Glasgow V Sheffield Pl Play Off S/f 1st Leg , 16/10/16 At 3pm

[Paulco]

Gutted I couldn't make the restaging because of work , and gutted about the outcome . I worry we're becoming the nearly men of speedway , That's two League Cup finals , a play off final , play off semi final , Pairs semi final and we blew fours qualification on the very last heat when the group was at our mercy .

Still i'd rather be in the mix for silverware , than not . And there's still a KO Cup to race for .

So well done and good luck to Sheffield , and to both teams in the play off final , I have good friends among the support of both camps . I hope it's a final fitting of the occasion .

[4thbender]

 

An absolute travesty that a team operating within the rules wins the league?

 

What about the teams that have used guests in order to qualify for the playoffs?

 

Or are you saying that the playoffs should be contested only by the teams that have their own seven riders, or would you allow R/R, would there have been six teams of seven riders to contest the playoffs.

 

on another note, the guests made us weaker last night not stronger

If by hook or by crook Sheffield manage to beat Somerset in the final, a major injustice will have taken place to take away the achievement of a team that's lost only four times in the entire season. It will show up the farcical nature of a competition wherein a team finishing sixth can be anointed as "League Champions" having used a litany of 'ringers' in the process.

 

As a tigers fan of 50 years standing, it will give me no pleasure or pride whatsoever to become "champions" in such circumstances. I therefore hope and trust Somerset give us a walloping in both legs. However, I would add that Howarth, Bates, Sissis and Greaves have been outstanding throughout this debacle and deserve the praise of all Sheffield fans. It is a pity their efforts have been diminished by the ridiculous rules of the competition.

 

For me, Howarth has been the discovery of the season and his name should be first on the teamsheet for 2017.

[Willowman]

Gutted I couldn't make the restaging because of work , and gutted about the outcome . I worry we're becoming the nearly men of speedway , That's two League Cup finals , a play off final , play off semi final , Pairs semi final and we blew fours qualification on the very last heat when the group was at our mercy .

Still i'd rather be in the mix for silverware , than not . And there's still a KO Cup to race for .

So well done and good luck to Sheffield , and to both teams in the play off final , I have good friends among the support of both camps . I hope it's a final fitting of the occasion .

Welcome to the world of Somerset. We've had our fair share of near misses. At least your most recent is by 2 points in a P/O semi. We've had a couple of 1 point misses in finals. Hopefully we'll be lucky this year. Going to be an interesting Sunday/Monday. Good luck to both teams.

[GS550]

If by hook or by crook Sheffield manage to beat Somerset in the final, a major injustice will have taken place to take away the achievement of a team that's lost only four times in the entire season. It will show up the farcical nature of a competition wherein a team finishing sixth can be anointed as "League Champions" having used a litany of 'ringers' in the process.

 

As a tigers fan of 50 years standing, it will give me no pleasure or pride whatsoever to become "champions" in such circumstances. I therefore hope and trust Somerset give us a walloping in both legs. However, I would add that Howarth, Bates, Sissis and Greaves have been outstanding throughout this debacle and deserve the praise of all Sheffield fans. It is a pity their efforts have been diminished by the ridiculous rules of the competition.

 

For me, Howarth has been the discovery of the season and his name should be first on the teamsheet for 2017.

 

Remarkable honesty. As well as commendable.

 

I agree with your comments about the system and I too favour the league being decided by the league table, but any change back to that format is for the future. Sheffield have played by the rules as they stand for the 2016 season and if you win in the Play-Off Final then you have every right to be anointed League Champions.

[Stan Duppcomic]

I cant believe Sheffield fans are accusing the Tigers of using Ringers to further their cause. IMO every point these so called ringers have gained them in away legs have been compensated for by lost points in home legs as a result of not having the in form home track specialists of Berge Garrity and Stead.

 

As for the play offs, they're an abomination and probably increase the losses incurred by the club but "them's the rules" and the Promoters have agreed to that being the way to settle the championship

Edited October 22, 2016 by Stan Duppcomic

[Paulco]

Welcome to the world of Somerset. We've had our fair share of near misses. At least your most recent is by 2 points in a P/O semi. We've had a couple of 1 point misses in finals. Hopefully we'll be lucky this year. Going to be an interesting Sunday/Monday. Good luck to both teams.

Yes you have had some frustrating near misses too in recent years , but always come back with a competitive side and are challenging once again the following year . That's the way I want Glasgow to be . We've had a great season , and we might yet still end it with silverware , people are too quick to forget the awful years when we hovered down or around the bottom of the table , blimey was either 2012 0r 13 we went from May till September without winning at home .

I've had an enjoyable season regardless , and Glasgow's future is secure which is always the main thing .

[damosuzuki]

Yes you have had some frustrating near misses too in recent years , but always come back with a competitive side and are challenging once again the following year . That's the way I want Glasgow to be . We've had a great season , and we might yet still end it with silverware , people are too quick to forget the awful years when we hovered down or around the bottom of the table , blimey was either 2012 0r 13 we went from May till September without winning at home .

