Starting

[Baldyman]

 

Green light starts are long gone because drivers used to anticipate the green by going when the red lights went out, which is now the current procedure.

Okay okay I meant as it is now. Red lights on off.

[Sings4Speedway]

Personally react / anticipate the start is all fine with me as long as riders don't touch the tapes. The majority of the problems lay with the bikes not being close enough to the tapes to prevent rolling.

A second line was added (this year?) that the wheel spindle should be over and remain in that position until the tapes go up. However even if starters do call riders up over this line (and many don't) as soon as they walk away riders pull back onto the top of the rut then roll down just before the tapes move. Its this behaviour that needs to be stamped out to prevent constant movement at the starts & re-runs.

If a hard line was taken by either the referee or assistant start marshall it would be easy to stamp out if applied consistently. There would obviously be a couple of horrendous meetings at the start of the season getting all riders to stay put but once it became clear no movement would be tolerated the riders would mostly regulate themselves.

[Midland Red]

It really is a simple sport . . . . avoid knocking each other off . . . .

Not quite as simple as that - remember, according to Neil Muddlo, it's a "contact sport"

[Terry]

Giant greyhound traps.

No more digging around at the start. Traps open, riders fly out and the start girls then push it on to the centre green.

It's just crazy enough to work.

[Baldyman]

Trouble with allowing movement as long as don't touch tapes is..there is only one ref. He can't watch all 4 at same time. And they probably won't pick up the slightest of touches. So after a race a replay shows a rider did touch tapes..what then??? At least with a light going off its pretty obvious someone moved. Cos the light will stil be on and one of the riders isn't on the line anymore. Another problem with speedway and maybe one of its biggest, is most of the supporters live in the past and don't like change. And it's it's time for a change people.

 

If ya gonna stick to tapes, it should be any movement and you are out. No warning or anything. Once it hits the pocket the riders will soon learn to sit still.

[Midland Red]

Perhaps Hans Andersen could come up with a workable solution

Edited October 18, 2017 by Midland Red

[The White Knight]

Perhaps Hans Andersen could come up with a workable solution

Naughty.

[Robert Lee]

Trouble with allowing movement as long as don't touch tapes is..there is only one ref. He can't watch all 4 at same time. And they probably won't pick up the slightest of touches. So after a race a replay shows a rider did touch tapes..what then??? At least with a light going off its pretty obvious someone moved. Cos the light will stil be on and one of the riders isn't on the line anymore. Another problem with speedway and maybe one of its biggest, is most of the supporters live in the past and don't like change. And it's it's time for a change people.

 

If ya gonna stick to tapes, it should be any movement and you are out. No warning or anything. Once it hits the pocket the riders will soon learn to sit still.

I think there is confusion between movement before the start (after the green light is on) and anticipating the start. Movement was banned, I think, to prevent rolling starts, an entirely different issue to anticipating the tapes. Rolling gives a huge advantage because the bike is moving forward when the tapes go up. As long as the start marshal does his job and makes sure all four are not more than xmm from the tapes, then rolling is impossible unless they pull back a bit, which is exactly what they used to do. Pulling back is easy to spot, so then you line them up again once only - any movement after that means exclusion and no replacement rider.

Anticipating the start should not be an offence, it shows either lightning reactions or risk-taking, the risk being that they will break the tapes and be excluded.

[Baldyman]

If you allow anticipating, it's still open not ideal, ref will let some go that he thought were anticipated but were actually jumped and some pull back some for a jump that were not. Transponders are the best solution in my mind. Or a different way of starting races.

 

The worst ones are when a rider clearly mucks his start up and only hinders himself, but the ref stops it and gives him another go, does that happen in any other motor sport?? Not that I've seen.

Edited October 19, 2017 by baldyman

[balderdash&piffle]

If you allow anticipating, it's still open not ideal, ref will let some go that he thought were anticipated but were actually jumped and some pull back some for a jump that were not. Transponders are the best solution in my mind. Or a different way of starting races.

 

The worst ones are when a rider clearly mucks his start up and only hinders himself, but the ref stops it and gives him another go, does that happen in any other motor sport?? Not that I've seen.

Surely, anticipation is a real art it must be deemed as perfect judgement, any idea that a rider is not anticipating is total nonsense, if he did not anticipate, he would be left at the tapes.

[Baldyman]

What I said and mean is..someone will anticipate perfectly and will still be pulled back. So just use a bit of technology to help, it's not that difficult.

Edited October 19, 2017 by baldyman

[OveFundinFan]

Would transponders work on a speedway track though, what with different start positions even within a riders own "box"??

[Baldyman]

Each track has 14 and a box ..simple

 

 

Or just keep speedway in the dark ages...just as simple

Edited October 19, 2017 by baldyman

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

Surely, anticipation is a real art it must be deemed as perfect judgement, any idea that a rider is not anticipating is total nonsense, if he did not anticipate, he would be left at the tapes.

Anticipation is not an art it is pure luck.

[balderdash&piffle]

Anticipation is not an art it is pure luck.

To anticipate is part of a thought process, you take a judgement, some riders are good at it, some not so good. Luck is just hoping for the best and getting away with it.or not.

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

To anticipate is part of a thought process, you take a judgement, some riders are good at it, some not so good. Luck is just hoping for the best and getting away with it.or not.

Given that to anticipate the start the clutch is dropped before the rider knows the tapes will definitely rise then it is 'just hoping for best' and therefore luck.

 

The advantage the cheating rider has is that there is a very narrow window within which the tapes can rise so he has greater chance of getting away with it compared with a pure random tapes rise.

[Baldyman]

No one ever anticipates the quick release, only ever the the 2 or 3 second release

[uk_martin]

Surely the simple way to avoid tape jumping is to have all the riders line up with their front wheels actually touching the tapes.

 

All the problems now stem from the bikes being a foot or two behind the tapes giving "rolling room". Eliminate the "rolling room" and the possibilities of cheating are eliminated too. You could even back this up with a portable bar behind the back wheel that acts as a chock removes the possibility of rolling back forcing the riders to be absolutely stationary at the start.

[Baldyman]

You do realise with different rider set up the bikes are different lengths? Only matters about the bar obviously

Edited October 19, 2017 by baldyman

[uk_martin]

You do realise with different rider set up the bikes are different lengths? Only matters about the bar obviously

 

So you have 4 bars, or chocks, placed behind each rear wheel, each on a chord that allows them to be cleared off the track quickly and simply...it's not rocket science. And there's usually enough "helpers" at the start gate that could be engaged to help the start marshal with this task. You could even get brolly dolly's to choreograph something into their routines...who knows?