Refereeing Cock-up At Swindon V Belle Vue Ko Cup

[bigcatdiary]

It really is about time the BSPA and SCB got their heads together and sorted the rulebook out so anyone can read and understand it especially referees some of whom appear to not have a good working knowledge of the changes etc.

 

As far as I am concerned all Matches should be checked/scrutinised by the SCB and if any rules are broken then amendments are made to the result (statement of fact or otherwise).

 

I was under the impression the line ups website was implemented for team managers, referees and licensed officials to sort out these problems prior to the match day but it's very apparent problems still arise through neglect/misuse etc and it's clear that some referees are just not up to the job despite years in the position.

 

The problems often stem from promoters who come up with a addendum to a rule covering generally some other team exploiting it to get a result and instead of rewriting the said rule we get several amendments and variations covering numerous instances most of which can be interpreted to the advantage of others with a vested interest or those in authority.

 

Being honest a competent qualified referee and two team managers should be able to identify any problems before some supporters have to remind them via the internet that a situation is clearly contrary to the rules.

 

Bearing in mind the amount of plain mistakes that regular occur the SCB is clearly not up to the job, perhaps it should concentrate on the important end of the job rather than comments on social media which it now jumps on from a great height.

 

Craig Cook apparently assaulting an official during the SGBC Fours at Peterborough being a good example of yet another incident being brushed under the carpet.

Edited September 15, 2017 by bigcatdiary

[arnieg]

Didnt a Redcar rider have an illegal R/R ride or something vs Somerset last season? Although it was pointed out on here and it meant Somerset lost a league point they would have otherwise won the BSPA deemed it a "statement of fact" by the referee because Somerset had not appealed before the next heat?

I've spent the last hour trying to remember where and when this took place as I thought it was a relevant precedent.

 

Thanks

[lucifer sam]

Didnt a Redcar rider have an illegal R/R ride or something vs Somerset last season? Although it was pointed out on here and it meant Somerset lost a league point they would have otherwise won the BSPA deemed it a "statement of fact" by the referee because Somerset had not appealed before the next heat?

 

Not really the same.

 

That was to do with the hierarchical order of the team, and was agreed (wrongly) before the meeting. Nothing was agreed before the meeting last night, as to what replacement was allowed for an excluded rider in Heat 12!

 

BWD was ineligible for that race. That's the "statement of fact" in this case.

 

All the best

Rob

[racers and royals]

I imagine the SCB official (referee) wasn't aware either!! Maybe the rule book was delayed in the post?!

It was Barbara- and I thought you had a team manager as well

[theblueboy]

 

Not really the same.

 

That was to do with the hierarchical order of the team, and was agreed (wrongly) before the meeting. Nothing was agreed before the meeting last night, as to what replacement was allowed for an excluded rider in Heat 12!

 

BWD was ineligible for that race. That's the "statement of fact" in this case.

 

All the best

Rob

But rules are rules?

 

It cannot be decided which rules to apply just because an error was made pre-meeting.

 

Was the ref part of the decision that decided the riding order?

[foreverblue]

they were also using R/R and it all got a bit messy- the illegal guest took an illegal R/R or something like that- Matt Ford came up with a marvellous excuse for the cock-up saying he hadn`t attended the conference so wasn`t aware the rule had changed. !!!!!!

I wonder what Rosco`s excuse will be

I remember this meeting very well, Ty had a excellent night I believe and racked up a pile of points only for them all to be taken away because apparently Matt Ford who is supposed to know all the rules back to front didn't realise you weren't allowed 5 per cent extra at an away track. The crowd certainly knew there was a lot of chat in the pits and the end result was a resounding win for the pirates. The deduction didn't change the result as we won by so many but some argued quite rightly that if you take away from one side you should give the points to the other team but the rules do not allow that, they only allow for the deduction.

football now has goal line technology, if the ref makes a mistake, then the 4th official notifies him of the TV evidence and the correct decision is made.

 

Speedway is so far behind we shouldn't compare the 2 sports. If the ref made a mistake then his decision from that heat should stand until the BSPA say otherwise.

Yes shame it wasn't used when Lampard scored against Germany!

