colin wood Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 37 minutes ago, foreverblue said: I would say there is every chance Poole's poles will outscore Belle Vue's one. They should do there's two of them! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 16 minutes ago, B.V 72 said: Yet he starts on a higher average than both Poole's Poles.Makes you realise that there is something not quite right about our beloved sport does it not. Well Belle Vue are never the first to announce their team so one would think that they do that to save money and get the riders they can afford. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil The Ace Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 29 minutes ago, foreverblue said: Well Belle Vue are never the first to announce their team so one would think that they do that to save money and get the riders they can afford. Couldn' be further from the truth. This team was signed and sealed months ago. But had to delay announcing anyone till now for a very good reason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B.V 72 Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 26 minutes ago, foreverblue said: Well Belle Vue are never the first to announce their team so one would think that they do that to save money and get the riders they can afford. Nothing to do with what clubs can and cannot afford.Its the fact that you yourself and most other fans think that Poole's 2 Poles are better than Drozdz yet the powers that be have given Drozdz a higher average than Poole's 2 Poles.If both Poole riders are better riders then in all fairness Drozdz should have been assessed lower that's what is wrong with the sport no matter what clubs the riders sign for. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 19 minutes ago, Phil The Ace said: Couldn' be further from the truth. This team was signed and sealed months ago. But had to delay announcing anyone till now for a very good reason They always delay the team announcements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyderd Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 1 hour ago, foreverblue said: I would say there is every chance Poole's poles will outscore Belle Vue's one. ummm, is that singuraly or combined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 13 minutes ago, B.V 72 said: Nothing to do with what clubs can and cannot afford.Its the fact that you yourself and most other fans think that Poole's 2 Poles are better than Drozdz yet the powers that be have given Drozdz a higher average than Poole's 2 Poles.If both Poole riders are better riders then in all fairness Drozdz should have been assessed lower that's what is wrong with the sport no matter what clubs the riders sign for. The two Poole poles have already achieved averages, Drozdz has to be assessed, the only way would be for all riders not riding here in 2017 to be assessed which would lead to another can of worms, both Poole and Belle Vue are taking a risk that they will perform above their averages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 1 minute ago, hyderd said: ummm, is that singuraly or combined. Singularly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyderd Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 fair enough, we'll just have to wait and see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevebrum Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 5 minutes ago, foreverblue said: The two Poole poles have already achieved averages, Drozdz has to be assessed, the only way would be for all riders not riding here in 2017 to be assessed which would lead to another can of worms, both Poole and Belle Vue are taking a risk that they will perform above their averages. Drodz is the only risk. The other 2 have improved massively in Poland since they were here in 2016. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyderd Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 1 hour ago, stevebrum said: Drodz is the only risk. The other 2 have improved massively in Poland since they were here in 2016. Maybe, but Poole's track is nothing like the polish tracks, if the track is better prepared for racing,like we all know it can be, then yes Poole should easily finish top this coming season. But if it remains bumpy and unpredictable then it could be a different conclusion.As I keep saying "time will tell" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aces High Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 How is this thread discussing Poole's poles yet again!!!! Anyway, pleased that the team has finally been announced. I hope Max can step into Bjerre's shoes, I think he will! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 11 minutes ago, Aces High said: How is this thread discussing Poole's poles yet again!!!! Anyway, pleased that the team has finally been announced. I hope Max can step into Bjerre's shoes, I think he will! Because a Belle Vue fan started discussing them again!