Kings Lynn 2018..

[Daniel Smith]

So if the Sport gets dumed down even further.... It will cut costs ...that's a given but will it not also

 

1. Be at a lower admission price

2. Attract a smaller paying audience

3. No TV coverage ( payment)

4. Sponsorship levels for both rider and Club would drop.

5. Smaller crowds = less food and beverage sales etc

 

2. That's where the BSPA and all clubs owners need to actually do some work in the local communities to counteract No's 3, 4 & 5 and stop threatening and blaming fans for clubs closing down.

They have a responsibility to attract supporters, deliver a VFM product and work hard to maintain that support.

 

The days of "use it or lose it" threats are long gone as it's so much easier to find other thing's to do.

[Trees]

So if the Sport gets dumed down even further.... It will cut costs ...that's a given but will it not also

 

1. Be at a lower admission price

2. Attract a smaller paying audience

3. No TV coverage ( payment)

4. Sponsorship levels for both rider and Club would drop.

5. Smaller crowds = less food and beverage sales etc

 

Never mind all that Trees, I hear the local Tyre fitter is making a fortune where you are ..

OMG, how do you know??!!!!

[Halifaxtiger]

 

It doesn't matter if prices are put up.

 

Weaken the product, more fans will walk away. It seems the only idea the BSPA can ever come up with is.. weaken the product.

 

Its very easy to come on here and criticise a viewpoint regarding the future of speedway without actually stating what you would do to turn it around.

 

Reading the contents of this thread that is precisely what most - if not all - have done.

 

I don't agree with some of Jonathan's points but at least he has had the character to put something forward as a starting point.

Edited October 30, 2017 by Halifaxtiger

[spin king]

I recall a meeting which I believe was in the premier trophy in March 2007, where Kings Lynn Beat Sheffield 75-15

 

I remember that meeting well Alex, not because I was there, but was sitting in a Theatre that night watching a show, with my mobile (on silent) in my hand getting updates from a friend at the meeting. When he started texting, Heat 1. 5-1, Heat 2. 5-1, Heat 3. 5-1 and so on for every heat, I thought he was having a laugh. I texted back "stop being silly and post the proper score" he replied "That is the proper score!" Ah yes, remember it well.

 

And the strange thing at the end of season guess who dumped Kings Lynn out of the Play Off Semi Final.

 

Its like the old saying its not how you start its how you finish.

[semion]

OMG, how do you know??!!!!

EDP

[Hodgy]

Its very easy to come on here and criticise a viewpoint regarding the future of speedway without actually stating what you would do to turn it around.

 

Reading the contents of this thread that is precisely what most - if not all - have done.

 

I don't agree with some of Jonathan's points but at least he has had the character to put something forward as a starting point.

It’s not a criticism, it’s an opinionated response to a proposal. Isn’t that what forums are about? The counter response / opinion is clear, “weaken the product further will result in more fans walking away”.

 

You state “Its very easy to come on here and criticise a viewpoint regarding the future of speedway without actually stating what you would do to turn it around”. Is your post any different?

[semion]

 

And the strange thing at the end of season guess who dumped Kings Lynn out of the Play Off Semi Final.

 

Its like the old saying its not how you start its how you finish.

Two words Spin. Andrew Moore

[g13webb]

 

It doesn't matter if prices are put up.

 

Weaken the product, more fans will walk away. It seems the only idea the BSPA can ever come up with is.. weaken the product.

 

You must be a man with deep pockets to say it 'doesn't matter to put prices up'. You go on about fans walking away because the product is weaker, but the fact remains, fans stay away for many reasons, but cost and VFM would be the main protagonists views....

 

I was fortunate to attend many Wembley World Finals when 100k was the norm. Now we have the pleasure of a solitary meeting, in our wonderful stadium at Cardiff, yet we struggle to get 40k in attendance. If as you suggest we had a stronger league, the attendances would be of small increase but the cost would be sky high. The sport has to reach out for new fans. To do that we have to make it more attractive, we have to make it more affordable. Failing that they won't even come through the door.

