Speedway Agm

[foamfence]

 

Well you can cut out that kind of talk!

 

I've seen promoters riding round in their fancy motors so they must be raking it in.

 

And as for the riders.............in my day, a top rider would strap his speedway bike onto the back of the trusty Citroen estate, throw a few tools in the back and drive off to proudly represent their club wherever it might be.

 

These days even National League riders are turning up in flashy vans and some even have more than one bike!

I am led to believe that some of these people even have hangers-on who drive their fancy transporters and faff about with spanners for them.

 

So, speedibee, it probably best if our illustrious leaders keep their hands on the bulk of this money because they might need it for an urgent re-branding exercise or to buy a large stock of green helmet covers.

 

Be seeing you.

Promoters aren't necessarily "raking it in" most of them are successful business people or have inherited money, that's how they managed to buy clubs in the first place. The story at Peterborough over the last few years is a good illustration of that.

[mikebv]

 

 

also they have mobile numbers to keep in touch with fixture news, offers, etc etc

 

also the other post about increasing revenue - yes of course this is vital but any businessman will tell you cost control is first because that is the one thing you have some control over - you can't always dictate selling (ticket) price - that is largely dictated by the market (ie other things you can spend yr disposable income on)

Spot on..

 

Guess who go a text advertising this years event?

 

And with an offer of a saving of a fiver for me and the lad v the normal entry cost as they obviously knew I attended the year before...!!

 

Not difficult to make money from a 'captured market' if you know how to...

 

Or maybe, more pertinently, have the desire and drive to do so...

Edited November 5, 2016 by mikebv

[Star Lady]

Having had time to digest what came out of the AGM and read the opinions of others, I've come to the conclusion that they have made a good start but need to do much more to save the sport, altho I realise Rome wasn't built in a day. It's the same with every thing run by committee, everything has to be a a compromise to get agreement. Obviously the promoters focused on cost cutting, sadly so far I've seen nothing that will increase the value for money for fans but maybe that might appear later ( lives in hope).

 

The biggest bug bear is the doubling up/down/guest/r/r effect and so far nothing seems to have been done to solve this. Maybe that's next years project.

 

I like the Gerhard thing if they could do a deal to get the initial costs down and sort out how to avoid tuners getting involved, that may take a bit of time to sort tho.

 

I still have a couple of questions.

 

One that many have asked, what happens when a doubling up/down rider is involved in promotion/relegation matches, maybe a specific ruling should be made to cover the possibility.

 

Two if on August 1st Tommy Tucker riding for Slough (Div1) doubling down with Basingstoke(Div2) is injured and Slough want to replace him as he has a season ending injury will that be allowed? Who decides if it's a season ending injury? If Tommy Tucker then makes a remarkable recovery 3 weeks down the line will he be allowed to retake his place in the Basingstoke team and what happens to the rejigged Slough team? Sorry to bang on about this but I can see this scenario being used by unscrupulous teams to strengthen up, so I'd like clarification in advance so everyone knows the possible loopholes

[FAST GATER]

I believe that every s/way rider should be paid as much as possible and begrudge them nothing ,however sadly it is a dangerous sport with marginal rewards at best and anyone who embarks on a career in s/way should accept that financial reward is a bonus not a right .

[Humphrey Appleby]

I've seen promoters riding round in their fancy motors so they must be raking it in.

You only have to look at the attendances, multiply by the admission fee and remove VAT to see they can't be raking it in. There might also be a bit of sponsorship coming in, but again you only have to look at the type of sponsors to see it's not going to be significant money.

 

There might be the odd exception, but if a track turns a modest profit at the end of the year then it's probably doing pretty well.

 

I'd imagine most promoters would have to have successful businesses elsewhere to be able to run speedway these days. So presumably any fancy motors are financed from their earnings there.

[Little Thumper]

You only have to look at the attendances, multiply by the admission fee and remove VAT to see they can't be raking it in. There might also be a bit of sponsorship coming in, but again you only have to look at the type of sponsors to see it's not going to be significant money.

 

There might be the odd exception, but if a track turns a modest profit at the end of the year then it's probably doing pretty well.

 

I'd imagine most promoters would have to have successful businesses elsewhere to be able to run speedway these days. So presumably any fancy motors are financed from their earnings there.

