Glasgow Vs Somerset Cup Final 1st Leg 9th Oct

[spin king]

 

With all the rumours about him, Garrity and other Sheff riders along with countless other incidents including today, it makes you wonder what sort of idiot Bates really is.

Other Sheffield riders, whats that suppose to mean?

[idh]

But weren't Glasgow in the same boat last week as RR for Lunna made them stronger both at OTA and Ashfield for KO Cup. Bach as supposed 7 pointer could take a 4 pointers ride.

Touche Drew

[Bagpuss]

But weren't Glasgow in the same boat last week as RR for Lunna made them stronger both at OTA and Ashfield for KO Cup. Bach as supposed 7 pointer could take a 4 pointers ride.

One ride out of four with the other three taken by reserves? You'll have to do better than that.

[Statman]

The rule used to be that a guest replacement for a reserve rider had to be another rider who was currently in a reserve position for his team, so even if your missing rider had, for example, a 5.02 average, you had to use a guest who was holding down a reserve position for his club with an average lower than that of the missing rider, even if there were riders in the main body of a team with an average lower than the injured rider for whom the guest was required.

 

I recall that there were fans who used to moan comment back then that was unfair as should be able to use any rider as a guest for an injured reserve so long as their average was lower than that of the reserve rider he was to guest for......I think it was somewhere around 2009-ish that the rule was changed to how it still currently stands, obviously the majority of promoters back then were happy to change the rule, probably on the 'you win some, you lose some' basis on who might be eligible to come in as a guest.

 

To get over the fact that a reserve might be perceived to have 'easier' rides, the 5% home uplift does not apply to a reserve's average when looking to use a guest replacement.

Edited October 9, 2016 by Statman

[Paulco]

They have Identical averages. He may be an idiot but doesn't make us stronger on paper really. On that note i don't want him anywhere near the Somerset team again.

Bates cut Bach's nose off on the run to the first bend . He went on to win the race easily and on the back straight after the race Bach obviously said something to Bates , which Bates took exception to and started swinging punches in Bach's direction . I've no issue with that , it's a high octane sport and they were both wearing crash helmets , so punches ain't going to do any damage . When it becomes an issue is when the posse of mechanics come charging out the pits to make it a free for all . When is this nonsense going to be stopped ?

There's no issue with Somerset using Bates , a promotion has to use the rules the best way they can . Well done Somerset , that's one each in the cups , will we have a decider in the play offs I wonder

[drew2]

One ride out of four with the other three taken by reserves? You'll have to do better than that.

no Glasgow will have to do better than that especially if Somerset are back to claim the PL Title later this month.

The rule used to be that a guest replacement for a reserve rider had to be another rider who was currently in a reserve position for his team, so even if your missing rider had, for example, a 5.02 average, you had to use a guest who was holding down a reserve position for his club with an average lower than that of the missing rider, even if there were riders in the main body of a team with an average lower than the injured rider for whom the guest was required.

 

I recall that there were fans who used to moan comment back then that was unfair as should be able to use any rider as a guest for an injured reserve so long as their average was lower than that of the reserve rider he was to guest for......I think it was somewhere around 2009-ish that the rule was changed to how it still currently stands, obviously the majority of promoters back then were happy to change the rule, probably on the 'you win some, you lose some' basis on who might be eligible to come in as a guest.

 

To get over the fact that a reserve might be perceived to have 'easier' rides, the 5% home uplift does not apply to a reserve's average when looking to use a guest replacement.

and i wouldn't be surprised if you weren't the 'brains' behind the whole which rider fits and rides tracks well for the Rebels when the need arises??

[Gazc]

no Glasgow will have to do better than that especially if Somerset are back to claim the PL Title later this month.

Different Day different meeting as last week was to this so don't write us off yet we still have a tough semi against Sheffield to come and you are not a gimme against Ipswich for that matter.

[Dekker]

When it becomes an issue is when the posse of mechanics come charging out the pits to make it a free for all . When is this nonsense going to be stopped ?

