What Changes Have To Be Made In 2017?

[Sidney the robin]

This year for me the EL has been a disaster i know the weather has had a huge bearing on things but the fixture planning has been a farce. Weeks in between meetings fans often starved of regular racing what needs to be changed.? i don't know what the answers are though.My thoughts are that there are two ways of doing things get a regular race night sorted out then that allowing GP riders to maybe ride five or 10 meetings a year ( can we afford them?).Or go another way maybe amalgamate the league's, have a lesser type of rider but fans still get regular meetings get more variety and get entertained what do the fans think.?

[speedibee]

well 2 elite tracks were set to be closed this year . Arena and Coventry , I know Coventry have a stay of execution but dotn know about arena for 2017 , Leicester look to be on shaky ground with their Leasee in trouble both financially and with the BSPA , In Leicester's case amalgamation would likely be a lifesaver . as Hemsleys Ego would remain intact in the top division , while the supporters get regular racing and at a level where a winning teram is a distinct possibility and affordable

[Gresham]

Imo, we have as fans become set in our ways and reluctant to certain changes...which is ironic when the sport changes it's rules pretty much every season.

 

Personally I think there is too much control and power by the riders and other people who make a living from the sport like tuners. They seem to dictate how things are run.

 

Imo, Fans want a team to support on a regular basis, on a regular race night, against varied opposition...not the same teams and riders.

 

They want it on well prepared tracks, with good presentation and entertainment and value for money.

 

Personally I'd try and find a way of merging Elite and Premier league. We have so many double up riders, apart from a few riders, there isn't a big gulf in ability.

I've seen these top riders struggle just as much as the Prem boys.

You only have to look at the likes of Cook and Lambert in the SWC final...a point or so adrift of what Lindback and Doyle scored...it's the same every week and often down to machinery and not ability.

 

If the top boys don't want to ride here...then so be it. I've been far more entertained watching Prem speedway than elite this season. I don't look at Prem and think it's miles adrift from the elite in ability...it's not. As Rosco said recently...the Elite league is just 'Elite' by name, not in reality.

 

In the long term, we need to find a way of making the bikes compatible with the race tracks. We need to reduce costs and restrict bikes more. I'd personally like 'Team or Club' engines introduced in the future. For Individual events let the riders do what they want.

 

We also need to find a way of making surfaces adapt to water better and find a way of making bikes able to race on a wetter surface. Plus find a way of protecting the tacks better from the elements.

 

That last sentence is a basic need for this sport....it's a no brainer. We live in a Country where it rains a lot. It's common sense. Way too many rain off's....this has to be addressed imo.

[The White Knight]

The introduction of sensible and fair Rules and Regulations would be a start.

 

Bikes, Engines and Tracks should also be looked at with a view to make Racing safer too.

 

Oh how I yearn for the days when four Riders were hurtling around the Tracks of this Country throwing up dirt/shale. I went home covered in it many a time and I loved it.

 

I don't suppose that nowadays, because of 'Health and Safety' and modern engines we could get back the smell of good old Castrol 'R'. Too much to hope for I suppose but all of this was part of what encouraged me to attend Speedway.

 

Regarding my first point - I believe that it is essential that some changes are made.

 

My last points are pure nostalgia and will never return. :sad:

[sparkafag]

The introduction of sensible and fair Rules and Regulations would be a start.

 

 

Other than the tactical rule what changes would you make to the rules? What specific rules and what specific changes?

[The White Knight]

 

 

Other than the tactical rule what changes would you make to the rules? What specific rules and what specific changes?

That would do me for a start.

 

Thank you for bringing it up - I didn't want to mention it.

[RobMcCaffery]

In the long term one combined league at current PL level but only with riders able to commit to a very high percentage of fixtures, if not all (barring injuries of course) is the sensible way forward but first attitudes need to change on both sides of the fence.

 

It would be an abject disaster to let this current set of EL tracks inflict their ills on the PL - constant absences, riders not putting in 100% commitment and a preparedness to miss week after week of fixtures in prime racing weather and insane team rules. Equally it seems far too many of their supporters take the attitude that racing at a lower level means less entertainment and some even seem to take it as an affront to their pride. The "I don't DO second division" mentality seems to still be far too common.

 

So, it has to be option one - let people find out for themselves the realities of single night racing and whether it was that, not money, that was putting off riders racing here. If it works then fine but if not perhaps there will be a greater willingness to see sense afterwards.

 

To the realities of single night racing. One rain off and you have nearly a month without a home meeting, which takes you right back to the current fixture shortage.