 

I wasn't actually being serious!

[foamfence]

 

I wasn't actually being serious!

In that case I apologise for my own reply.

[Little Thumper]

In that case I apologise for my own reply.

 

Your apology is graciously accepted, foamfence my friend.

[IronScorpion]

Rome wasn't built in a day.

 

We know we needed change & this is a step in the right direction that some of the promoters have aired their views. The Rules & Regulations( then sub-Regulations will follow. As I have posted previously, we are basing our views on a 300 word statement & airing our views on things that have not been changed but lets give it time. Some owners or promoters read the forums and if we get the chance to speak to them they might say, yes, we talked about this but baby steps first rather than wholesale change.

 

I am still not sure haw the averages will work out early on as heat leaders had tougher rides last year as only about 5 riders averaged over 8 last year. The EDR's had inflated averages because of their easier rides so how a rolling average will work, I am not too sure.

 

T/R should have been abolished as in the KO Cup but they could have brought back the use of the T/S.

 

If Sky have the monopoly of when racing occurs(usually a Monday or Wednesday), why couldn't they be used as fixed race nights for the Premiership(formally EL). How many Championship(formally PL) clubs ride on those days? This would eliminate the use of guests but still allow the use of double uppers which, I think, we still need.

 

We need to look at what the Polish, Danish & Swedish Leagues are doing to make British Speedway easier to understand. I have many friends that talk to me about speedway but I find it hard to get them down to watch it.

 

But, anyone know the offside rule in football!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Skid Sprocket]

In that case I apologise for my own reply.

You shouldn't need to apologise some of us take these posts seriously. There is a seperate thread for jokes and the like.

[A ORLOV]

Do not really see the need to follow the same league names as football but what are they going to do when the top footy league becomes the Mc Donalds league followed by the lower Witherspoons league, change again.

Luckily at the moment the third footy league is called the National League, but soon to become The Pound Shop League.

No doubt I will get used to these daft league names at some point.

Edited November 5, 2016 by A ORLOV

[Little Thumper]

You shouldn't need to apologise some of us take these posts seriously. There is a seperate thread for jokes and the like.

 

I apologize to Skid Sprocket for having accepted foamfence's gracious and courteous apology, even though no apology was needed from my friend.

 

I shall in future post in a serious manner and desist from any attempt to inject any form of humour into the serious and substantial topics which are discussed in this arena.

 

I shall immediately hurry off and seek out the jokes and the like department to which the noble Skid Sprocket had referred me and should at any time I feel the need to lapse into a humorous frame of mind, I shall confine myself to the comedy room.

 

Again, I apologize for interrupting the serious discussions that are undertaken in this place and I shall let Skid Sprocket engage in serious contemplation without frivolous interjections from myself.

 

Your servant,

Thumper

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

You shouldn't need to apologise some of us take these posts seriously. There is a seperate thread for jokes and the like.

 

Sorry about this, Skid Sprocket but I am struggling to find the thread for jokes and the like to which you wish to banish me.

 

I realize that you are probably busy thinking through very serious matters but if you could point me in the right direction, i would be your humble servant.

 

I would be grateful if you would come to my assistance with some haste as I feel that a wave of humour is about to engulf me and I do not wish to further distract you from your serious thoughts.

[IronScorpion]

I am not sure why they have used a July 31st date for a cut off point for transfers! Yes, we had the, as others have put it, miss-use of Woffinden & Lindback, but as regards the date, there were hardly any league meetings during the month of July because of the Pairs(8th), Cardiff GP(9th), 4's(24th) & World Team Cup(29/30th). What will be the timetable for these events, again, in 2017? You might as well use June 30th but because of our climate then mid August.

 

Best time of the year is the school holidays when attendances could/should go up & we rarely have league meetings.

[martinmauger]

A fair bit to digest from the AGM , time will tell how things pan out.

 

Just one quick point; hope the 're-branding' lasts because the names of the 2 top leagues at least have been changed, again. I know the last change, to Elite & Premier, was in 1997, not sure when the Conference League became National league, but league name changes do seem to occur a lot in speedway.....

[The White Knight]

One change that, although mentioned in posts, hasn't really been challenged and that is why change the names of the two leagues? how is it going to help? I see it as a poor unnecessary change.