 

Now whose trademark was that

[drew2]

Different Day different meeting as last week was to this so don't write us off yet we still have a tough semi against Sheffield to come and you are not a gimme against Ipswich for that matter.

i did say IF

[Paulco]

Makes the biggee against Sheffield next Sunday all the more interesting , hope Bates wears earplugs on the parade .

[cyclone]

Think the advantage of using a guest from a 1 – 5 to replace a number 6 is being over exaggerated.

 

The programmed rides for a number 6 means he is scheduled to race against the opposing 6 & 7, three times (i.e. ht 2 and either ht 12 or 14).

 

However a number 5 will also face the opposing reserves three time also, while a team’s no.2, 3, or 4 will be scheduled to face the reserves twice.

 

Granted there is the flexibility to swap the reserves allocated races after ht 4 and an on-form reserve can appear in two more races in total than any non-reserve, where there is no r/r.

 

But as pointed out previously, if a team has a high average number 6, they have earned this situation and should be allowed to replace like for like when the situation arises.

[lucifer sam]

Bates cut Bach's nose off on the run to the first bend . He went on to win the race easily and on the back straight after the race Bach obviously said something to Bates , which Bates took exception to and started swinging punches in Bach's direction . I've no issue with that , it's a high octane sport and they were both wearing crash helmets , so punches ain't going to do any damage . When it becomes an issue is when the posse of mechanics come charging out the pits to make it a free for all . When is this nonsense going to be stopped ?

 

 

Agreed, a bit of fisticuffs/handbags between riders should be almost encouraged - because the fans love it.

 

Buy any mechanics involved should be banned from the pits for future meetings. It's nothing to do with them and they turn a bit of harmless entertainment into thuggery.

 

All the best

Rob

[spin king]

Bates cut Bach's nose off on the run to the first bend . He went on to win the race easily and on the back straight after the race Bach obviously said something to Bates , which Bates took exception to and started swinging punches in Bach's direction . I've no issue with that , it's a high octane sport and they were both wearing crash helmets , so punches ain't going to do any damage . When it becomes an issue is when the posse of mechanics come charging out the pits to make it a free for all . When is this nonsense going to be stopped ?

There's no issue with Somerset using Bates , a promotion has to use the rules the best way they can . Well done Somerset , that's one each in the cups , will we have a decider in the play offs I wonder

Fully agree with about the riders, but I do wonder why you would want to punch someone in the head when they are wearing a crash helmet is beyond me unless you can aim a punch like Craig Boyce.

 

Mechanics is a different matter, and Josh will pay the price for that, it quite a few years since Vissing got done at Sheffield and failure to control his mechanic I believe cost him £400.

 

One thing it will do is spice things up next Sunday when Josh comes back with Sheffield.

[Bagpuss]

no Glasgow will have to do better than that especially if Somerset are back to claim the PL Title later this month.

Nice attempt to divert from the issue but you are quite correct, Glasgow need to raise their game. They have the look of aside who have run out of steam to me and I wouldn't be surprised if they struggle beat Sheffield over two legs.

[lucifer sam]

Think the advantage of using a guest from a 1 – 5 to replace a number 6 is being over exaggerated.

 

The programmed rides for a number 6 means he is scheduled to race against the opposing 6 & 7, three times (i.e. ht 2 and either ht 12 or 14).

 

However a number 5 will also face the opposing reserves three time also, while a team’s no.2, 3, or 4 will be scheduled to face the reserves twice.

 

Granted there is the flexibility to swap the reserves allocated races after ht 4 and an on-form reserve can appear in two more races in total than any non-reserve, where there is no r/r.

 

But as pointed out previously, if a team has a high average number 6, they have earned this situation and should be allowed to replace like for like when the situation arises.

 

Cyclone, I largely agree with this, although I would point it is open to manipulation.

 

For example, a team - let's called them Team E for the sake of argument - sign a rider, let's call him Kalle, again for the sake of the argument. He thrives at reserve and pushes his average up to nearly 7.00.

 

In the meantime, team E continually replace a succession of useless riders on a 7.00 assessed average to keep Kalle at reserve. When Kalle is missing through injury/unavailability, that's when Team E are realty laughing, because they can being in heat leaders from other teams and line them up at No 7.

