Edinburgh 2017

[TheScotsman]

Post saved.

[JackAlexander Bestow]

Post saved.

LOL wait and see

[scotchopper]

In a real world, and we were staying in the EU, it would probably classed as restrictive practice. However the nation has voted to leave the EU, that alone will probably blow employment rules out of the water. The way the BSPA is set up is essentially a private club, and it's membership have to obey the club rules laid down, in other words they are a rule to themselves, and can generally do as they wish, excluding any normal employment rules, as they have done and are doing. The only control set is on immigration where a visitor to the UK must obey Visa rules set down by the State, which cannot be overruled by the private club.

That's what football thought and then we had Bosman, sports are no different to any other employers and have to meet employment law. speedway is a little different in terms of the riders essentially being self employed but if someone was willing to take the bspa to court for these restrictions on averages and number of british riders etc I am pretty sure they would win, very unlikely as it would be too expensive. Some will change when we come out of EU but not that much. Might actually make it easier for aussies as they are currently screwed compared to Europeans.

Edited December 30, 2016 by scotchopper

[balderdash&piffle]

That's what football thought and then we had Bosman, sports are no different to any other employers and have to meet employment law. speedway is a little different in terms of the riders essentially being self employed but if someone was willing to take the bspa to court for these restrictions on averages and number of british riders etc I am pretty sure they would win, very unlikely as it would be too expensive. Some will change when we come out of EU but not that much. Might actually make it easier for aussies as they are currently screwed compared to Europeans.

Don't see why an Australian should be favoured over any other immigrant from without the EU, it is probable that the Mae woman will have to come to an agreement with the EU to allow the UK to trade in the Single Market and the Customs union. However if we Brexit completely, and do not come to an agreement over access in the EU, then everyone outside the UK and it's Dominions ( Gibralter etc. etc.). All will be subject to normal visa rules, including all EU countries, which would surely be a bigger headache for speedway than losing a few under performing Aussies.

[New era Panthers]

Control the wage structure, and heavily fine promotions who abuse it. Big big changes still needed, if they play on tinkering at the edges, you, me or anyone else will not have speedway before long.

Control the wage structure , you're having a laugh , there are so many ways this could be abused, signing on bonus , cash in hand payments , hire vans availability or free lodgings and workshops and whatever else promoters can think of without breaking the pay structure. All promoters would know the rule and would also know how to get round it and I suspect they all would do this to get what they wanted provided the resources where there without being detected

[snapper]

Good luck to the lad, apparently Jye Etheridge has told Josh that Edinburgh is a great club to sign for, he will be given plenty of time to develop, he won't be put under any pressure to score points, in Sam Masters a great captain and fellow country man who will be behind him 100% . Lol

Is this the same Jye Etheridge that the Monarchs slated in the national press as being "The worst ever Monarch" aye welcome to the club mate

[Lioness]

Why should the employment status in Speedway be any different from other jobs or sports?

 

Given that your suggestion would further reduce the availability of potential signings, you would probably end up with the "favoured few" demanding financial rewards that do not reflect their actual ability.

 

The clubs with the financial clout would get the best, and the rest would be scrambling to sign overpriced wobblers.

We don't often agree but Cyclone has it spot on here. It already happens to a certain extent, how many posts are made accusing clubs of throwing silly money at riders when they are enticed from one club to another?

 

Fair enough you are trying to come up with a solution balderdash&piffle which is more than I can do but I honestly think your idea would exacerbate the problem rather than help it as you'd be restricting supply and increasing demand

[ekimba]

Is this the same Jye Etheridge that the Monarchs slated in the national press as being "The worst ever Monarch" aye welcome to the club mate

 

Take it you don't do irony, the lol is a giveaway :-)

[Endeavour]

If your favoured Speedway team finds a loophole in rules they are astute. If another team does it they are bending rules.

 

Will Mitchell Davey ever reach a level to ride for team GB or Australia for that matter? Not likely.

 

How many of the number 7s will?

[Fromafar]

Control the wage structure , you're having a laugh , there are so many ways this could be abused, signing on bonus , cash in hand payments , hire vans availability or free lodgings and workshops and whatever else promoters can think of without breaking the pay structure. All promoters would know the rule and would also know how to get round it and I suspect they all would do this to get what they wanted provided the resources where there without being detected

That was exactly what happened in the Mid /80's. When they tied to introduce wage freeze on points money,promoters just abused it to get one/up on each other.

