Crazy robin Posted October 17, 2016 Report Share Posted October 17, 2016 (edited) If the reserves at the start of the season have to be two Brits he will likely be facing riders of the same standard of this past season. I hope they retain the edr its helped bring on some riders and better to have two Brit edrs than jonny foreigner. Don't agree Steve as it was never fair fromday one & still isn't. Edited October 17, 2016 by Crazy robin 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starman2006 Posted October 17, 2016 Report Share Posted October 17, 2016 Have none of you got anything better to do than drag this out for another 5000 posts, which predominantely about Kyle Newman and Poole. There are another 7 clubs with EDR riders. But as per usual the majority is aimed at Poole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillipsr Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 If the reserves at the start of the season have to be two Brits he will likely be facing riders of the same standard of this past season. I hope they retain the edr its helped bring on some riders and better to have two Brit edrs than jonny foreigner. Who has it actually helped bring on? The only rider I can think of is Steve Worrall the rest are either where they were previously or have improved as most thought they would anyway? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 Adam Ellis. Joe Jacobs. Jason Garrity. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TesarRacing Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 Rye House and Ipswich is what I heard a few weeks ago, with Leicester dropping down. If Ipswich move up I am soooo looking forward to coming on the Poole v Ipswich threads next season!! I think my team could be on the money. 1. Chris Holder 2. Jack Holder 3. Hans Andersen 4. Troy Batchelor 5. Krzysztof Kasprzak 6. Kyle Newman 7. Paul Starke Perfect time for Jack to be named in the 2017 Poole Pirates team imo. Jack should ride at No.2 whilst Chris rides at No.1. What average would Jack come in on Skidder1? Wot no Bjarne?! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj350z Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 If Ipswich move up I am soooo looking forward to coming on the Poole v Ipswich threads next season!! Ah but maybe Poole are dropping down to the PL so that Matt can have Kyle on a PL average!!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillipsr Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 Adam Ellis. Joe Jacobs. Jason Garrity. Ellis would of been an EL reserve regardless same with Garrity but ill give you Jacobs although only to get him back into the sport Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 Who has it actually helped bring on? The only rider I can think of is Steve Worrall the rest are either where they were previously or have improved as most thought they would anyway? Paul Starke has come on leaps and bounds since the EDR, he was just a bumbling along NL rider before it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Beevers Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 Ellis would of been an EL reserve regardless same with Garrity but ill give you Jacobs although only to get him back into the sport Max Clegg. Unknown conference rider last year and wins the U19s,CLRC and the Elite League title. I don't think any rider in the world can say they had a better year than him thanks to EDR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shale Searcher Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 My list above Ok remove Masters , Richie Worrall, and Tungate and the other averages should be correct then. Jacobs and Worrall look a steal to me! Ok so if a rider rides here on a 5 average at the start of his career, doesnt ride here for 5 years, and in that time then becomes a top gp rider you think its ok to come back on a 5? Of course they have to be reassessed. If a rider is looked at as a "steal" on a particular average, then patently it's "NOT" a real world average, it's somehow contrived/manipulated to suit.. and should be thrown away/disregarded and an assessment made by the authorities.. Kyle Newman a 3.79? So you are saying on average, in the elite league, he should ave 3.79 points per 4 races?? So he finishes third or worse most of the time in the elite league... How can you in all honesty, actually say that??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillipsr Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 (edited) Max Clegg. Unknown conference rider last year and wins the U19s,CLRC and the Elite League title. I don't think any rider in the world can say they had a better year than him thanks to EDR. Max Clegg wasn't an unknown NL rider last year (had a nearly 9pt average) came 2nd in the U19 to Josh Bates and only missed the NLRC due to injury where he would of been one of the favourites don't think EDR has done anything to improve him he would of progressed at the rate he has anyway Edited October 18, 2016 by phillipsr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavan Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 (edited) If a rider is looked at as a "steal" on a particular average, then patently it's "NOT" a real world average, it's somehow contrived/manipulated to suit.. and should be thrown away/disregarded and an assessment made by the authorities.. Kyle Newman a 3.79? So you are saying on average, in the elite league, he should ave 3.79 points per 4 races?? So he finishes third or worse most of the time in the elite league... How can you in all honesty, actually say that??? im not the one saying Kyle Newman should be on a 3.79 average! It's mainly 1 Poole fan and I'm saying he should be about 5. I highlighted other riders with premier conversions and Joe Jacobs on 3.02 is a steal for sure. Kyle Newman can not ride elite league on a 3.79 average Edited October 18, 2016 by Gavan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillipsr Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 Paul Starke has come on leaps and bounds since the EDR, he was just a bumbling along NL rider before it. Ill give you Paul Starke he has improved Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 If a rider is looked at as a "steal" on a particular average, then patently it's "NOT" a real world average, it's somehow contrived/manipulated to suit.. and should be thrown away/disregarded and an assessment made by the authorities.. There have always been and there will always be riders on a "steal" of an average. Some riders have bad seasons, you'll never stop that. Rolling averages goes some way