 

A more direct problem is, assuming by some miracle there are 8 teams in the 2017 EL you have to decide whether it's one match home and away or two.

 

If one, then you have seven home league matches in the year, over a 14 week regular season, say May to August, then half of the tracks get one extra play-off meeting and a quarter two, making a grand total of nine for the finalists. Half of the league will have closed by the August Bank Holiday while Easter and the whole of April will have been lost, unless the 14 week season is stretched out with gaps which would be likely I suppose in view of events like the SWC.

 

So there we are, a season like Sweden's, crammed into the high summer months and where supporters can only see one match a week. Sweden's climate needs such a condensed, brief season with an eight month close season. Do we?

 

If you take the other option and race two home and two away you are back to the current schedule of 14 home league matches plus possible play-offs adding one or two extra fixtures. This season would require a minimum of 30 weeks, assuming you add an extra day's racing to the play-off weeks. If not you're looking at a 32 week season. There will have to be gaps for events such as the SWC and possibly GPs. Rain-offs would either have to be accommodated by having spare weeks or racing on an 'off' night.

 

We'd be looking at a 30-36 week season running from early March to late October. On one hand that would be great, only having a four month close season again but I do wonder if it would work? Would the star riders come flooding back? Wolverhampton, by sharing with Cradley, are effectively testing the fortnightly racing option so it will be interesting to hear how they view the experiment after they've completed it.

 

One fixed race night will in reality most likely mean seven meeting seasons plus play-offs. Is it really worth crippling our fixtures in the vain hope that top riders will flock back and not just use us as a testing league were they can pick up pin money, pulling out when they feel like it, and coming up with lame excuses for doing so such as 'giving a kid a chance'?

 

As I say, perhaps the EL needs to find out the hard way - then we can sit down in 2018 and come up with a sustainable system that recognises that you can't sustain costs higher than when your crowds were numbered in the thousands than in the hundreds.

 

Right now I don't think the EL is ready to make an amalgamation work. Certainly too many of their supporters are showing loud and clear here that they won't even try to make it work.

[sparkafag]

That would do me for a start.

 

Thank you for bringing it up - I didn't want to mention it.

 

 

What else…..

[The White Knight]

In the long term one combined league at current PL level but only with riders able to commit to a very high percentage of fixtures, if not all (barring injuries of course) is the sensible way forward but first attitudes need to change on both sides of the fence.

 

It would be an abject disaster to let this current set of EL tracks inflict their ills on the PL - constant absences, riders not putting in 100% commitment and a preparedness to miss week after week of fixtures in prime racing weather and insane team rules. Equally it seems far too many of their supporters take the attitude that racing at a lower level means less entertainment and some even seem to take it as an affront to their pride. The "I don't DO second division" mentality seems to still be far too common.

 

So, it has to be option one - let people find out for themselves the realities of single night racing and whether it was that, not money, that was putting off riders racing here. If it works then fine but if not perhaps there will be a greater willingness to see sense afterwards.

 

To the realities of single night racing. One rain off and you have nearly a month without a home meeting, which takes you right back to the current fixture shortage.

 

A more direct problem is, assuming by some miracle there are 8 teams in the 2017 EL you have to decide whether it's one match home and away or two.

 

If one, then you have seven home league matches in the year, over a 14 week regular season, say May to August, then half of the tracks get one extra play-off meeting and a quarter two, making a grand total of nine for the finalists. Half of the league will have closed by the August Bank Holiday while Easter and the whole of April will have been lost, unless the 14 week season is stretched out with gaps which would be likely I suppose in view of events like the SWC.

 

So there we are, a season like Sweden's, crammed into the high summer months and where supporters can only see one match a week. Sweden's climate needs such a condensed, brief season with an eight month close season. Do we?

 

If you take the other option and race two home and two away you are back to the current schedule of 14 home league matches plus possible play-offs adding one or two extra fixtures. This season would require a minimum of 30 weeks, assuming you add an extra day's racing to the play-off weeks. If not you're looking at a 32 week season. There will have to be gaps for events such as the SWC and possibly GPs. Rain-offs would either have to be accommodated by having spare weeks or racing on an 'off' night.

 

We'd be looking at a 30-36 week season running from early March to late October. On one hand that would be great, only having a four month close season again but I do wonder if it would work? Would the star riders come flooding back? Wolverhampton, by sharing with Cradley, are effectively testing the fortnightly racing option so it will be interesting to hear how they view the experiment after they've completed it.