 

If you asked Joe Bloggs in the street, whether he would prefer to see top riders at £20 a head or lesser riders at £10, he would always go for the cheapest option. Such is life....

[theblueboy]

 

You must be a man with deep pockets to say it 'doesn't matter to put prices up'. You go on about fans walking away because the product is weaker, but the fact remains, fans stay away for many reasons, but cost and VFM would be the main protagonists views....

 

I was fortunate to attend many Wembley World Finals when 100k was the norm. Now we have the pleasure of a solitary meeting, in our wonderful stadium at Cardiff, yet we struggle to get 40k in attendance. If as you suggest we had a stronger league, the attendances would be of small increase but the cost would be sky high. The sport has to reach out for new fans. To do that we have to make it more attractive, we have to make it more affordable. Failing that they won't even come through the door.

 

If you asked Joe Bloggs in the street, whether he would prefer to see top riders at £20 a head or lesser riders at £10, he would always go for the cheapest option. Such is life....

So I am giving you the choice, assuming you are a football fan. Swindon Town @ £25 or Chelsea @ £50? And explain why? Edited October 30, 2017 by theblueboy

[stevehone]

So I am giving you the choice, assuming you are a football fan. Swindon Town @ £25 or Chelsea @ £50? And explain why?

 

a bit of non-league football for a darn sight less than either!!

proper football without all the diving and cheating and ridiculous pay packets to the people that don't give a monkeys about the club they play for.

 

i grew up watching NL & BL speedway, and i really enjoyed the NL which, at that time, was for British and Commonwealth riders only.

the racing was excellent with plenty of continuity in the teams, local riders, local sponsors, and a great atmosphere.

 

with the point above, why would we be worse off making our way back to that sort of thing?

supporters will know who their team is, and i believe the double up/down issue and the cost are the main ingredients for keeping people away

[spin king]

Two words Spin. Andrew Moore

I think you maybe a little confused with your years.

 

Andy Moore left Sheffield in 2004.

 

Sheffield lined up for the match at Kings Lynn as follows;

 

Ricky Ashworth

Ben Wilson

Andre Compton

Paul Cooper

Joel Parsons

Jordan Frampton (Guest for James Birkinshaw)

James Cockle.

 

Sheffield had the same team apart from Birkinshaw rode for the 75- 15 loss.

[Hodgy]

You must be a man with deep pockets to say it 'doesn't matter to put prices up'. You go on about fans walking away because the product is weaker, but the fact remains, fans stay away for many reasons, but cost and VFM would be the main protagonists views....

 

I was fortunate to attend many Wembley World Finals when 100k was the norm. Now we have the pleasure of a solitary meeting, in our wonderful stadium at Cardiff, yet we struggle to get 40k in attendance. If as you suggest we had a stronger league, the attendances would be of small increase but the cost would be sky high. The sport has to reach out for new fans. To do that we have to make it more attractive, we have to make it more affordable. Failing that they won't even come through the door.

 

If you asked Joe Bloggs in the street, whether he would prefer to see top riders at £20 a head or lesser riders at £10, he would always go for the cheapest option. Such is life....

 

Wembley were one off World Championship Finals, Cardiff is a round in a GP series. Very different attractions - I anticipate Cardiff would attract +60k for a one off World Final.

 

As you say, it’s all about VFM. I do enjoy seeing the youngsters coming through but would also gladly pay £20 to watch Dudek, Bart, Doyle, Woffinden etc... race at Peterborough - as many Joe Bloggs would in my opinion. Yes I know, those days are long gone.

[BWitcher]

 

Its very easy to come on here and criticise a viewpoint regarding the future of speedway without actually stating what you would do to turn it around.

 

Reading the contents of this thread that is precisely what most - if not all - have done.

 

I don't agree with some of Jonathan's points but at least he has had the character to put something forward as a starting point.

 

I've stated many ways to turn it around, over and over and over.

 

The same conversation has been had at the end of EVERY SINGLE season since the advent of this forum and before. Every single time the answer has been the same.. "Cut the standard and the costs". Every single time it has failed miserably and simply made the problem worse.