[racers and royals]

I remember this meeting very well, Ty had a excellent night I believe and racked up a pile of points only for them all to be taken away because apparently Matt Ford who is supposed to know all the rules back to front didn't realise you weren't allowed 5 per cent extra at an away track. The crowd certainly knew there was a lot of chat in the pits and the end result was a resounding win for the pirates. The deduction didn't change the result as we won by so many but some argued quite rightly that if you take away from one side you should give the points to the other team but the rules do not allow that, they only allow for the deduction.

I was there that night as well- as a neutral(well hoping Peterborough would win )

[waiheke1]

I don't doubt what you say and I fully acknowledge your superior knowledge of speedway, however, surely grachan has a point? If a ref makes a mistake, it is just that. I know results have been adjusted for varying reasons in speedway but it doesn't happen in other sports.

 

Maradonna's hand of God, Pedro Mendes effort v Man U. People edging the ball in cricket and not being given.

 

These are examples where the results are materially affected by officials making mistakes but results are allowed to stand, however, speedway seems to correct those mistakes.

 

Is this how it's always been? Given how other sports accept the position should Speedway follow suit?

Surely here though it is swindon who made the initial error in making an illegal substitution. I recall a rugby league game where the result was reversed as one team had 14 players on the field for 30 seconds. 2 points should be deducted and it's a farcical rule that the extra point aces could have scored is not added

[foreverblue]

I was there that night as well- as a neutral(well hoping Peterborough would win )

Those were the days!

[racers and royals]

Scorechart is up on BSPA website http://www.speedwaygb.co/17results/swindon_14.09.17_res.pdf and it`s plain as one can see that he`s missing a minimum ride !!!!

[SCB]

Surely here though it is swindon who made the initial error in making an illegal substitution. I recall a rugby league game where the result was reversed as one team had 14 players on the field for 30 seconds. 2 points should be deducted and it's a farcical rule that the extra point aces could have scored is not added

TBF, in this case if you take BWD 2 points away and leave it at that, or you take BWDs 2 away and move the other 2 riders up it means a 9 point win. It doesn't actually matter here. But I agree generally.

[lucifer sam]

Scorechart is up on BSPA website http://www.speedwaygb.co/17results/swindon_14.09.17_res.pdf and it`s plain as one can see that he`s missing a minimum ride !!!!

 

Not only that, but right hand bottom corner confirms that Jack Smith was medically signed out of meeting. Nothing about Musielak...

 

Quite clearly the rules have been broken here, and the referee allowed it to happen.

 

All the best

Rob

Edited September 15, 2017 by lucifer sam

[ouch]

This will be like the Poole tie when they broke the rules to beat us.

Any announcement will wait until after the second leg and should Swindon win the tie handsomely then the points will be deducted with a fanfare of how things have to be done properly.

If The Aces keep it too close for comfort then as with the play off final back then it will be ignored.

[racers and royals]

 

Not only that, but right hand bottom corner confirms that Jack Smith was medically signed out of meeting. Nothing about Musielak...

 

Quite clearly the rules have been broken here, and the referee allowed it to happen.

 

All the best

Rob

The 2N against Musielak in heat 12 would confirm the 2 min exclusion.

[dump that clutch]

i can't believe that a basic 3 ride rule has been missed... by the Ref and Mark Lemon... crazy.

[racers and royals]

i can't believe that a basic 3 ride rule has been missed... by the Ref and Mark Lemon... crazy.

Rosco hardly comes out of it smelling of roses either !!!!!

[Fromafar]

Who cares nowadays it's just a Circus ,people are just attending to watch some bike racing,to say it is aTeam sport is a myth .

[BurntFaceMan]

Rosco hardly comes out of it smelling of roses either !!!!!

 

Rosco is playing the game just like Matt Ford does. Sets us up nicely for some more epic rivalries between Poole and Swindon.

[SCB]

i can't believe that a basic 3 ride rule has been missed... by the Ref and Mark Lemon... crazy.

 

Rosco hardly comes out of it smelling of roses either !!!!!

You could argue it's not Rosco job to stop himself cheating Its for the referee and opposing team manager to stop!

[racers and royals]

The stupid thing in all of this, in my opinion is that a rider who is thrown out of a race for 2 starting offences CAN ACTUALLY BE REPLACED. If the rider had just been excluded and not replaced that would count as a ride. For messing about at the start why should they be replaced ?? it`s not as if we are going to have loads of 3 rider races because of it !!!!

Edited September 15, 2017 by racers and royals