 

One fixed race night will in reality most likely mean seven meeting seasons plus play-offs. Is it really worth crippling our fixtures in the vain hope that top riders will flock back and not just use us as a testing league were they can pick up pin money, pulling out when they feel like it, and coming up with lame excuses for doing so such as 'giving a kid a chance'?

 

As I say, perhaps the EL needs to find out the hard way - then we can sit down in 2018 and come up with a sustainable system that recognises that you can't sustain costs higher than when your crowds were numbered in the thousands than in the hundreds.

 

Right now I don't think the EL is ready to make an amalgamation work. Certainly too many of their supporters are showing loud and clear here that they won't even try to make it work.

Well said sir.

 

 

What else…..

As you ask.

 

I would change the Rules about returning to the Pits/third bend after a Tape offence - no need for it it just holds up Racing for the Punters - same to apply for first bend bunching stoppage - injuries/Bike readiness permitting. (Obviously).

 

I would stop Riders from starting from 15mtrs back for a Tape offence. Bring in a Reserve automatically.

 

I would also make Referees put on the two minute warning immediately following each Heat. That should be rigidly applied.

 

The Sport is about Entertainment and anything that holds up Racing (apart from injuries obviously), should be eradicated as far as possible.

 

I know that this is only tinkering with the Rules but anything that improves the Speedway experience has to be a good thing.

 

As I think you know - 'Double Points' is the big one for me though.

 

I would like to stop doubling up and doubling down too - but I realise that at present this is impossible.

Edited August 4, 2016 by The White Knight

[foamfence]

There are too many clubs and too few riders. The lame duck clubs need pruning or put into the NL. One league clustered around weekend racing would allow riders to have off-track occupations. There is a need to get away from comparison to overseas leagues and the obsession with certain individual riders. Adopt the engine that Sam Ermolenko has been involved with and cut down the cost of competing, there are tyres that'll do five meetings, they should be used. Too much attention is based on the opinions of those who have a vested interest in keeping costs as high as possible. Get rid of all the Mickey Mouse ideas that try to falsify results and see riders in different teams night after night.

[moxey63]

I too would like sensible rules. It is what any sport thrives on. I churn when I see riders slowing down near the flag to allow an opponent passed because they don't want their side to use double points farce. It happened as recent as in the World Cup last week. If a supporter of 40 years doesn't like it, why do you expect the media to suddenly cotton on that this speedway lark is the real deal.

 

Speedway will only be saved by 13 heats and tac-sub for being six in arrears. We all know it...

 

Another thing to help it move towards being taken more seriously by this man of sense, is ban bloody riders from multi-tasking and riding all over the place. It is team speedway that the sport thrives on, and that importance has evaporated over the past 10 years or so. I saw it start in the mid-90s, when a four-team meet at Belle Vue had to be delayed while some riders got delayed on their way back from the Swedish League or something. Nothing like staring at your programme for upto an hour while the boys booked to appear manage to drop by. I knew then we were just a day-in-the-week for many. They spread themselves much to fine, some of them do.

 

Like somebody else mentioned, I couldn't give two doodles if riders decide to take their greed elsewhere. The main thing is that a fan, like me, can believe the blokes in their side are doing their best for his club. I mean, how many believe that superstar singer who greets his audience with the line "the best audience I've had." I'm amazed he knows where he even is... as I am about today's riders. When you ply your trade here, there and everywhere, it is just a job. When a rider in your team has a bad meeting, you want to know it's because he isn't saving himself or perhaps arranged with his boss to drop his average and allow for another signing for the Play-Offs.

 

It makes me cringe, it does... when that Nige Pearson constantly tells the audience "he (whoever he may be)

races here, in Sweden, Denmark, sometimes Poland and Russia, over here, over there....

 

Speedway riders have become agency workers and clubs are being used like company rep cars.

 

Now... let's all have a go at moxey... Then again, I know whiteknight will give me a "like."

Edited August 4, 2016 by moxey63

[BWitcher]

That would do me for a start.

 

Thank you for bringing it up - I didn't want to mention it.

 

Of course not, because you'd be foolish.. yearning for the days when there were far more 'tactical' changes and it was far 'unfairer'.

 

Now, there will be a maximum of one tactical ride in a meeting.. and in many meetings there isn't one at all.

I too would like sensible rules. It is what any sport thrives on. I churn when I see riders slowing down near the flag to allow an opponent passed because they don't want their side to use double points farce. It happened as recent as in the World Cup last week. If a supporter of 40 years doesn't like it, why do you expect the media to suddenly cotton on that this speedway lark is the real deal.

