Shockster Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 I understand the current rules state that riders have to sit still at the start and any movement can result in an unsatisfactory start and the race being stopped. This happens on far too many occasions and I agree with most people that if this rule is to persist then there should be no going back to the pits. It would still delay meetings though. However, why not let the riders move? Let them move as much as they want and if they get a flyer great stuff. We all watch meetings where certain gates are graves, well if they could move maybe it would be a leveller? If by moving though they touch the tapes then obviously they're out. No more unsatisfactory starts and the meetings would run more smoothly. Just a thought and apologies if this topic has been covered. I was reading the comments on the BT Coverage thread about meetings running over scheduled times and fans missing the ends of match. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 I understand the current rules state that riders have to sit still at the start and any movement can result in an unsatisfactory start and the race being stopped. This happens on far too many occasions and I agree with most people that if this rule is to persist then there should be no going back to the pits. It would still delay meetings though. However, why not let the riders move? Let them move as much as they want and if they get a flyer great stuff. We all watch meetings where certain gates are graves, well if they could move maybe it would be a leveller? If by moving though they touch the tapes then obviously they're out. No more unsatisfactory starts and the meetings would run more smoothly. Just a thought and apologies if this topic has been covered. I was reading the comments on the BT Coverage thread about meetings running over scheduled times and fans missing the ends of match. Remember the 1972 World Final, in particular, whereby some riders were so far back from the tapes that they were getting enormous flyers and the referee letting it go much to the bemusement of some that were present. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockster Posted July 5, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 Remember the 1972 World Final, in particular, whereby some riders were so far back from the tapes that they were getting enormous flyers and the referee letting it go much to the bemusement of some that were present. OK, to counter that possibility, simply paint a white line say 30cm behind the tapes and the front wheel must be on or infront of it or something to that effect. Certainly not impossible to stop massive rollers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racers and royals Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 They just need to do what they do in Poland- very very few false starts why ?? because the start marshall is continually checking with the ref that he is happy with how they line up- all 4 riders have to have the front wheel right on the tapes and if anyone moves back the start marshall is told by the ref to see to the rider !! One other thing they are hot on over there is that the rider on gate 4 must line up straight- not at an angle pointing to the inside. These 2 things means the starts are more often than not fair. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromafar Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 They just need to do what they do in Poland- very very few false starts why ?? because the start marshall is continually checking with the ref that he is happy with how they line up- all 4 riders have to have the front wheel right on the tapes and if anyone moves back the start marshall is told by the ref to see to the rider !! One other thing they are hot on over there is that the rider on gate 4 must line up straight- not at an angle pointing to the inside. These 2 things means the starts are more often than not fair.I noticed that regarding start marshal always checks with ref. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockster Posted July 5, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 I agree, it does seem to be better in Poland, but it's not always the case with the GP's. Is anybody actually AGAINST letting riders move at the start as long as there is NO tape touching? Should it be trialled? Personally I can't see a downside! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racers and royals Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 I agree, it does seem to be better in Poland, but it's not always the case with the GP's. Is anybody actually AGAINST letting riders move at the start as long as there is NO tape touching? Should it be trialled? Personally I can't see a downside! Yes i`m against riders moving -if allowed it would soon become a farce !!! 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromafar Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 I agree, it does seem to be better in Poland, but it's not always the case with the GP's. Is anybody actually AGAINST letting riders move at the start as long as there is NO tape touching? Should it be trialled? Personally I can't see a downside! Think there would be a lot of re-runs,and long drawn out meetings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockster Posted July 5, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 Yes i`m against riders moving -if allowed it would soon become a farce !!! Interesting. Why would it become a farce? As long as riders avoid the tapes they would be OK! Think there would be a lot of re-runs,and long drawn out meetings. Why do you think there would be a lot of re-runs? The reason for my question was to cut out re-runs due to unsatisfactory starts! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secsy1 Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 Anyone who watched the meeting at Vastervik last night and the referees decisions would have been shocked if it was a Premier ,Championship or National League meeting and same decisions. but what a great meeting and just getting on with racing. commendable refereeing in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racers and royals Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 (edited) Interesting. Why would it become a farce? As long as riders avoid the tapes they would be OK! Why do you think there would be a lot of re-runs? The reason for my question was to cut out re-runs due to unsatisfactory starts! It would be a farce because the refs would just hold the tapes even longer trying to catch them- in turn more exclusions and therefore delays Edited July 5, 2017 by racers and royals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockster Posted July 5, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 You may well be correct R&R and if so it would be counter productive. I do think it would be worth trialling in a few meetings though? Maybe in a track individual meeting with no "real" title at risk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 You may well be correct R&R and if so it would be counter productive. I do think it would be worth trialling in a few meetings though? Maybe in a track individual meeting with no "real" title at risk. I seem to recall that there was talk (and it may have been just that) of having someone hold a length of rope behind the bikes so as to stop them from moving back once the green light was activated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromafar Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 Interesting. Why would it become a farce? As long as riders avoid the tapes they would be OK! Why do you think there would be a lot of re-runs? The reason for my question was to cut out re-runs due to unsatisfactory starts! Do you really think there would be very little tape touching if the riders think they can roll? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockster Posted July 5, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 Do you really think there would be very little tape touching if the riders think they can roll? I think there may be more than normal to start with, but all changes no matter which sport need time to bed in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BangerBoy Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 I understand the current rules state that riders have to sit still at the start and any movement can result in an unsatisfactory start and the race being stopped. This happens on far too many occasions and I agree with most people that if this rule is to persist then there should be no going back to the pits. It would still delay meetings though. However, why not let the riders move? Let them move as much as they want and if they get a flyer great stuff. We all watch meetings where certain gates are graves, well if they could move maybe it would be a leveller? If by moving though they touch the tapes then obviously they're out. No more unsatisfactory starts and the meetings would run more smoothly. Just a thought and apologies if this topic has been covered. I was reading the comments on the BT Coverage thread about meetings running over scheduled times and fans missing the ends of match. Don't worry about apologies more people to read this so hopefully someone will get rid of this stupid rule as it is at the moment. Let's make it simple touch the tapes your out no questions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldywonkenoldi Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 As I have stated before, Why not get rid of tapes and use the method that BMX use, solid metal gate which lowers and all riders have to be touching the gate at the green light, then riders can do what they want, once it drops. Of course it would have to drop slightly below ground level so no obstruction. No touching tapes problem, no flyers, no exclusions, customers get what they have paid for, 4 riders per heat all off the same line, and as to cost, no more or less than air fences 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronScorpion Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 OK, to counter that possibility, simply paint a white line say 30cm behind the tapes and the front wheel must be on or infront of it or something to that effect. Certainly not impossible to stop massive rollers. shockstar, check You Tube clips of any heat from meetings this year & you will notice that there is a second line approx. 430mm behind the start line. This means that the front wheel axle should not be behind this line meaning the front wheel should be within the 75mm allowed from the tapes. This is still not fully enforced this year by the start marshalls resulting in the riders rocking back into the top of the groove to give them "rollers". There are a couple of topics elsewhere on new starting procedures. http://www.speedway-forum.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=71828&do=findComment&comment=2193302 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A ORLOV Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 (edited) As I have stated before, Why not get rid of tapes and use the method that BMX use, solid metal gate which lowers and all riders have to be touching the gate at the green light, then riders can do what they want, once it drops. Of course it would have to drop slightly below ground level so no obstruction. No touching tapes problem, no flyers, no exclusions, customers get what they have paid for, 4 riders per heat all off the same line, and as to cost, no more or less than air fences Sounds good but it would not take too long for the recess that the gate goes into to fill up with shale and stop the gates receding below the racing surface. If the clogging issue could be sorted then the start system might be good. What ever happens they have got to sort something out as most people are fed up with restarts. Edited July 5, 2017 by A ORLOV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bald Bloke Posted July 5, 2017 Report Share Posted July 5, 2017 As I have stated before, Why not get rid of tapes and use the method that BMX use, solid metal gate which lowers and all riders have to be touching the gate at the green light, then riders can do what they want, once it drops. Of course it would have to drop slightly below ground level so no obstruction. No touching tapes problem, no flyers, no exclusions, customers get what they have paid for, 4 riders per heat all off the same line, and as to cost, no more or less than air fences Good idea.I don't know if the rear tyres would grip on the metal gate and cause them to rear up.They would have to be able to be taken up for blading the track ect,but be solid so they don't move on the start., i would have thought. Deffo worth someone looking into it though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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