Because the 'Elite' League was never 'Elite'. The Premier League was never that either - a contradiction in terms. If the Elite League was the top League - how then could the Premier League be that. Premier, by definition means Top. So they were both wrongly named in the first place.

 

The Promoters have recognised that and changed the names.

 

A good move in my opinion.

 

Rome wasn't built in a day.

 

We know we needed change & this is a step in the right direction that some of the promoters have aired their views. The Rules & Regulations( then sub-Regulations will follow. As I have posted previously, we are basing our views on a 300 word statement & airing our views on things that have not been changed but lets give it time. Some owners or promoters read the forums and if we get the chance to speak to them they might say, yes, we talked about this but baby steps first rather than wholesale change.

 

I am still not sure haw the averages will work out early on as heat leaders had tougher rides last year as only about 5 riders averaged over 8 last year. The EDR's had inflated averages because of their easier rides so how a rolling average will work, I am not too sure.

 

T/R should have been abolished as in the KO Cup but they could have brought back the use of the T/S.

 

If Sky have the monopoly of when racing occurs(usually a Monday or Wednesday), why couldn't they be used as fixed race nights for the Premiership(formally EL). How many Championship(formally PL) clubs ride on those days? This would eliminate the use of guests but still allow the use of double uppers which, I think, we still need.

 

We need to look at what the Polish, Danish & Swedish Leagues are doing to make British Speedway easier to understand. I have many friends that talk to me about speedway but I find it hard to get them down to watch it.

 

But, anyone know the offside rule in football!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You can say that again!!!

 

I really thought it was going to be this year.

 

Never mind - back to the telly.

[frigbo]

The team average situation at first green sheet time is "to be clarified"

 

This is direct from one of the promoters and ties in with Chris Louis' press release.

 

So truth is, nobody knows yet what you can do when team and rider averages naturally settle.

[Starman2006]

Do not really see the need to follow the same league names as football but what are they going to do when the top footy league becomes the Mc Donalds league followed by the lower Witherspoons league, change again.

Luckily at the moment the third footy league is called the National League, but soon to become The Pound Shop League.

No doubt I will get used to these daft league names at some point.

Picture the scene now. The person that came up with that. Sat at home and thought ding, i know, lets call the leagues premiership and championship...

[DunRobin]

The team average situation at first green sheet time is "to be clarified"

 

This is direct from one of the promoters and ties in with Chris Louis' press release.

 

So truth is, nobody knows yet what you can do when team and rider averages naturally settle.

What this means is that Poole will want to keep at 50, so that they can bend the rules before 31st July, as they can't strengthen for the p/offs now. However, as I understand it, they want to lower the points limit after the 1st green sheets & that 50 is only for initial team build. What they haven't decided from what I can make out is what the limit will be lowered to. I would suggest in the interests of all that it is lowered to the highest averaged team's points.

[enotian]

Another half way house

 

I guess Poole & Wolves aside none of the Elite League clubs could afford to continue at that level, whilst at Premier League level several clubs struggle to make ends meet, so an amalgamation was inevitable, be it one big league or two smaller leagues but essentially at a Premier League standard as affordable by all participating teams.

 

So having accepted this reality why on earth do they decide to implement a 10 point difference between the two leagues!? Thereby reinstalling the potential that some of the Premiership (Div 1) clubs will find it unaffordable, rendering the promotion/relegation concept redundant, yet more average ambiguity and ensuring the continued use of extensive doubling up. Resulting in essentially a Premier League plus (Premiership) and a Premier League Lite (Championship) offering, when most of the clubs would have been able to sustain a Premier League standard product. Those that can't should seek to join the National League.

 

The Doubling Up free for all has had a negative impact on the sport in the UK. Aside from the inevitable fixture clashes and the concept of being in more than one team diminishing the credibility of the sport it also impacts on the fairness of competition between those who Dup and those who don't. Some riders have twice the earnings of others and inevitably work with a much higher budget.

 

Surely a Premier League standard product for the 16 most "affluent" teams with no doubling up would have been more desirable to the public, even if that meant two or three sgp stars would be excluded. If two leagues were preferable then a smaller 2.50 differential between team building could have worked.

 

I think there are potentially 96 riders from last season excluding sgp riders. So adding a handful of 2.00 pointers and new foreign riders their would be enough for 16 Premier League standard teams.

