National League And The Advantages Or Disadvantages Of Having An Experienced Older Rider

[secsy1]

For many years particular clubs have fielded an experienced rider to help and encourage junior riders in their respective teams.

 

This is highly commendable and has helped many junior riders to progress through the ranks.

 

Unfortunately at some points certain clubs have not been able to include a senior/experienced rider due to politics.

 

An attitude of we will do it when it suits Us (Cos we can) seems to have been adopted.

 

At the beginning of the season several names were linked with various clubs, but all excluded for various reasons.

(We will do what we want cos we can brigade)

 

Maybe I have missed a topic?

 

Paul Hurry at Lakeside, not seen anyone moaning?

[marko]

I think having an older rider is not just about passing on knowledge, these teams like those above are a business and it has to remain attractive to fans therefore the side must be competitive, since you can't go abroad to strengthen then you must look at home to try and find ways of helping a weak team, the only way is to utilise experienced riders who are very much winding down in their careers.

 

Biggest problem the sport has and Ive been saying it for years is that it's too expensive to get into, not enough youngsters take it up because of costs, not only is there a shortage of riders in the top two leagues that means many riders ride in both we even have the situation where some riders like Zach W ride for two different teams at the same level albeit in different competitions.

 

We constantly hear riders saying they don't ride enough, why is this when before doubling up/down it was never an issue.

In the old National League riders would have had 30 to 34 league meetings a season and in between meetings they would have another job.

 

If there were youngsters knocking on the door to be riders then the current NL could be filled with riders under 25, once you get passed that age the chances of picking it up to a good level reduce unless your a John Louis.

[speedibee]

I think having an older rider is not just about passing on knowledge, these teams like those above are a business and it has to remain attractive to fans therefore the side must be competitive, since you can't go abroad to strengthen then you must look at home to try and find ways of helping a weak team, the only way is to utilise experienced riders who are very much winding down in their careers.

 

Biggest problem the sport has and Ive been saying it for years is that it's too expensive to get into, not enough youngsters take it up because of costs, not only is there a shortage of riders in the top two leagues that means many riders ride in both we even have the situation where some riders like Zach W ride for two different teams at the same level albeit in different competitions.

 

We constantly hear riders saying they don't ride enough, why is this when before doubling up/down it was never an issue.

In the old National League riders would have had 30 to 34 league meetings a season and in between meetings they would have another job.

 

If there were youngsters knocking on the door to be riders then the current NL could be filled with riders under 25, once you get passed that age the chances of picking it up to a good level reduce unless your a John Louis.

so if you don't have rich parents who also have the time to take you everywhere , and you reach 25 ,you should just take up bowls ? what about the lads who are happy to ride in the Nl and have no ambition to become professional riders , or the ones who are realistic enough to know that speedway is never going to pay the bills so it has to be fitted in with fulltime work . lets take them out as well . maybe the NL season could be run from the end of June till the end of August ,so as not to interfere with school terms , lets attract a lot of Kids Like Josh Bailley . or Jack Parkinson Blackburn , chuck a team place at them the minute they are 15 and have them burned out and quitting at 17 , or maybe lads like Chris Hay ,shaun Phillips , adam extance , cameron hoskins , james whyte williams , give them all teram places long before they are ready and when they are not GP standard in a few weeks , demoralise them by dropping them in favour of the next wonder kid .

[Moleman27]

The other point which has to be made is that many riders don't find speedway intill a later age, so what about those sort of riders. Do you just throw them straight in the Championship.

[GWC]

The National league has gone from a development league to a 3rd division and has become results driven.

So with averages ruling the roost you get teams with sacrificial riders when they have built a heavy top 3 so young and old make huge investment to score a couple of points in some cases, but they turn up and are available.

 

I went to Rye yesterday and saw 36 heats of kids and did show some have real talent on a bike but as mentioned it's allabout the finances and the best supported will more than likely succeed.

Edited June 12, 2017 by GWC

[marko]

Speedibee, what i would say is in an ideal world the NL would be full of youngsters all keen to try and make it as high as possible, the more we have the more chance of stabilising the British scene over the next decade, fact is we don't have anywhere near enough riders to do that.