I've had an enjoyable season regardless , and Glasgow's future is secure which is always the main thing .

 

Good post. May the best team win in the final. Guests are always going to be a feature of such a dangerous sport. No issue with it. Here's hoping for a great final (wish it was on TV) and I expect Somerset to finish in style.

 

People having a go at Glasgow for the unfounded trying to buy a title. the Facennas and the people around them have not only invested heavily in cash but put an ENORMOUS amount of work into giving Glasgow speedway a wonderful stadium and facilities. They are there week in week out working their socks off and trying to make the sport work.

[Paulco]

 

Good post. May the best team win in the final. Guests are always going to be a feature of such a dangerous sport. No issue with it. Here's hoping for a great final (wish it was on TV) and I expect Somerset to finish in style.

 

People having a go at Glasgow for the unfounded trying to buy a title. the Facennas and the people around them have not only invested heavily in cash but put an ENORMOUS amount of work into giving Glasgow speedway a wonderful stadium and facilities. They are there week in week out working their socks off and trying to make the sport work.

That's just petty jealousy , I just let that wash right over me . We are now fortunate to follow a professionally run club in a nice modern stadium , I for one am thankful for that .

[bellevueace]

One minute people are saying speedway needs investment next minute when that investment is forthcoming as it is with the Faccenas at Glasgow they are trying to buy the title. Unlike football you cant buy the title as no matter how much money you have you still have to build to the same team average as everyone else, not exactly like Man utd fielding Ronaldo, Messi, Aguero, Suarez etc is it? More clubs need promoters like Glasgow that put in investment, upgrade aging stadiums and actually get out and promote putting the club and the sport firmly in the public eye, i say well done to them.

[Paulco]

One minute people are saying speedway needs investment next minute when that investment is forthcoming as it is with the Faccenas at Glasgow they are trying to buy the title. Unlike football you cant buy the title as no matter how much money you have you still have to build to the same team average as everyone else, not exactly like Man utd fielding Ronaldo, Messi, Aguero, Suarez etc is it? More clubs need promoters like Glasgow that put in investment, upgrade aging stadiums and actually get out and promote putting the club and the sport firmly in the public eye, i say well done to them.

Thankfully this attitude is more forthcoming than the opposite one .

[Halifaxtiger]

If by hook or by crook Sheffield manage to beat Somerset in the final, a major injustice will have taken place to take away the achievement of a team that's lost only four times in the entire season. It will show up the farcical nature of a competition wherein a team finishing sixth can be anointed as "League Champions" having used a litany of 'ringers' in the process.

 

As a tigers fan of 50 years standing, it will give me no pleasure or pride whatsoever to become "champions" in such circumstances. I therefore hope and trust Somerset give us a walloping in both legs. However, I would add that Howarth, Bates, Sissis and Greaves have been outstanding throughout this debacle and deserve the praise of all Sheffield fans. It is a pity their efforts have been diminished by the ridiculous rules of the competition.

 

For me, Howarth has been the discovery of the season and his name should be first on the teamsheet for 2017.

 

I suspect that its because you are a fan of 50 years that you simply can't grasp why speedway has the play offs and why every speedway fan has to put their personal preferences aside and accept that they are not just important, but vital.

 

First of all, read the EL Grand Final thread. Almost all say that it was everything good about speedway - a huge crowd, cracking racing and everything hanging on the result. Then double that for Glasgow v Sheffield, as that was a last heat decider. Small wonder my old mate Tigerite - a Tigers fan who has missed a handful of meetings home and away in years - says that the Newcastle & Glasgow matches are amongst the best he has ever seen. Speaking personally, in the 700 or so meetings I have seen since 2004 one of the best was most definitely the Mildenhall/Scunthorpe NL final a few years ago, when everything hung on the last bend of the last race - as the riders went over the line, we still didn't know who had won.

 

That crowd at Belle Vue was there because it was a one off final, with all the excitement that that entails. Most important of all, I'd say the proceeds from that meeting were pushing £100k and that the total proceeds for the EL play off meetings were probably well over £300k. Is speedway in a position to turn that sort of money down?

 

Given Belle Vue's reported financial problems, I'd ask them first before you answer.

 

As to the use of guests, precisely what are Sheffield supposed to do when Stead, Garrity & Berge are all injured ? Put out three NL(guest) riders ? Turn up with just 4 and have treble rider replacement ? Forfeit the tie through no fault of their own ? Guests are part of speedway and have been for 50 years or more. They aren't brilliant by any means, but they are better than any alternative.

 

If Sheffield do win (can't see it myself, but then I couldn't against Newcastle or Glasgow either) you (and one or two others) can go in a corner and cry. Make no mistake though, in Sheffield you'll be pretty much on your own because every single Sheffield fan I know - Sunglasses Dave, Tigerite, Big Kev, Spinny, Spinny Junior, Squall - will be going absolutely nuts.