 

Whilst a total lack of top level competition in this country is regrettable it is not really being offered by the new Premiership either, bar 2 or 3 sgp riders.

 

Another missed opportunity

Craig Cook 9.88 Danny King 9.57 Eddie Kennett 9.27 Scott Nicholls 9.23 Brady Kurtz 9.22 Chris Harris 9.21 Rohan Tungate 9.03 Nick Morris 8.97 Josh Grajczonek 8.90 Sam Masters 8.88 Robert Lambert 8.76 Jason Garrity 8.55 Lewis Bridger 8.53 Steve Worrall 8.51 Simon Stead 8.39 Richie Worrall 8.33 Richard Lawson 8.17 Aaron Summers 8.13 Kevin Wolbert 8.09 Ben Barker 7.91 Adam Ellis 7.84 Ricky Wells 7.71 Ludvig Lindgren 7.65 David Bellego 7.63 Justin Sedgmen 7.60 Davey Watt 7.56 Matej Kus 7.55 Nico Covatti 7.49 Thomas Jorgensen 7.45 Troy Batchelor 7.36 Rene Bach 7.32 Ulrich Ostergaard 7.23 Ryan Douglas 7.18 Kyle Howarth 7.18 Rory Schlein 7.17 Jack Holder 7.16 Josh Auty 7.10 Stuart Robson 7.09 Michael Palm Toft 7.01 Kevin Doolan 6.99 Nikolaj Busk Jacobsen 6.98 Dimitri Berge 6.91 Hugh Skidmore 6.84 Erik Riss 6.78 Claus Vissing 6.76 Lasse Bjerre 6.65 Paul Starke 6.62 Charles Wright 6.59 Nickolas Porsing 6.58 Jonas B Andersen 6.32 Kyle Newman 6.31 Kenneth Hansen 6.25 Tero Aarnio 6.24 Theo Pijper 6.16 Lewis Kerr 6.16 Rasmus Jensen 6.14 Carl Wilkinson 6.12 Jake Allen 5.96 Lewis Rose 5.86 James Sarjeant 5.80 Victor Palovaara 5.80 Todd Kurtz 5.76 Matthew Wethers 5.65 Stefan Nielsen 5.53 Nicolai Klindt 5.42 Alex Davies 5.41 Joe Jacobs 5.36 Simon Lambert 5.25 Kasper Lykke Nielsen 5.16 Steve Boxall 5.15 Kai Huckenbeck 5.14 Robert Mear 5.11 Zdenek Simota 5.09 Cameron Heeps 5.07 Adam Roynon 5.05 Josh Bates 5.02 Bradley Wilson Dean 5.02 Daniel Gappmaier 5.00 Mark Riss 5.00 Tobias Busch 5.00 Jye Etheridge 5.00 Fritz Wallner 5.00 Nike Lunna 4.86 Ashley Morris 4.83 Liam Carr 4.81 Robert Branford 4.60 Emil Grondal 4.58 Leigh Lanham 4.34 Fernando Garcia 4.23 Max Clegg 4.04 Dan Bewley 4.00 Ben Morley 3.85 Arthur Sissis 3.79 Tom Perry 3.76 Matt Williamson 3.76 Danny Ayres 3.56 Danyon Hume 2.00 Darryl Richings 2.00 Danny Phillips 2.00 Daniel Halsey 2.00 Tom Stokes 2.00 Ellis Perks 2.00 Lee Payne 2.00 Josh Bailey 2.00 Nathan Greaves 2.00 Zach Wajknecht 2.00 Tom Bacon 2.00 Jack Parkinson-Blackburn 2.00 Jack Smith 2.00 Rob Shuttleworth 2.00 Dan Greenwood 2.00 Luke Chessell 2.00 Jake Knight 2.00 Georgie Wood 2.00 James Shanes 2.00 Connor Coles 2.00 Connor Mountain 2.00

[SCB]

Surely a Premier League standard product for the 16 most "affluent" teams with no doubling up would have been more desirable to the public, even if that meant two or three sgp stars would be excluded. If two leagues were preferable then a smaller 2.50 differential between team building could have worked.

 

Get rid of doubling up or just have one league and you need 133 riders. There are not 133 rider interested in riding in the UK. It just wouldn't work.