 

So maybe there should be an average limit on riders who can guest at reserve? Maybe 6.00?

 

All the best

Rob

Edited October 9, 2016 by lucifer sam

[stewmac]

Really disappointed with the track today. Great weather leadin up to the meeting then we have riders strugglin with visiblity issues for nearly half the meeting. Coles, ayres and garcia very fortunate to escape injury. Very little racing, so a rammy brightened proceedings up a bit.

I wonder if that was a deliberate decision which ended up backfiring? 😂

[cyclone]

 

Cyclone, I largely agree with this, although I would point it is open to manipulation.

 

For example, a team - let's called them Team E for the sake of argument - sign a rider, let's call him Kalle, again for the sake of the argument. He thrives at reserve and pushes his average up to nearly 7.00.

 

In the meantime, team E continually replace a succession of useless riders on a 7.00 assessed average to keep Kalle at reserve. When Kalle is missing through injury/unavailability, that's when Team E are realty laughing, because they can being in heat leaders from other teams and line them up at No 7.

 

So maybe there should be an average limit on riders who can guest at reserve? Maybe 5.50?

 

All the best

Rob

 

Unlikely as the regs only permit a guest for a No. 7 to have been eligible to be at 7 at the beginning of the Season

 

Without fully checking, I think Liam Carr with a current GSA of 4.81 has the highest average of any current PL no.7,

Edited October 9, 2016 by cyclone

[lucifer sam]

 

Unlikely as the regs only permit a guest for a No. 7 to have been eligible to be at 7 at the beginning of the Season

 

Without fully checking, I think Liam Carr with a current GSA of 4.81 has the highest average of any current PL no.7,

 

 

Ah, for No 7 read No 6

 

But the guest regs are a minefield. They did try to almost do away with guests in 1991/92, ended up with too many lopsided meetings and soon went back to widespread use of guests.

 

As much as I'd like to see guests at reserve abolished, the reality is that doing that could ruin meetings as a spectacle.

 

All the best

Rob

Edited October 9, 2016 by lucifer sam

[MD]

Glasgow were beaten before a wheel was turned by what im sure was with the best intentions, by preparing the track heavily with biblical amounts of water to give the home team the edge but which did the opposite. Ayres was twice on his arse, Garcia bit the third bend air bag damaging his bike and both Lunna & Bach were clearly uncomfortable and not prepared to try the big runs round the third and fourth bends. Why we couldnt prepare it as seven days ago is lost on me, the weather has been good with no threat of rain.

 

A bit like British speedway we dont seem to learn from the past. I listened to the TM's interview that the team wanted the track the same as last week. Did they get it or was the incessant tractor grading a futile attempt to redress the problem? At the second grade the shale was coming away in clumps with the tractor driver dumping the mounds from the grate on the back straight.

 

The focus of the meeting will be about Bates but in reality it was a poor meeting strung out for too long. Three 1-5's from heats 6-8 and a further in ht14 confirmed Somerset a deserved win. Despite 9 race winners for Glasgow, we were often outgated for the other places. Makes Friday night a formality though we now see Josh Bates three times in the next seven days and incidents like today give dicks like him an edge to do that little bit better.

[drosser]

Bates certainly comes across as an erratic character with a huge chip (maybe even a fish supper) on his shoulder. However, today he stooped to a new low and seriously affected his already tarnished reputation and that of the sport in general (at least it was not televised this time). I agree that adrenaline builds up during high speed skirmishes and handbags are often waved around, often to the delight of the crowd. However, unprovoked vicious attacks can attract police intervention, as our football friends have discovered in the past.

 

Today we has a rider who has been struggling this season and rode like a d*ddy here a few weeks ago suddenly riding like a champion but losing control and behaving erratically and violently for no obvious reason. If I were a referee and had to choose a candidate for a random drugs test ............................... I don't know if he even received a fine.

 

As far as the meeting was concerned, we did not have enough riders on form (or trapping) to look convincing. The track was obviously doctored which appeared to backfire on us. Even when the track settled down there was very little racing - first out of the gate was very hard to beat.