racers and royals Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 (edited) Funny though, this one probably has been. Business seems to have gone smoothly, possibly through agreements at the pre AGM meeting, and the press release was released about lunchtime on the third day, when it has always been released late Sunday night or even first thing Monday when held over the weekend. Mind you I think there was an understanding that there needs to be more agreement between them with the problems that we are faced with. Could be of course that some of the old fractious characters are not there now. I have been to many AGM's which weren't really pleasant at times. What's that story about a bad apple in a barrel ? Forever moaning turns others off even when enjoying the racing. It's still 4 riders racing around an oval after all. Likewise. As said on another thread, speedway fans must be the worst fans for dissecting and complaining about their sport, when in essence, it is still basically the same product on the track. And long may it be so. I`m surprised you are admitting to being a "fractious character" Edited November 4, 2016 by racers and royals 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevePark Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Putting aside the issues of doubling up/down , are the likes of bomber and watt going to ride for premier money when they double down ? I doubt it , so how is this helping the likes of Workington or any premier team financially ? Teams who can afford to pay, will pay (IF indeed they want 'mega-bucks'). It will only help the 'likes of Workington' when that team visits Derwent Park and a few extra people go along to watch riders who they think might be exciting to watch and/or because they haven't seen them in the PL/Championship for a while Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robolots Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 I don't know personal finances. But if the engines from different makers cost about the same yet maintenance is a fraction of the cost. You do the maths and I'm sure riders are doing some sums too. Easy to buy a Gerhard when your current engine expires. Current cost of GM engine (before tuning) circa £3000, current cost of GTR £6600. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for reducing costs and I think the GTR engine is definitely a step in the right direction. I just think it a bit dangerous for the BSPA and/or SCB to be jumping into bed with any one engine manufacturer. What speedway has needed is to diversify and not be a one make series in respect of engines/carbs/frames etc. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE DEAN MACHINE Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 (edited) Teams who can afford to pay, will pay (IF indeed they want 'mega-bucks'). It will only help the 'likes of Workington' when that team visits Derwent Park and a few extra people go along to watch riders who they think might be exciting to watch and/or because they haven't seen them in the PL/Championship for a while good theory but wrong , what will happen is the likes of Workington will try to afford the same to compete and pay above what they can afford and you get the Workington / Plymouth situation all over again. I thought the agm was ok but until more people attend speedway the business model for the sport doesn't work . You can't pay out more than you get in Edited November 4, 2016 by THE DEAN MACHINE 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foamfence Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 good theory but wrong , what will happen is the likes of Workington will try to afford the same to compete and pay above what they can afford and you get the Workington / Plymouth situation all over again. I thought the agm was ok but until more people attend speedway the business model for the sport doesn't work . You can't pay out more than you get in Redcar don't try to do that, maybe Workington have learned from their past mistakes? Plymouth didn't and paid the price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE DEAN MACHINE Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Redcar don't try to do that, maybe Workington have learned from their past mistakes? Plymouth didn't and paid the price.and well done to Redcar but with more expensive better riders planning to double up , the gap between the redcar's and the glasgows will be bigger than ever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fourentee Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 So the meeting between the bottom top league and top bottom league teams could be interesting as each team could be trying to get the lowest score.At least they didn't return to the previous effort, where the bottom two top-tier clubs (Peterborough and Wolves) played each other for the right to face the top second-tier side (Edinburgh). "What happens if we lose this pre play-off match?" "You get two extra pay days against a much weaker side." Hmm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Little Un Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 When we know what riders earn in the Premier League we might know if riders are willing to ride for it. We have been told for years that clubs do not go to the PL from the EL because the costs are the same or nearly the same in both leagues. Maybe doubling up gets round the new polish rules on racing in three countries only. We will only know who is doubling up when riders sign for their clubs. If many riders ride in both of the top two divisions the first division becomes even less attractive. The only thing I would object to is PL clubs signing any rider who is permanent GP rider. I still and always will believe that the PL and EL should have single use racedays, the PL would not race on EL racedays and the EL would not race on PL racedays as in Sweden because it is the only serious/sensible way to handle the doubling up rule. I do not mind the double up rule but we must have a system where there is not a constant use of guest riders because of it: We already have too many guests due to Overseas events and FIM events. At least they didn't return to the previous effort, where the bottom two top-tier clubs (Peterborough and Wolves) played each other for the right to face the top second-tier side (Edinburgh). "What happens if we lose this pre play-off match?" "You get two extra pay days against a much weaker side." Hmm. I do remember that and it looked like Edinburgh were riding not to win. