of our business income goes on salaries. I would expect that motorsports would have much higher overheads so the ratio would be lower.

[waytogo28]

I suggest you listen to different people - your figures are nonsense.Perhaps some of the same kind of nonsense we hear from some promoters

Perhaps from the same kind of nonsense fountain which some promoters come out with time after time? And which seem to dominate the influential leaders within the BSPA. who are showing us the way to rebuild the sport of speedway. Along with a number of fans I talk to ( and others connected with one or two clubs ) and documents I have seen - we just wanted to shed some light on the matter that is never spoken of in the speedway press or on club websites etc. To be talked to in a condescending manner by someone who has helped an iconic club to be ground into the dust is a pity.

[Tsunami]

Perhaps from the same kind of nonsense fountain which some promoters come out with time after time? And which seem to dominate the influential leaders within the BSPA. who are showing us the way to rebuild the sport of speedway. Along with a number of fans I talk to ( and others connected with one or two clubs ) and documents I have seen - we just wanted to shed some light on the matter that is never spoken of in the speedway press or on club websites etc. To be talked to in a condescending manner by someone who has helped an iconic club to be ground into the dust is a pity.

BEEP BEEP BEEP. backing out backing out. You are, and were, way off with your assumptions. It has been explained that many think it is a, and should be, a private and personal matter, and you are now attacking a respected official of a club who has a good pedigree in the sport. Can I suggest you make your withdrawal from this subject as quiet as possible, before your make a total erse of yourself.

[Fromafar]

BEEP BEEP BEEP. backing out backing out. You are, and were, way off with your assumptions. It has been explained that many think it is a, and should be, a private and personal matter, and you are now attacking a respected official of a club who has a good pedigree in the sport. Can I suggest you make your withdrawal from this subject as quiet as possible, before your make a total erse of yourself.

 

Since you seem too know what the average rider earns why not just say, and it not really giving personal and private details of any particular individual .Instead off knocking the guy ,he is only asking a question that a good number of fans would be interested in.It just a bad to say that Promotions are losing Thousands a week if his figures are right.

[Tsunami]

Since you seem too know what the average rider earns why not just say, and it not really giving personal and private details of any particular individual .Instead off knocking the guy ,he is only asking a question that a good number of fans would be interested in.It just a bad to say that Promotions are losing Thousands a week if his figures are right.

That's not the point though is it. He is speculating with fantasy figures for his own purposes. They give everyone a false picture, just the same as 'the average' doesn't tell what the top earners get which is what he is also wanting to know. As I and others have said, why should the wages of riders be known, when it is a personal matter what deal a rider is on. 'What does a rider earn', then begs the question off what is paid to the rider by the promotion, and what and how much is he also getting in terms of a wage or a sponsorship from a sponsor. One riders earnings from his team doesn't corollate with another earnings of a fellow rider who might be part paid or on a guarantee. There are bigger things in Speedway to contend with than personal earnings.