So I am giving you the choice, assuming you are a football fan. Swindon Town @ £25 or Chelsea @ £50? And explain why?

 

Pointless asking these head in the sands.

 

They seem to live in a fantasy world where everyone would flock to see junior racing.

 

As someone who season after season travelled the length and breadth of the country to every single home and away meeting before moving abroad (although when I am in England I still do the same), should the standard be cut to the levels proposed, I would be done. That's one of the most committed fans there is. Not only that I know of many, many others who wouldn't be interested, those that haven't already walked that is.

[Trees]

EDP

Haha, panicked there, I've personally gotta have 4 new tyres this week as well haha

Fans Do Not want NL racing, Young Stars attracted 150/200 people maybe?

[mikebv]

I've stated many ways to turn it around, over and over and over.

 

The same conversation has been had at the end of EVERY SINGLE season since the advent of this forum and before. Every single time the answer has been the same.. "Cut the standard and the costs". Every single time it has failed miserably and simply made the problem worse.

 

Pointless asking these head in the sands.

 

They seem to live in a fantasy world where everyone would flock to see junior racing.

As someone who season after season travelled the length and breadth of the country to every single home and away meeting before moving abroad (although when I am in England I still do the same), should the standard be cut to the levels proposed, I would be done. That's one of the most committed fans there is. Not only that I know of many, many others who wouldn't be interested, those that haven't already walked that is.

Your views are an example of the dilemma the Sport faces....

 

Cut the quality, like it has done for years, and you a fan of many years, may walk away. For you bringing back the GP riders and subsequently paying more to watch isn't an issue..

 

However 99.9% of the population would struggle to name any GP rider, therefore trying to attract them to watch Speedway at the current admission fees is a complete non starter..

 

Those of us who follow the Sport can see paying £20 to watch Woffy v Doyle in a League match as VFM as we know who they are, their standing in the Sport, and what they can do..

 

99.9% of the population would simply look at the £20 admission and say "What?! £20 to get in and watch Speedway?!, Your'e having a laugh!"

 

Our answer of justification that "Woffinden and Doyle will be there" won't cut any ice at all..

 

For the vast proportion of the population, (if you can get them in) it wouldn't matter who was under the helmets as they wouldn't know who any of them were from Adam...

 

And the only way to get them in is by drastically lowering the admission costs..

 

Maybe the Sport will have to 'start again', unfortunately lose a few 'die hards' who remember 'how it was' but run itself on admission fees that attract many more 'newbies'?

 

And have riders salaries reflecting the Sports income and stature as well as their own individual standing in the wider 'World of Sport'?

 

Should three or four riders a meeting really be earning around a couple of grand a night each when their 'fame' has attracted just 500 people to watch?

 

I would say not...

Edited October 31, 2017 by mikebv

[Halifaxtiger]

It’s not a criticism, it’s an opinionated response to a proposal. Isn’t that what forums are about? The counter response / opinion is clear, “weaken the product further will result in more fans walking away”.

 

You state “Its very easy to come on here and criticise a viewpoint regarding the future of speedway without actually stating what you would do to turn it around”. Is your post any different?

 

I am wondering what the difference between an 'opinionated response' and 'criticism' is. Probably not much.

 

I think you are right that a forum is for comment, but the problem is that the overwhelming majority of posts simply say what speedway does not want or need without actually saying what it does and that highlights the BSPA's problem.

 

How can they devise something realistic going forward to suit the paying speedway when all they are faced with are opinions that say that any proposals are rubbish ?

 

How can speedway fans say they are being ignored when they don't actually come up with something that is workable ?

[g13webb]

So I am giving you the choice, assuming you are a football fan. Swindon Town @ £25 or Chelsea @ £50? And explain why?

 

Yes, I am an ardent football fan and was fortunate to have played for many years at a respectable level. To answer your question, of course I would like to go an watch Chelsea, but at £50 a time, it would only happen a special occasions. Swindon, at half the price would be more affordable to support each week, but then again, I've seen some terrific games at non-league level at a far cheaper option.