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReturn Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 I am confused by the promotion aspect from the AGM. How will some Premier League clubs afford it in the top flight? Surely it can only work if promotion comes with a big winners cheque to help prop the team up for the following season or two in the top flight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A ORLOV Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 (edited) They have, I think Chris Louis mentioned something about it on a press release. No he only mentioned a change in the conversion rate in |May, presumably between the two leagues. With the championship league now seeming to have more meetings than previously is this going to make doubling up, down and sideways more difficult or full of guests for any d/u position. Edited November 4, 2016 by A ORLOV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronScorpion Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 and well done to Redcar but with more expensive better riders planning to double up , the gap between the redcar's and the glasgows will be bigger than ever That is where rich promoters, better/more sponsors & better fan base/population play a big part. For riders, it's not just the wages but the whole package(mechanic, van, parts, etc) taken from what C Louis has said "Louis said: “It brings a commonality in terms of team building in both leagues and then the conversion figure will be adjusted in May when they are both up and running and we can see what it is." CMA's based on 4 rides per rider = 14 heats = 42points. Conversion factor for true averages later could be 1.2(42 x 1.2 = 50.4) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Thumper Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Are you really being serious? This has been tried in this form before and been utterly pointless. For gods sake Rye House and Somerset have just been promoted without a race bring run. What's the big deal? I bet they will be dead pleased if they get relegated in their first season. But hey, I suppose they can always promote themselves again, so no need to worry. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wealdstone Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Will there be any real ambition from Championship clubs to go into the top flight via play offs ? There certainly was not last time 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foamfence Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Will there be any real ambition from Championship clubs to go into the top flight via play offs ? There certainly was not last time With the gap narrowed and everyone on the same averages, I don't think it'll be a problem. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tocha Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Will there be any real ambition from Championship clubs to go into the top flight via play offs ? There certainly was not last time I can't see any reason why there shouldn't be. The clubs from each division will be much closer in strength now so what might happen is similar to football for example. The team relegated to the Championship tends to lose its top players who choose to remain elsewhere in the Premier League. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 (edited) I can't see any reason why there shouldn't be. The clubs from each division will be much closer in strength now so what might happen is similar to football for example. The team relegated to the Championship tends to lose its top players who choose to remain elsewhere in the Premier League.Whereas in Speedway the promoted teams will already be employing the same riders as the relegated teams they have just beat!!!😁 Bomber might end up racing against himself in the promotion play off..! (Wonder if he would be able to beat himself out of the gate)?!😁 Edited November 4, 2016 by mikebv 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Like the Brexit vote, I hope we can run our sport individually from European countries and create a product that attract riders who want to be involved. The Brexit sentiment runs through a lot of British thinking.We didn't want to be involved in the Football world cup when it started and we weren't really keen on the European Cup either.In speedway we haven't got involved much with the European Championships and the SEC.We have a fair number who don't want to be involved with the EU.I note Phil Rising hopes that the Belle Vue stadium gets some big meetings from the FIM though...... I agree we should be creating product that attracts riders who want to be involed.We need to create a product that makes fans want to see it.The big trouble is we have a p poor youth training scheme.We don't produce riders of world clas quality with any regularity,so rely on foreigners.The pool of riders is only getting smaller and by trying to go the isolationist route we are shooting ourselves in the foot,both on the political and speedway front Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrion Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 and well done to Redcar but with more expensive better riders planning to double up , the gap between the redcar's and the glasgows will be bigger than ever I dont necessarily agree - if it so happens the likes of Harris drop down the PL it means the rider he is replacing at a Glasgow for example, drip down to the likes of Workington and Redcar the more riders created the better it is for the likes of Workington and Redcar as it affords them more options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromafar Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Is it really nessessary to drop the limit to 40pts.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graz gp Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 If the premier and championship teams are going to be a lot closer in strength, does that mean the admission prices are going to be about the same price. Me thinks not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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