brianbuck Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 (edited) The race format should be revamped and teams should consist of three pairings and only one reserve who should be given two programmed rides. With having only one reserve, and only obliged to use him in two races promoters would be more likely to persevere with him all season rather than chop and change trying to get the extra point. Currently, the reserves play far too big a role in matches with a free scoring reserve taking seven rides completely distorting results. A six man team proper with just one reserve was successfully used for several years in the mid-1950's. This apart, the rules relating to starting should be revised. There should be no replacement for a rider excluded for tape touching or for exceeding the two minutes time allowance. Too many riders consistently try it on at the tapes and are encouraged to do so by team manager's secure in knowing that they have an often better replacement waiting in the wings. The rule book should also clearly define what "two minutes" actually means. I think there should be a line drawn two metres behind the start line, and riders should have to have their front wheels on it within two minutes of the warning being sounded - and having reached it,they shouldn't be allowed to turn back! Edited August 20, 2016 by BBuck 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldyman Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 For the starts I don't see why in this modern age they can't use a light and transponders like some other motorbike sports Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 The current system clearly doesn't work, I feel for the number 7s in this league as they must feel like lambs to slaughter. It amazes me you have riders averaging 8/9/10 in the National League but they struggle to muster much over then 3 in this league, Contrast that to the 8/9/10 pt PL riders that ride in the EL, do they only struggle much over 3? No they dont becuase the transition is easier them leagues buts huge between the the PL and NL that the sport needs to address. A top speedway rider doesn't just appear out of the National League, they need confidence and the right nurturing to make it. Both reserves should be NL riders, and two of their four rides should be reserve heats. The other two should against riders in the main body, at least in the reserve heats you have four riders of similar standard so closer racing then your heat 2s now. Whether you would keep them protected at reserve for the entire season Im not sure but surely that wont be as bad as it is now where their confidence is being shot to pieces week in, week out. The issue is that over the year the EL and NL have got weaker while generally the PL has got stronger. So you have to options to fix the problem you describe. Make the EL and NL stronger so the jump form NL to PL is less but the jump from PL to EL is more. OR the PL lowers it's standards so it's a move progressive move up the leagues. The PL has got too strong, it needs to lower the points limit to about 37 or 38 but also put a limit on heat leaders so that some of the better ones are forced into the EL full time. Spot on the FTR has ruined EL( it is only to save money there really) do you want the same in the PL ? How has it ruined the EL? It's one of the best things to ever happen. It has got rid of a load of pointless foreigners and replace them with Brits who are now in a number of cases starting to settle as decent second strings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted August 21, 2016 Report Share Posted August 21, 2016 S worrall garritty Ellis starke bates are surely all examples of the ftr scheme working Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FAST GATER Posted August 21, 2016 Report Share Posted August 21, 2016 S worrall garritty Ellis starke bates are surely all examples of the ftr scheme working IMO all of those would have made the grade regardless, FTR is money saving nothing more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWC Posted August 21, 2016 Report Share Posted August 21, 2016 Ole Olsen once famously remarked that the best way to sort out UK speedway was to shut down the Elite league. I think his off the cuff comment is closer than we ever envisaged and the time is right to invest in the NL. Our much meligned promoters should come clean and say that we cannot continue as we are with an EL that's become a joke. Perhaps then it will concentrate people's mind if they want this great sport to survive or not and the NL will become the lifeblood of the sport as it frankly should. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted August 21, 2016 Report Share Posted August 21, 2016 IMO all of those would have made the grade regardless, FTR is money saving nothing more And that's a bad thing? I don't see how getting rid of Ales Dryml, Andreas Messing, Kauko Nieminen, Filip Sitera and the almost ended list of naff foreigners in reserve berths has done the EL any harm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidney the robin Posted August 21, 2016 Report Share Posted August 21, 2016 S worrall garritty Ellis starke bates are surely all examples of the ftr scheme working IMO all of those would have made the grade regardless, FTR is money saving nothing more I agree all those named would of progressed anyway nothing to do with the FTR . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FAST GATER Posted August 22, 2016 Report Share Posted August 22, 2016 (edited) And that's a bad thing? I don't see how getting rid of Ales Dryml, Andreas Messing, Kauko Nieminen, Filip Sitera and the almost ended list of naff foreigners in reserve berths has done the EL any harm Imo non of the above would stopped the a fore mentioned British riders from making the grade, if I was remotely convinced that FTR was anything other than making the EL a viable product then I would throw my whole support behind it but it is not .Nothing wrong with giving our lads a leg up as it were but this is not the way to do it . We haven't touched on the abuse of the system such as Coventry allegedly wanting Garritty to stay at reserve rather than "progress" to the main team !!!! Edited August 22, 2016 by FAST GATER Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben91 Posted August 22, 2016 Report Share Posted August 22, 2016 S worrall garritty Ellis starke bates are surely all examples of the ftr scheme working Agreed, Worrall and Garrity are the only two there that would be EL riders now without the fast track scheme. Starke has been knocking around for ages and only really kicked on towards PL heat leader level this year, his scoring improved dramatically after he started getting FTR appearances so if he hadn't he may well still be a 4-5 point PL reserve now. Ellis undoubtedly would have got there on his own but it's hard to judge as he hasn't had a PL ride since 2014 when he averaged around four. Bates definitely wouldn't be getting EL rides yet without the draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speed ace Posted August 22, 2016 Report Share Posted August 22, 2016 IMO all of those would have made the grade regardless, FTR is money saving nothing more It doesn't matter if you agree or disagree about why the system is in place or whether or not these guys would or wouldn't have progressed. The simple fact is it gives them more track time and has probably brought them on at a quicker rate by riding 60-80 meetings per season rather than 20-30 as they would have if only riding in one league instead of 2 or 3. It does also help them by spending time with riders who have more experience, even if some may not share their knowledge directly, lots can be learned just from watching them preparing for meetings. It served that purpose, what the authorities need to do now is move it forward and bring in a fresh batch to get them plenty of track time and experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted August 22, 2016 Report Share Posted August 22, 2016 We haven't touched on the abuse of the system such as Coventry allegedly wanting Garritty to stay at reserve rather than "progress" to the main team !!!! Coventry didn't want garritty to stay at reserve. They simply wanted him to start the season at reserve. He would have been promoted to 2nd string after a month, and the team would have been play off contenders meaning he would likely have got more meetings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FAST GATER Posted August 22, 2016 Report Share Posted August 22, 2016 It doesn't matter if you agree or disagree about why the system is in place or whether or not these guys would or wouldn't have progressed. The simple fact is it gives them more track time and has probably brought them on at a quicker rate by riding 60-80 meetings per season rather than 20-30 as they would have if only riding in one league instead of 2 or 3. It does also help them by spending time with riders who have more experience, even if some may not share their knowledge directly, lots can be learned just from watching them preparing for meetings. It served that purpose, what the authorities need to do now is move it forward and bring in a fresh batch to get them plenty of track time and experience. We will just have to beg to differ if you are happy to have 5 rider teams in the EL with cheap labour tagged onto make 7 man teams so be it ,it has been said on a number of occasions the EL can't survive without the FTR riders and not by me I might add. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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