 

Many people on here, seem unaware of the tight financial restraints many of the public have to survive on. When the majority of people living in this area is earning less than £20k a year, paying £50 to watch your favourite team is way out of reach.

 

One of the biggest problems in our country is the divide between the high and low earners. It seems to get greater each year....

Edited October 31, 2017 by GRW123

[Halifaxtiger]

 

I've stated many ways to turn it around, over and over and over.

 

The same conversation has been had at the end of EVERY SINGLE season since the advent of this forum and before. Every single time the answer has been the same.. "Cut the standard and the costs". Every single time it has failed miserably and simply made the problem worse.

 

 

Then for my benefit - and in particular Jonathan's, because surely he has right of redress - I would ask that you do so again.

 

It says everything that your view has already attracted adverse comment.

 

 

 

 

a bit of non-league football for a darn sight less than either!!

proper football without all the diving and cheating and ridiculous pay packets to the people that don't give a monkeys about the club they play for.

 

i grew up watching NL & BL speedway, and i really enjoyed the NL which, at that time, was for British and Commonwealth riders only.

the racing was excellent with plenty of continuity in the teams, local riders, local sponsors, and a great atmosphere.

 

with the point above, why would we be worse off making our way back to that sort of thing?

supporters will know who their team is, and i believe the double up/down issue and the cost are the main ingredients for keeping people away

 

Very fair point .

 

If speedway fans cared only about the standard or riders, no-one would attend NL speedway. Yet they do, and in decent numbers.

 

Wasn't it the case that when Birmingham dropped from EL to NL they attracted bigger attendances ?

 

Doubling up is the single most important issue that needs addressing. Of my acquaintances across the country, even some of the most passionate have had enough of it and see it as a reason to walk away.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Halifaxtiger

[g13webb]

 

I've stated many ways to turn it around, over and over and over.

 

The same conversation has been had at the end of EVERY SINGLE season since the advent of this forum and before. Every single time the answer has been the same.. "Cut the standard and the costs". Every single time it has failed miserably and simply made the problem worse.

 

Pointless asking these head in the sands.

 

They seem to live in a fantasy world where everyone would flock to see junior racing.

 

As someone who season after season travelled the length and breadth of the country to every single home and away meeting before moving abroad (although when I am in England I still do the same), should the standard be cut to the levels proposed, I would be done. That's one of the most committed fans there is. Not only that I know of many, many others who wouldn't be interested, those that haven't already walked that is.

 

I too have travelled the length of the country following this sport. But just because I can afford this expense, doesn't blind me from the facts that many have great difficulty in affording these costs. As many as 25 people in my village alone, have stopped going to speedway like they once did. Too expensive, they said, Not enough racing and too many breaks. No atmosphere and little excitement said others. The appeal the sport once had has, over the years, been systematically destroyed

 

Obviously you meet up regularly with these people with their heads in the sand. Probably its time to look around and smell the coffee for what it actually is, instead of solely looking at ones own existence...

[waytogo28]

 

I too have travelled the length of the country following this sport. But just because I can afford this expense, doesn't blind me from the facts that many have great difficulty in affording these costs. As many as 25 people in my village alone, have stopped going to speedway like they once did. Too expensive, they said, Not enough racing and too many breaks. No atmosphere and little excitement said others. The appeal the sport once had has, over the years, been systematically destroyed

 

Obviously you meet up regularly with these people with their heads in the sand. Probably its time to look around and smell the coffee for what it actually is, instead of solely looking at ones own existence...

 

I too know at least 10 0r 12 people who were regulars and who travelled a long way to watch the Stars ( one from 70 mlies away ) The reasons highlighted above are exactly what they too said about their evaporating interest ( love affair really ) with speedway. And I am at that point too. Speedway in 2018 is not something that I am "lusting" for, which even five years ago I would have been. Partly through cost but mostly for those highlighted reasons!. The magic has faded and with Scott Nichols riding for both sides in the final of a major competition, that destroyed any credibility the sport had left. Thankfully the outside world doesn't know about such a farce or they would be falling over laughing.