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B.V 72 Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 1 hour ago, foreverblue said: The two Poole poles have already achieved averages, Drozdz has to be assessed, the only way would be for all riders not riding here in 2017 to be assessed which would lead to another can of worms, both Poole and Belle Vue are taking a risk that they will perform above their averages. Yes both Poole's Poles have averages and Drozdz has to be assessed fair enough but if most fans including yourself think that both Pooles Poles are better than Drozdz.Then why can't the powers that be see this and assess him lower than the 2 better Poles.It makes it that Belle vue are having to take more of a risk because with Drozdz assessed on a 5 they have had to sign a weaker reserve because of it.Making them a weaker team overall. So without being a blinkered Poole fan does that seem fair to you.All speedway fans want is fair play for everyone but the powers that be do not seem to have the common sense to give us that,and it is one of many reasons that fans get pd off with the sport. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grachan Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 8 minutes ago, B.V 72 said: Yes both Poole's Poles have averages and Drozdz has to be assessed fair enough but if most fans including yourself think that both Pooles Poles are better than Drozdz.Then why can't the powers that be see this and assess him lower than the 2 better Poles. For the same reason they assessed Martin Vaculik below Nick Morris and Jacob Thorsell. Whatever that reason is. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevebrum Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 43 minutes ago, hyderd said: Maybe, but Poole's track is nothing like the polish tracks, if the track is better prepared for racing,like we all know it can be, then yes Poole should easily finish top this coming season. But if it remains bumpy and unpredictable then it could be a different conclusion.As I keep saying "time will tell" Agree with that too, plus also both Poole Poles have had a year's experience on British tracks so are probably aware that preparation standards aren't as high as in the homeland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 1 hour ago, B.V 72 said: Yes both Poole's Poles have averages and Drozdz has to be assessed fair enough but if most fans including yourself think that both Pooles Poles are better than Drozdz.Then why can't the powers that be see this and assess him lower than the 2 better Poles.It makes it that Belle vue are having to take more of a risk because with Drozdz assessed on a 5 they have had to sign a weaker reserve because of it.Making them a weaker team overall. So without being a blinkered Poole fan does that seem fair to you.All speedway fans want is fair play for everyone but the powers that be do not seem to have the common sense to give us that,and it is one of many reasons that fans get pd off with the sport. Well yes i agree but there are plenty of things wrong with the assessment system and average system, it needs a complete re think in my opinion. Musielak is another example and promoters will continue to exploit the loopholes if they are allowed to do so. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topaz325 Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 Never mind the riders what about the tracks, Belle Vue one , Poole nil.....................unless they have ripped it up during the winter!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aces High Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 The rules and quality changes too much to recycle averages. If a rider rode in the league in the previous season they should retain their average. If they rode in the league below in the previous season they should have that average converted (1.3 currently seems ok). If they didn't ride in the UK in the previous season they should be re-assessed based on a clearly defined criteria to a round number (3.00,4.00,5.00,6.00,7.00,8.00 (Min for GP riders). It really shouldn't be that difficult. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Aces High said: The rules and quality changes too much to recycle averages. If a rider rode in the league in the previous season they should retain their average. If they rode in the league below in the previous season they should have that average converted (1.3 currently seems ok). If they didn't ride in the UK in the previous season they should be re-assessed based on a clearly defined criteria to a round number (3.00,4.00,5.00,6.00,7.00,8.00 (Min for GP riders). It really shouldn't be that difficult. There must be a 'mean average' % correlation for those riders who doubled up.... Therefore use that as the conversion figure.. Eg Last year Bomber was 8.44 PL and 7.63 EL therefore +10.6%.. Do that for every rider and then use the mean % increase.. Not ideal (what is when using such a system that is so easily manipulated as averages?) and there are many anomalies eg riding at reserve in the EL but second string in the PL etc, but it is surely a better system than making it up as you go along rider by rider? You can then benchmark new riders against their 'peers' based on riding in the same leagues abroad.. eg Bombers performance in Poland can be used allied to his British average to corelate more accurately any riders coming over who rode in the same Polish league as him last year... ie if Bombers average over here in the top league is 7.63 and a new rider rides in the same League in Poland and ran an average equal to Bomber then he comes in on a 7.63 average.. The more leagues that both riders race in in Europe the more those disparate figures are used to more accurately measure strengths.. Nothing is ever going to be totally accurate but at least it would be transparent.. Edited January 31, 2018 by mikebv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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