towards addressing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray c Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 Max Clegg wasn't an unknown NL rider last year (had a nearly 9pt average) came 2nd in the U19 to Josh Bates and only missed the NLRC due to injury where he would of been one of the favourites don't think EDR has done anything to improve him he would of progressed at the rate he has anywaydon't agree I've seen max at Poole this season and the edr has improved him know ends Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillipsr Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 don't agree I've seen max at Poole this season and the edr has improved him know ends Hes also still a low averaging reserve in the PL so again cant see how he has improved anymore than he would have 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinny Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 The draft has brought riders like s worrall, starke, c wright, kerr, newman, garrity, jacobs, clegg etc on a bundle but its time most of those were refused a draft place and used in the 1-5 now. But it has for sure improved lots of young/youngish brits 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Shovlar Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 If a rider is looked at as a "steal" on a particular average, then patently it's "NOT" a real world average, it's somehow contrived/manipulated to suit.. and should be thrown away/disregarded and an assessment made by the authorities.. Kyle Newman a 3.79? So you are saying on average, in the elite league, he should ave 3.79 points per 4 races?? So he finishes third or worse most of the time in the elite league... How can you in all honesty, actually say that??? No one in the past few posts has mentioned that Kyle has improved as an edr rider. Other riders have been mentioned but not Newman. Has he not improved as an edr? Kyle on 3.79 is about right. He spent more or less the whole season at reserve so was racing against riders of a similar standard. Yes he was beating them as well, so he was one of the better edr riders no doubt about it. But up in the team he struggled in general. He will probably be slightly disappointed in his progression in 2016 but he had two time outs, one life threatening so really he did better than tread water, But in the PL he was racing against other heat leaders and only acheived a 6.3 average. A much clearer reading of his worth. Some have pointed to beating Woffinden from the back around Monmore. It was a fantastic performance. But 9 times out of ten that wouldn't happen. The same equation must be used across the board for all edr riders. You can't single out certain riders because you think they might do better and lumber them with a higher average. As all are Brits the bspa should look favourably on them all. Give all edr's a 3.5 starting average for next season so that none are left by the wayside when it comes to team building averages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve0 Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 ... The same equation must be used across the board for all edr riders. You can't single out certain riders because you think they might do better and lumber them with a higher average. As all are Brits the bspa should look favourably on them all. Give all edr's a 3.5 starting average for next season so that none are left by the wayside when it comes to team building averages. I think everyone has been saying that the same equation should be applied to all EDRs - based on their EL performances. You cannot, however, give them all the same average as this doesn't take account of their ability (as you well know). As an example, a team could field Newman and Bates while another may have to have Clegg and Sarjeant - I think even you can see the imbalance there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevebrum Posted October 18, 2016 Report Share Posted October 18, 2016 No one in the past few posts has mentioned that Kyle has improved as an edr rider. Other riders have been mentioned but not Newman. Has he not improved as an edr? For the past 3 seasons I would say he has been the outstanding EDR rider and has beaten quality riders from the opening season. But has he improved?? In 3 years minimal at best. His PL average has barely changed and in fact gone backwards which if you look at the bigger picture it's difficult to argue he has massively improved. Riders who definetly have tho I'd say ... Steve Worrall - was a struggling PL reserve/ NL standard at best 4 years ago then had a break thru year and has kicked on since overtaking his brother who was a PL heat leader at the time and threatening an EL breakthrough also. Since the draft he has gone from strength to strength and has broken out the reserve berth for a large portion of this season. Jason Garrity - deemed himself to good to be an EDR and stayed in the 1-5 albeit due to poor performing reserves but can still be considered a success and a route the likes of Ellis, Worrall, Newman should follow. Has established himself as a true PL heat leader. Paul Starke - since his selection for Poole last year he too has stepped up in performance. Was excellent back up to Kyle and made big improvements in the PL too. He has Continued that level this season establishing himself in the PL whilst has the higher EDR average over the much more experienced Auty. Adam Ellis - why he hadn't concentrated on PL instead of NL is baffling but has been an equal to Kyle in reserve for Poole and actually finishes the season with a higher EDR average. Even more amazing considering he only has NL racing as back up. Josh Bates - has improved year on year and backed up by a much improved season in the PL by establishing himself as a main team PL rider. James Sarjeant - has improved from last season to this more from PL perspective. Lewis Rose - slight improvement and has stepped out the shadow of Kerr. Max Clegg - improvement year on year and this must be his best year in the sport. Took a while to get going in the EL but had some outstanding moments. The rest haven't really kicked on. Howarth has been hit and miss and hasn't really improved that much other than an improved season in the PL. Wright has been steady without much improvement either way. Kerr has done well to come back from injury so not expecting to do too much. Auty has been a disappointment whilst Nelsien has stayed similar level. Kyle would easily be the best of the rest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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