stevebrum Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Not usually... Ten out of the 20 races pre Semi and Final in the 20 heats were won from gate one.. However six of these ten were won by riders who reached the final so any gate advantage was probably enhanced by their capability on the night.. And possibly enhanced even more by the quality of some of the riders alongside them in gates two to four, as almost half the field scored six or less and (for some), were clearly out of their depth... I think the obvious disparity in standard meant a 'good rider' on gate one had a clear advantage rather than just being on gate one itself.. Hopefully to improve the overall spectacle next year, Lamberts transport issue will be sorted, Woffy may decide to compete once more and who knows, Holder, Doyle and Lindgren may suddenly become British!! That's a fair explanation. Thought it was a little odd as hadn't noticed that before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 "Put him in"?????? This is supposed to be a professional sporting competition, not an all-star invitational event No wonder outsiders don't take speedway very seriously any longer You suggest that "The British Championship Final", for which there were two qualifying meetings, should be an "opportunity to help push forward the career of a bright young talent" Shame on you - yes, shame on you as a long-standing mouthpiece of this once great sport Oh, and not arriving at a meeting due to delays for whatever reason, is not an exceptional circumstance - it's happened before and no doubt will again - it's tough on the rider affected, but you've got to be in it to qualify, so, better luck next time Are u forgetting that every other major speedway nation DOES seed riders to their national final? Frankly it seems common sense. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Max Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Are u forgetting that every other major speedway nation DOES seed riders to their national final? Frankly it seems common sense. I think there is a big difference between seeding better riders to a national final and then having qualifiers to fill up the meeting, as opposed to running qualifiers and then seeding some of those who didn't qualify. personally I wouldn't have an issue with seeding 4/6/8 riders and running one qualifying semi - sadly we don't really have enough quality riders to justify any more. Likewise I wouldn't have an issue with this years system and leaving two wildcard places, primarily aimed at anyone who was injured at time of semis, or who had to ride in GP qualifier, or someone who was unavoidably delayed (eg big smash on motorway, national news, queues for miles delays for hours - not I've broken down!). If no one needed wildcards give them to the highest non qualifying scorers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavan Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Are u forgetting that every other major speedway nation DOES seed riders to their national final? Frankly it seems common sense. It is common sense i agree and i feel we should have wildcards. But this season there was no wildcards..........and the correct thing to do was stick to that and when riders dropped out those in the qualifiers were put in, and not somebody who hadnt done them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CookieIpswich Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 From a commercial point of view what a disgrace the British Final was 1. I don't think I saw any track branding for Integro as the main sponsor 2. Hardly any mentions via the presentation team, more mentions of rory being Australian!!! 3. The back drop where riders were interviewed was dreadful, then when seen in the background during normal presentation it was just hanging off the side of the pits, very poor 4. No branding on the on screen graphics Why on earth did they sponsor the meeting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sommelier Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Why? He missed a qualifier so in no way should he have been allowed to ride in the final.. When riders dropped out , he quite rightly wasnt allowed in the final at the expense of the riders who had rode in the semi finals. The rules were the top 8 from the 2 semi finals................im in favour of there being 2 wildcards.......but this year there wasnt. Im a big fan of Lambert but you cant have different rules for different riders, based on ability. As it happened 1 of the replacements came 4th and was pretty much the rider of the night Another good post regarding the meeting Why, ill tell you why. Just take a look how his parents had to sacrifice so much time & effort & not to mention the tens of thousands they spent for him to pursue his career in Germany when OUR governing body didn't allow him to ride. Fair play to him staying LOYAL to White Tigers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghosty Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Who are the people who decided that Dan Bewley was to good to be a track reserve? You should hold your head in shame, what better experience for the future to have been part of this meeting & even showcase his undoubted talent! WELL DONE to everyone involved in putting on a suburb meeting (& congratulations Craig Cook) can Matt Ford follow that for the next domestic BT Sport production? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cheese Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Well done to Cook, no reason now why he can't go that next step and become a GP rider. He has the quality to do it, maybe not pushing for the title but certainly to compete at that level. I'm sure it was only a few years ago when they stopped seeding riders to the final, which I guess was partly down to allowing the opportunity for supporters to see the top riders at different tracks. Now we have the best not riding and pretty much everyone else doubling-up it's not needed so much. And at least 1 wildcard is needed just in case, it's possible that next year Cook for example could have 6 points from 2 rides in the semi-final and then gets injured through no fault of his own and has to miss the rest of that meeting. And the decision to not allow Bewley to ride as reserve is a complete joke. How can he be too good? Does that mean the reserves are there but have to be poor enough to not take points off anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromafar Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Who are the people who decided that Dan Bewley was to good to be a track reserve? You should hold your head in shame, what better experience for the future to have been part of this meeting & even showcase his undoubted talent! WELL DONE to everyone involved in putting on a suburb meeting (& congratulations Craig Cook) can Matt Ford follow that for the next domestic BT Sport production? Watching the meeting it might have been embarrassing watching Dan beating some of these riders,Standard was poor outside top 1/2 dozen and even a couple of them were not that good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sommelier Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Well done to Cook, no reason now why he can't go that next step and become a GP rider. He has the quality to do it, maybe not pushing for the title but certainly to compete at that level. I'm sure it was only a few years ago when they stopped seeding riders to the final, which I guess was partly down to allowing the opportunity for supporters to see the top riders at different tracks. Now we have the best not riding and pretty much everyone else doubling-up it's not needed so much. And at least 1 wildcard is needed just in case, it's possible that next year Cook for example could have 6 points from 2 rides in the semi-final and then gets injured through no fault of his own and has to miss the rest of that meeting. And the decision to not allow Bewley to ride as reserve is a complete joke. How can he be too good? Does that mean the reserves are there but have to be poor enough to not take points off anyone? Totally agree regarding Bewley, British Speedway run by clowns Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midland Red Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Why, ill tell you why. Just take a look how his parents had to sacrifice so much time & effort & not to mention the tens of thousands they spent for him to pursue his career in Germany when OUR governing body didn't allow him to ride. Fair play to him staying LOYAL to White Tigers That doesn't give him the right to be "put in" to the final round of a championship because his van (or whatever) broke down before a qualifying round Can you not see - it's a championship, there were qualifying stages, and Lambert failed to get through them - it's not an invitational open meeting to choose the "best riders" to take part Although I don't like the idea of wildcards, I would accept seeding the top four Brits to the final, with 12 qualifying from semi-finals - but never "put in" a rider who has been eliminated in the way Lambert was I'm interested to know the overall views on having heats 21/22 in this event (or 21-23 if there's two semis) There's been support for the idea in the past on the forum (supposedly it's a tv thing, to build up to a climax at the end of the meeting) - would this have remained had Worrall, Schlein or Barker won heat 22 last night, thereby eliminating Cook from the GP wildcard spot? I have always said that any meeting of 16 riders should be decided over 20 heats, top scorer the winner - although I'm very pleased Cook, the best rider, won the final last night, in some ways I was hoping he wouldn't, just to see the reaction on here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sommelier Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 That doesn't give him the right to be "put in" to the final round of a championship because his van (or whatever) broke down before a qualifying round Can you not see - it's a championship, there were qualifying stages, and Lambert failed to get through them - it's not an invitational open meeting to choose the "best riders" to take part Although I don't like the idea of wildcards, I would accept seeding the top four Brits to the final, with 12 qualifying from semi-finals - but never "put in" a rider who has been eliminated in the way Lambert was AND can you not see there aint to many Lamberts about, I couldn't give a flying fu+k about rules, just wish to see the best ENGLISH & yeh not British riders we have in the BF, Did you enjoy the meeting last night ? Wish I knew you were going, could have had a little meet up!!!