It gets into a grey area but we really don't want is certain calibre of riders of a certain age taking places which could be filled by a promising youngster, now lets take Mr X and say he is 30 years old, good for maybe a four of five point average, only rides for a bit of fun, now he could still ride, there is a perfectly good amateur scene for that.

 

edit: of course though it all comes back to costs, the sport is too expensive to do properly as a hobby, although that should not be the case, the older riders should be able to have a skid without it costing them a fortune.

Edited June 12, 2017 by Claret73

[ruckerroo]

This is now a proper cut throat competitive league, results driven, age is immaterial,drury dugard , jolly , cook all wanna do as well as possible , others too.

[Sings4Speedway]

Speedibee, what i would say is in an ideal world the NL would be full of youngsters all keen to try and make it as high as possible, the more we have the more chance of stabilising the British scene over the next decade, fact is we don't have anywhere near enough riders to do that.

It gets into a grey area but we really don't want is certain calibre of riders of a certain age taking places which could be filled by a promising youngster, now lets take Mr X and say he is 30 years old, good for maybe a four of five point average, only rides for a bit of fun, now he could still ride, there is a perfectly good amateur scene for that.

 

edit: of course though it all comes back to costs, the sport is too expensive to do properly as a hobby, although that should not be the case, the older riders should be able to have a skid without it costing them a fortune.

 

However what we have got at present is a league full of plenty of riders that were put in because they were the "correct" age and have levelled out into being NL standard riders only and will never be any more. There are some that have had 5,6,8 season in the Nl and never progressed but have averages that fit so keep getting included.

The other issue i have is with promising youngsters getting a place over a rider of higher ability but who is older than the preferred age bracket. Why can they not continue in the amateur leagues until they have improved sufficiently? In my opinion if you are good enough you are in age, fashionable backgrounds (Moto X, Grasstrack, skateboarding etc) should not come into it.

[Halifaxtiger]

This is now a proper cut throat competitive league, results driven, age is immaterial,drury dugard , jolly , cook all wanna do as well as possible , others too.

 

To an extent, it has to be. People will not pay to watch a training league so it must be attractive enough to make them cough up the entrance fee. NL speedway, for the most part, is a business.

 

For that reason, I have a degree of sympathy with the likes of Stoke, for example, who have tracked a team that has a lot more older riders than some might consider necessary. Truth is, there just aren't enough young riders of sufficient standard to go round so they either put those who are not ready or capable in or older ones get team places. The need to win means that the latter is more preferable.

 

I would maintain that the NL is still packed with the very best youngsters we have and that the present situation is a very good compromise between development and staying in the black.

 

I also have no difficulty with senior riders - and by that I mean those over 35 - taking a team place. See if you can find a criticism of Jon Armstrong, for instance, anywhere.

 

The NL's problem is not senior riders. It is crooked, unjustifiable and unjustified decisions that allow riders to ride or prevent them from doing so made by unnamed and irresponsible persons. Its been shocking this season.

[Sings4Speedway]

NL is a business & and an expensive one so no complaints there. Sadly over the years teams have become mis-matched due to multiple reasons (points money, location, day of week run on etc) i like many enjoy watching entertaining speedway between two closely matched teams regardless of the result. Hence why i am picking and choosing which matches i attend this season as a 60+ home win is not value in my eyes.

If two teams turned up and both had 3 pointers from 1-7 i would still be happy as long as the racing was even & entertaining.

[allthegearbutnaeidea]

Atkin, Hurry and Armstrong along with the likes of Boxall, Smart, Cockle, Bowen, Wilson, Compton, Campos and Hopwood will be very valuable riders to have in the team I would imagine, any others?

Edited June 12, 2017 by allthegearbutnaeidea

[Sidney the robin]

To an extent, it has to be. People will not pay to watch a training league so it must be attractive enough to make them cough up the entrance fee. NL speedway, for the most part, is a business.