I cant believe Sheffield fans are accusing the Tigers of using Ringers to further their cause. IMO every point these so called ringers have gained them in away legs have been compensated for by lost points in home legs as a result of not having the in form home track specialists of Berge Garrity and Stead.

 

As for the play offs, they're an abomination and probably increase the losses incurred by the club but "them's the rules" and the Promoters have agreed to that being the way to settle the championship

 

Increase the losses? Are you serious ? I bet Damien Bates is rubbing his hands at the thought of a PL Grand Final place.

 

As I have indicated Belle Vue probably got £100k from the EL Grand Final.

 

Given their much rumoured financial problems, it doesn't bear thinking about where they would be if the play offs did not exist.

Edited October 22, 2016 by Halifaxtiger

[Stan Duppcomic]

You need a new calculator mate.

[Halifaxtiger]

You need a new calculator mate.

 

Do I ?

 

There were a reported 4,000 at Belle Vue that night. At an average £20 per ticket, that's £80k. Plus the reported £10k TV money, plus the sale of programmes, food and drink.

 

Makes about £100k to me.

 

One thing that no-one will argue about the play offs is that attendances increase. For a one off final, I'll be surprised if Sheffield's normal gate doesn't at least double.

Edited October 22, 2016 by Halifaxtiger

[bellevueace]

Whilst the crowds no doubt increase for the play offs they go the opposite way for the majority of the season as people know the regular league really is now nothing more than a qualifying process so why bother lets just turn out for the semis and final if we qualify. The crowds need to increase throughout the whole season for clubs to be solvent, not just four creaming it at the end of the season.

[Stan Duppcomic]

You seem to be equating turnover with profit. On the turnover, £80k?? What about kids, concessions, freeloaders, etc

 

On the other side what about running costs, wages etc?

 

As for Sheffield, the crowds look pitiful at the moment. Even if they double for the semi or final which I doubt, I doubt there'll be more than 1500 there. If a third of them are kids youre probably looking at 15k. I reckon 1000 will be there at most. Take out rent running costs wages etc and there wont be much left.

[Halifaxtiger]

Whilst the crowds no doubt increase for the play offs they go the opposite way for the majority of the season as people know the regular league really is now nothing more than a qualifying process so why bother lets just turn out for the semis and final if we qualify. The crowds need to increase throughout the whole season for clubs to be solvent, not just four creaming it at the end of the season.

 

I don't think that's true, for simple reason that all league matches are meaningful. Indeed, the play offs mean that we are left with substantially less dead rubbers at the end of the season - dead rubbers whose attendances are often disastrous.

[montie]

Whilst the crowds no doubt increase for the play offs they go the opposite way for the majority of the season as people know the regular league really is now nothing more than a qualifying process so why bother lets just turn out for the semis and final if we qualify. The crowds need to increase throughout the whole season for clubs to be solvent, not just four creaming it at the end of the season.

 

What utter Rubbish,the play offs kept the PL season alive and created some good fixtures in the closing stages and also created a good laugh from/for many at Peterborough`s expense!

[Halifaxtiger]

You seem to be equating turnover with profit. On the turnover, £80k?? What about kids, concessions, freeloaders, etc

 

On the other side what about running costs, wages etc?

 

As for Sheffield, the crowds look pitiful at the moment. Even if they double for the semi or final which I doubt, I doubt there'll be more than 1500 there. If a third of them are kids youre probably looking at 15k. I reckon 1000 will be there at most. Take out rent running costs wages etc and there wont be much left.

 

No I'm not. I said Belle Vue got £100k that night in receipts.

 

What about corporate packages, grandstand tickets (£25, I think), car parking.

 

Figures aside, the simple fact is Belle Vue made a lot of money that night. If they didn't when the stadium was packed, it doesn't bear thinking about how much they lost all season.

 

Sheffield's gates haven't been what they should, probably because the track is so poor. But if they are breaking even with a gate of 1,000, this season's losses must be something that can't be contemplated.

[4thbender]

Whilst the crowds no doubt increase for the play offs they go the opposite way for the majority of the season as people know the regular league really is now nothing more than a qualifying process so why bother lets just turn out for the semis and final if we qualify. The crowds need to increase throughout the whole season for clubs to be solvent, not just four creaming it at the end of the season.

From my perch on the fourth bend I noted a distinct drop-off in the normal crowd numbers for the quarter- and semi-finals at Owlerton. What happens next Wednesday remains to be seen, but I sense that for many Sheffield fans the season finished three weeks ago.

 

Had we had Steady, Garrity and Berge, the story might have been different, but turning out on a cold, dark night to watch "borrowed" riders trying to win a league title for a Sheffield team that was acknowledged sixth-best in the league is taking irony to its limits.

[Stan Duppcomic]

The EL play offs are a great product surrounded by hype and TV. The PL ones are a damp squib. Probably beacause too many teams qualify