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aces51 Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 (edited) There were Integro banners on the back straight and of course on the race jackets. Whether BT showed the banners or mentioned the sponsors is a matter for BT and not something the BSPA can control. The track staff deserve praise for preparing a track which provided many racing lines and no dust. A rare feat after a couple of really hot days. A very enjoyable meeting, there was an excellent atmosphere in the grandstand, some good racing with plenty of genuine passes although not as good as some of the best meetings we have seen at the NSS. Cook was a deserved winner and really seems to have made a significant step up the ladder this year. Also good see Steve Worrall doing so well in such an important meeting. Sad see that Chapman apparently decided that Bewley, one of the programmed reserves, was too good and denied him the opportunity. He is 18, has been racing for a little over 12 months. A missed opportunity give an outstanding British prospect the chance learn from the experience of being part of a prestigious event. Edited June 20, 2017 by Aces51 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CookieIpswich Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 The BSPA have control over it and have once again failed 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 I'm interested to know the overall views on having heats 21/22 in this event (or 21-23 if there's two semis) There's been support for the idea in the past on the forum (supposedly it's a tv thing, to build up to a climax at the end of the meeting) - would this have remained had Worrall, Schlein or Barker won heat 22 last night, thereby eliminating Cook from the GP wildcard spot? I have always said that any meeting of 16 riders should be decided over 20 heats, top scorer the winner - although I'm very pleased Cook, the best rider, won the final last night, in some ways I was hoping he wouldn't, just to see the reaction on here! I hate this semi-final and final nonsense. All the riders race each other over 20 heats and the top points scorer is the winner..job done. I'm not a fan of the play-offs either, but I guess that's for another thread. Fair enough having a grand final in the gp series because it's always been that way. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Would not be surprised one little bit if Lambert turns his back totally to ANY commitment in GB next year Why do you say that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob B Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Is this usual for the NSS to have gate 1 so dominant? No very unusual in fact it's normally a slight disadvantage especially later in meetinfnwhen dirt lives out as riders on gate 1 often get trapped on inside kerb. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 There were Integro banners on the back straight and of course on the race jackets. Whether BT showed the banners or mentioned the sponsors is a matter for BT and not something the BSPA can control. The track staff deserve praise for preparing a track which provided many racing lines and no dust. A rare feat after a couple of really hot days. A very enjoyable meeting, there was an excellent atmosphere in the grandstand, some good racing with plenty of genuine passes although not as good as some of the best meetings we have seen at the NSS. Cook was a deserved winner and really seems to have made a significant step up the ladder this year. Also good see Steve Worrall doing so well in such an important meeting. Sad see that Chapman apparently decided that Bewley, one of the programmed reserves, was too good and denied him the opportunity. He is 18, has been racing for a little over 12 months. A missed opportunity give an outstanding British prospect the chance learn from the experience of being part of a prestigious event. Buster doesn't make these decisions on his own, it's a committee isn't it and it was something to do with his average being too good, obviously a rule and they stuck to it just as they did with not squeezing Lambert in ........ Why, ill tell you why. Just take a look how his parents had to sacrifice so much time & effort & not to mention the tens of thousands they spent for him to pursue his career in Germany when OUR governing body didn't allow him to ride. Fair play to him staying LOYAL to White Tigers We couldn't change the rules for under 16s just for Robert ........ his family have been uber supportive and still are, he's been a lucky guy tbh and is now reaping the rewards all round and it's great Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevebrum Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 No very unusual in fact it's normally a slight disadvantage especially later in meetinfnwhen dirt lives out as riders on gate 1 often get trapped on inside kerb. Thanks Rob, I thought it was unusual. Just wanted to make sure that I hadn't dreamt riders winning from any gate in other meeting at the NSS! Plus the disparity of riders on show meant that some of the racing, particularly in the first half, was more processional than usual. No slight on the track you understand as the good heats delivered as expected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GiveusaB Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Would 've loved to see Lambert and Bewley in the starting line-up .....BSPA destroying British speedway again.... Good luck to Cooky in Cardiff....hope he finishes as the top BRIT ! Worral and Barker should be Cardiff Reserves....complete farce if Schlein is listed !? Cooks cut back in his 3rd ride? was a sign of his 'improvement/maturity' ! class move! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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