[proud panther]

Regarding Edinburgh's chances of success next season, there are doubts that some riders will improve or maintain their averages. However, most teams have the same problem in my opinion. If the new Aussie turns out ok, they have another rider to add to their asset base. Would rather have him than a 5 point journeyman, who has no chance of improving.

[KIRKYLANE]

Mark Riss on a 4 is an absolute steal

 

IF Pickering can do a decent job then this team is better than last year.

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

Mark Riss on a 4 is an absolute steal

 

IF Pickering can do a decent job then this team is better than last year.

and if so proves why any non Brit shouldve been back on no less than 5.

 

Unfortunately enough teams wanted to keep sub 5 non Brits to vote through the change....

[cyclone]

and if so proves why any non Brit shouldve been back on no less than 5.

 

Unfortunately enough teams wanted to keep sub 5 non Brits to vote through the change....

 

.

 

Mark Riss's real average was 3.27 so he will still be penalised by starting the 2017 Season with an assessed higher average, namely 4.00

 

Compare this to Dan Bewley whose final real average was 4.00 and who will benefit from a further 2.5% reduction for being a less experienced British newcomer.

 

No problem with Dan's reduced team building average, but I would consider him to be more of an "absolute steal" than Mark.

 

Don't see the logic of your argument and IMO it comes across as "Little Englander's" prejudice towards "Johnny Foreigner"

Edited December 30, 2016 by cyclone

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

 

 

Don't see the logic of your argument and IMO it comes across as "Little Englander's" prejudice towards "Johnny Foreigner"

'there are none so blind as those that will not see' or words to that effect.

 

It isnt about Mark Riss, Campton, Gappmaier, Wallner or any other individual rider. Many get too hung up about an individual favourite from their own team rather than the bigger picture.

 

Its about setting a standard at 5 which seemed a sensible level only to alter the next year to suit rather than stick to an agreed principle.

[cyclone]

'there are none so blind as those that will not see' or words to that effect.

 

It isnt about Mark Riss, Campton, Gappmaier, Wallner or any other individual rider. Many get too hung up about an individual favourite from their own team rather than the bigger picture.

 

Its about setting a standard at 5 which seemed a sensible level only to alter the next year to suit rather than stick to an agreed principle.

 

UK Speedway would be more credible if it did not impose artificial averages on any rider based on nationality, once they have achieved an actual GSA.

 

No problem with overseas riders being given an assessed starting average which reflects their previous experience (foreign league exposure, SGP participation etc.), but once they have an actual GSA , they should then be treated the same as UK nationals.

 

When Speedway was thriving in the UK, we did not have this nonsense of discriminating against overseas riders.

 

If they were not good enough, they were binned, and if anyone believes that a Promoter would hang on to foreign duds, I'd be interested to know if anyone can give examples and whether they sought an explanation from the said Promoter.

[StevePark]

 

UK Speedway would be more credible if it did not impose artificial averages on any rider based on nationality, once they have achieved an actual GSA.

 

No problem with overseas riders being given an assessed starting average which reflects their previous experience (foreign league exposure, SGP participation etc.), but once they have an actual GSA , they should then be treated the same as UK nationals.

 

When Speedway was thriving in the UK, we did not have this nonsense of discriminating against overseas riders.

 

If they were not good enough, they were binned, and if anyone believes that a Promoter would hang on to foreign duds, I'd be interested to know if anyone can give examples and whether they sought an explanation from the said Promoter.

 

It depends on what you call "good enough" though, doesn't it? New Aussie coming in on a 5, achieves a 4. Good enough? New Aussie comes in on a 5, been around for years, still hasn't achieved a 4 and is now classed as British. Good enough? New Aussie comes in on a 5, a few years later becomes World Champion. Good enough.

[Gavan]

Mark Riss on a 4 is an absolute steal

 

IF Pickering can do a decent job then this team is better than last year.

I will have some of what your smoking please

 

The heat leader trio of Masters , Wolbert and Fisher is stronger than this years Masters, Wells and Riss

Second strings last year the Riss brothers are stronger than Pickering and Clegg

And this years reserves Riss and Davey similar to Clegg and Bewley last year.

 

A half decent side now the limit is lowered but better than last year? Not by a long shot

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

 

When Speedway was thriving in the UK, we did not have this nonsense of discriminating against overseas riders.

 

dont think thats the case.

 

During those times there were only a few non Brits outside the top tier (coming in on a 9 I think) and those in the top flight had to achieve 6 to stay there.

[tyretrax]

To Cyclone, Wolbert at Glasgow.