 

For that reason, I have a degree of sympathy with the likes of Stoke, for example, who have tracked a team that has a lot more older riders than some might consider necessary. Truth is, there just aren't enough young riders of sufficient standard to go round so they either put those who are not ready or capable in or older ones get team places. The need to win means that the latter is more preferable.

 

I would maintain that the NL is still packed with the very best youngsters we have and that the present situation is a very good compromise between development and staying in the black.

 

I also have no difficulty with senior riders - and by that I mean those over 35 - taking a team place. See if you can find a criticism of Jon Armstrong, for instance, anywhere.

 

The NL's problem is not senior riders. It is crooked, unjustifiable and unjustified decisions that allow riders to ride or prevent them from doing so made by unnamed and irresponsible persons. Its been shocking this season.

Hurry aloud back on a dodgy figure yet Richard Hall was shafted.

[speedibee]

Atkin, Hurry and Armstrong along with the likes of Boxall, Smart, Cockle, Bowen, Wilson, Compton, Campos and Hopwood will be very valuable riders to have in the team I would imagine, any others?

Hopwoods only 25

[secsy1]

Hurry aloud back on a dodgy figure yet Richard Hall was shafted.

 

At the beginning of the season several names were linked with various clubs, but all excluded for various reasons and as you mentioned excluded but Hurry straight in. Why?

[Sidney the robin]

At the beginning of the season several names were linked with various clubs, but all excluded for various reasons and as you mentioned excluded but Hurry straight in. Why?

Only in speedway the rules are a joke they are there to be manipulated.

[arnieg]

It should be remembered that in it's founding season (as BL3) the league included riders such as Kevin Teager, Glyn Taylor and Gary O'Hare. The mix of youngsters, veterans and riders with modest ability (who are vital to the functioning of the league) is much as it always was.

 

What has changed is the number of ex-EL promotions that are now operating at this level. They have different cost bases and different operating philosophies. Not to say they are wrong, but they need to be understood and accommodated without jeopardizing the viability of the likes of Buxton and Mildenhall.

[East End Fan]

Those on this thread who have made the comment that "Speedway is a business" are spot on. I am a great fan of the National League and am not at all concerned about the

age or experience of any of the riders. Providing they all ride as hard as they can, I am happy. The only adverse comment I would make is that there are a number of younger

riders in teams who are far from ready. But that is caused by the shortage of new talent. For some reason ( probably money !), although Neil Vatcher is doing a great job with

the Youth scene, it does not produce that many riders able to hold down a team place. As to the comment by Sidney The Robin, the rules have always been manipulated by

certain promoters from way back years ago. Those that remember the late Ian Thomas will know what I mean.

[Sings4Speedway]

Those on this thread who have made the comment that "Speedway is a business" are spot on. I am a great fan of the National League and am not at all concerned about the

age or experience of any of the riders. Providing they all ride as hard as they can, I am happy. The only adverse comment I would make is that there are a number of younger

riders in teams who are far from ready. But that is caused by the shortage of new talent. For some reason ( probably money !), although Neil Vatcher is doing a great job with

the Youth scene, it does not produce that many riders able to hold down a team place. As to the comment by Sidney The Robin, the rules have always been manipulated by

certain promoters from way back years ago. Those that remember the late Ian Thomas will know what I mean.

 

Only takes a quick look at the old green sheets to see the number of riders who have stepped away either due to finances or mostly because they were included in teams way too soon and became disillusioned with the sport and have stepped away. Almost the whole starting 1-7 of the 2014 Scunthorpe side are no longer riding.

Its great developing new talent but pointless if they cannot be retained.

[East End Fan]

IMO far more clubs should enter teams in the Area Development Leagues and I am disappointed that Lakeside do not have a team in the new SDL. Our

reserves Connor Locke and Jamie Cousins would gain huge benefit from it. Probably down to money even though riders are not paid but I think that a bit

of real effort on the part of Jon and Kelvin would overcome whatever problems there are. Long term for the club can only be beneficial.

[guitar_art]

We will let you know.