waiheke1 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Thank you. Times have changed.No problem. Obviously the theory about monkeys, typewriters and Shakespeare is true... Probably because we were taught about Sportsmanship and Fair Play from a young age. Something, I am sad to say, that is lacking in Sport these days. Says the man who would return to speedway if they replaced the double points ride with the patently more unfair tactical sub rules of old?As I keep re-itereating the title in Football is decided by whoever finishes top. The Play-Offs determine who gets promoted and relegated...not to decide the winners. However I realise that money and TV coverage is the fundamental issue...just trying to clarify matters in that Football and Speedway differ in its objectives.a minute ago you were clarifying, now you are reiterating?As orion says, football doesn't need play offs as clubs have something to play for - 2nd to 4th champs league, 5th 6th Europe league, avoiding bottom 3 relegation spots, plus every place gained in the league is worth something like a million quid. Almost every other major sport uses playoffs - rugby, league, most cricket comps, nba, nfl, nhl etc. And of course football in many non European countries. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Who is breaking a sportmanship and fair play ? everyone knows the rules before the start of the season . Aaaahhhhh yes - the usual mantra. What does knowing the Rules beforehand have to do with Sportsmanship or Fair Play? Answer - absolutely nothing. Fair Play and Sportsmanship is the way, the spirit in which the Game is played/run. Perhaps once you understand that you will cease from trotting out the same tired and hackneyed old mantra again and again. Unless, of course, you condone the League Champions not being the League Champions. To me that is neither Sporting nor Fair Play. No problem. Obviously the theory about monkeys, typewriters and Shakespeare is true... Says the man who would return to speedway if they replaced the double points ride with the patently more unfair tactical sub rules of old? a minute ago you were clarifying, now you are reiterating? As orion says, football doesn't need play offs as clubs have something to play for - 2nd to 4th champs league, 5th 6th Europe league, avoiding bottom 3 relegation spots, plus every place gained in the league is worth something like a million quid. Almost every other major sport uses playoffs - rugby, league, most cricket comps, nba, nfl, nhl etc. And of course football in many non European countries. For goodness sake read my Posts - I have never, ever Posted that. If you are going to pull me up for something at least make sure of your facts. I defy you to find anywhere I have said that. I have said that I would prefer Speedway without either the Tactical Ride or the Tactical Substitute. I would get rid of both as I have constantly said. To your final point - it doesn't make it right though - no matter how many Sports do it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) Aaaahhhhh yes - the usual mantra. What does knowing the Rules beforehand have to do with Sportsmanship or Fair Play? Answer - absolutely nothing. Fair Play and Sportsmanship is the way, the spirit in which the Game is played/run. Perhaps once you understand that you will cease from trotting out the same tired and hackneyed old mantra again and again. Unless, of course, you condone the League Champions not being the League Champions. To me that is neither Sporting nor Fair Play. For goodness sake read my Posts - I have never, ever Posted that. If you are going to pull me up for something at least make sure of your facts. I defy you to find anywhere I have said that. I have said that I would prefer Speedway without either the Tactical Ride or the Tactical Substitute. I would get rid of both as I have constantly said. To your final point - it doesn't make it right though - no matter how many Sports do it. Lol and you don't churn out the same stuff on this subject all the time ?the irony ....no one is league champions because they come top of the league as the rules that everyone knows before say so .so knowing the rules before hand has everything to do with sportsmanship and fair play as like any other sport or game sticking to rules is a massive part of that ...so to sum it up people who stick to the rules have no fair play or sportsmanship ? For goodness sake read my Posts - I have never, ever Posted that. If you are going to pull me up for something at least make sure of your facts. I defy you to find anywhere I have said that. You said it on here about 20 times ...everyone knows that Edited January 22, 2017 by orion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Fwiw I agree that a league system is a fairer way to determine the champs. Just not commercially viable. Funny though that advocates of the league structure to determine champs are generally those opposed to the GPs as a method of determining the world champ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) No problem. Obviously the theory about monkeys, typewriters and Shakespeare is true... Says the man who would return to speedway if they replaced the double points ride with the patently more unfair tactical sub rules of old? a minute ago you were clarifying, now you are reiterating? As orion says, football doesn't need play offs as clubs have something to play for - 2nd to 4th champs league, 5th 6th Europe league, avoiding bottom 3 relegation spots, plus every place gained in the league is worth something like a million quid. Almost every other major sport uses playoffs - rugby, league, most cricket comps, nba, nfl, nhl etc. And of course football in many non European countries. ...yes I was re-iterating what I was trying to clarify! Edited January 22, 2017 by steve roberts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Aaaahhhhh yes - the usual mantra. What does knowing the Rules beforehand have to do with Sportsmanship or Fair Play? Answer - absolutely nothing. Fair Play and Sportsmanship is the way, the spirit in which the Game is played/run. Perhaps once you understand that you will cease from trotting out the same tired and hackneyed old mantra again and again. Unless, of course, you condone the League Champions not being the League Champions. To me that is neither Sporting nor Fair Play. For goodness sake read my Posts - I have never, ever Posted that. If you are going to pull me up for something at least make sure of your facts. I defy you to find anywhere I have said that. I have said that I would prefer Speedway without either the Tactical Ride or the Tactical Substitute. I would get rid of both as I have constantly said. To your final point - it doesn't make it right though - no matter how many Sports do it. You've been asked outright if you would return to speedway if they got rid of double points and returned to the old tac subs and answered that you would. I'm not going to dig through to find it but can assure you you did.I agree that you have consistently stated that you would prefer neither to be in place. Perhas the fact that all those other sports use play offs indicate commercial realities, which would also indicate that it is what fans want. I agree that mass appeal does not neccesarily correlate to "fairness." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruffdiamond Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 'The don't make them like they used to' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Lol and you don't churn out the same stuff on this subject all the time ?the irony ....no one is league champions because they come top of the league as the rules that everyone knows before say so .so knowing the rules before hand has everything to do with sportsmanship and fair play as like any other sport or game sticking to rules is a massive part of that ...so to sum it up people who stick to the rules have no fair play or sportsmanship ? You said it on here about 20 times ...everyone knows that Do you ever actually read your Posts before Posting them? If you did you may Post something that folk can understand. Regarding the highlighted part of your Post - obviously wkha1 didn't or he would not have Posted as he did. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Lol ..he already posted that hes not going to trawl into yours posts to find when you said that ..thou i reckon its about 20. Even by your double standards its a poor lie . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolcol Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 stillbreathing lolol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pieman72 Posted February 10, 2017 Report Share Posted February 10, 2017 (edited) Taking into account the fragile situation regarding teams stadiums and supporters in the premier league I really do hope speedway can survive. There has been a lot of talk about new idea's and changes to put the sport on a firmer footing but as yet it's still only a makeover. I definintely think individuals and organisations are sitting on their hands and hoping that everything will work out. Seriously unless something radical is done I very much fear for the future. The 'normal' fan is just not coming through the turnstiles and we have to find a a way to attract him and her to watch the sport as without revenue the sport will not be viable. It was revived in the 60's and I'm sure it can be done again but it has to be something different from the norm. Edited February 10, 2017 by Pieman72 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moxey63 Posted February 10, 2017 Report Share Posted February 10, 2017 (edited) Too much to do in modern life, too little time, not enough cash. Speedway, a lot because of the way it's run and what you gain for your turnstile cash, it's slipped down the pecking order, like so many other things. Video killed the radio star, DVD did for the VHS.... Technology waits for no man, and speedway just seems a little dated. Edited February 10, 2017 by moxey63 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waytogo28 Posted February 10, 2017 Report Share Posted February 10, 2017 Three things in this weeks speedway star make me even more concerned for the health of speedway as a whole . 1) The in depth article about the resurgence of Glasgow under the Facenna brothers. We probably all applaud them ( as I do ) and wish that there were more promoters like them ( i.e. with huge resources and belief in the sport ). However they are aiming for a regular crowd pf around 1,200 this year ( and ultimately around 2,000 ). That figure of 1,200 is even after putting in a multi million pound investment. And in a major UK city with a 1,00,000 plus catchment area. That tells you a lot about the realistic hopes inside speedway even for those with money to put where their mouth is ( i.e. 1% perhaps 2% of the potential ), 2) If we believe all that we read in the 2016 Leicester Lions review ( and I do ) it is a terrible tale of the other kind of promoter. Worst of all in that that it is quite possible that some riders are still unpaid for 2016 and maybe even 2015. Horrific! I applaud them for riding week after week in those circumstances. And that is after the initial saviour for 2017 was paraded larger than life in the SS a month ago, who assured us all publicly that all debts to riders ,would be cleared. He is now a minority interest in the Lions latest incarnation - but - have those riders been fully paid and will they ever be? 3) In passing one of the more recent legends, forced from the sport by awful injuries says that he hopes in the long run that he sport keeps going. Me too Darcy! But the underlying stability of too many clubs is precarious to say the least and if clubs are desperate to average 1,000 or so every week ( even after spending hugely which few other clubs are never going to be able to copy ) their economic stability in the long term must be in doubt. The arguments over which engine etc etc will lower overall costs are not at all important if we can't attract 25% ( at least ) more regular fans than currently watch speedway. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveLyric2 Posted February 10, 2017 Report Share Posted February 10, 2017 What?! No mention of the MF article on page 2!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Stadia Posted February 10, 2017 Report Share Posted February 10, 2017 What?! No mention of the MF article on page 2!!!!!! Massey Ferguson? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted February 10, 2017 Report Share Posted February 10, 2017 Massey Ferguson? Are they doing a 'BOGOF'? :unsure: Perhaps the BSPA have done a deal for new Tractors for all Tracks.................. :D 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waytogo28 Posted February 11, 2017 Report Share Posted February 11, 2017 Matt Ford is the cryptic reference. I made no mention of his decision (?) to ease down his interest in speedway because I feel that the other points I made dwarfed the loss of someone who has hugely contributed to boosting speedway in his area at least and by building teams which have dominated the sport so far this century. I suspect that his announcement about partially withdrawing - in some way- is about how he does not like the direction the sport is currently heading in. Nor do i! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted February 11, 2017 Report Share Posted February 11, 2017 (edited) Matt Ford is the cryptic reference. I made no mention of his decision (?) to ease down his interest in speedway because I feel that the other points I made dwarfed the loss of someone who has hugely contributed to boosting speedway in his area at least and by building teams which have dominated the sport so far this century. I suspect that his announcement about partially withdrawing - in some way- is about how he does not like the direction the sport is currently heading in. Nor do i! Cheers for that waytogo28. We were just having a bit of fun with the letters MF. Edited February 11, 2017 by The White Knight 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemini Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 ..........waytogo28........ I suspect that his announcement about partially withdrawing - in some way- is about how he does not like the direction the sport is currently heading in. That's exactly how Avtar Sandhu felt in 2010. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waytogo28 Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 Indeed it is Gemini. And that is what concerns me about how speedway is run ( has been run for the last 15 years or so ). The "outside" people who we needed as positive sources of ideas that might contribute to positive change have been edged out / pushed out and in some cases taken a long look at themselves and their chances of dragging the BSPA forward. And taken their own choice to walk away. If those two prospective promoters at BV for 2017 fail to complete the deal ( perhaps because it makes running BV even more difficult ) we will be in even more of a pickle! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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