 

Speedway will only be saved by 13 heats and tac-sub for being six in arrears. We all know it...

 

 

 

You don't churn very often then, just once a year at the World Cup? Which of course is irrelevant to league racing in the UK.

 

Then to top it off you want to return to a system which encouraged precisely what you 'churn' about!

 

And yes, 13 heats is a great idea! Fans already complain about value for money from 15 heats.. lets take 2 away"

Edited August 4, 2016 by BWitcher

[sparkafag]

Well said sir.

As you ask.

 

I would change the Rules about returning to the Pits/third bend after a Tape offence - no need for it it just holds up Racing for the Punters - same to apply for first bend bunching stoppage - injuries/Bike readiness permitting. (Obviously).

 

I would stop Riders from starting from 15mtrs back for a Tape offence. Bring in a Reserve automatically.

 

I would also make Referees put on the two minute warning immediately following each Heat. That should be rigidly applied.

 

The Sport is about Entertainment and anything that holds up Racing (apart from injuries obviously), should be eradicated as far as possible.

 

 

 

So ideally you would run a meeting in about 30 minutes and would encourage tactical tape touching?

[moxey63]

 

Of course not, because you'd be foolish.. yearning for the days when there were far more 'tactical' changes and it was far 'unfairer'.

 

Now, there will be a maximum of one tactical ride in a meeting.. and in many meetings there isn't one at all.

 

You don't churn very often then, just once a year at the World Cup? Which of course is irrelevant to league racing in the UK.

 

Then to top it off you want to return to a system which encouraged precisely what you 'churn' about!

 

And yes, 13 heats is a great idea! Fans already complain about value for money from 15 heats.. lets take 2 away"

 

 

Knew it wouldn't take long, so again I'm proved right. Least I know somebody reads my posts. Thank you to the resident know-it-all, MrBWitcher (the curtain-twitcher).

Only joking mate, before you tell me they're blinds actually.

[sparkafag]

I too would like sensible rules. It is what any sport thrives on. I churn when I see riders slowing down near the flag to allow an opponent passed because they don't want their side to use double points farce. It happened as recent as in the World Cup last week. If a supporter of 40 years doesn't like it, why do you expect the media to suddenly cotton on that this speedway lark is the real deal.

 

Speedway will only be saved by 13 heats and tac-sub for being six in arrears. We all know it...

 

 

 

 

I need to stress this isn’t in anyway “having a go at you” just a question given you have consciously chosen to post your thoughts on a forum…

 

How would that race format save the sport, because I genuinely don't know..

Edited August 4, 2016 by The Mockingjay

[Fromafar]

Don't change anything, then things won't get worse than they now.

[moxey63]

 

 

I need to stress this isn’t in anyway “having a go at you” just a question given you have consciously chosen to post your thoughts on a forum…

 

How would that race format save the sport, because I genuinely don't know..

 

 

Two extra races means added costs.. not forgetting the so-called superstars who are in heat 15. How many fans does it need in the stadium to pay for this race alone? Saving this outlay may even persuade some promoters to reduce admission prices a squidge or hold them back for the next few years. If I was trying to save my outlay, this would be one avenue I'd explore. People say it's two less races, but nobody complains when matches are called at heat 12. Reducing the heats by even two may be a way of giving the fans something more attune to £10 speedway than the wad they pay now. The sport needs to cut corners. Next would be engine tuning for domestic speedway, which I question that it needs or can afford. Needless money going out of the sport, It isn't formula one, and there must be a way to halt money swilling out of the sport that it can barely afford.

Edited August 4, 2016 by moxey63

[sparkafag]

 

 

Two extra races means added costs.. not forgetting the so-called superstar who are in heat 15. Saving this outlay may even persuade some promoters to reduce admission prices a squidge or hold them back for the next few years. If I was trying to save my outlay, this would be one avenue I'd explore. People say it's two less races, but nobody complains when matches are called at heat 12.

 

Emm yes they do, it generally boils peoples piss when meetings are called off after 12 races when they have paid for 15.

 

Does it not slightly negate reducing the cost paid to riders if you are also reducing the cost of admission? Could argue it also cheapens the perception of value for money in most peoples psyche that they are now seeing less of what they have been used to for a long time now.

Edited August 4, 2016 by The Mockingjay

[The White Knight]

I too would like sensible rules. It is what any sport thrives on. I churn when I see riders slowing down near the flag to allow an opponent passed because they don't want their side to use double points farce. It happened as recent as in the World Cup last week. If a supporter of 40 years doesn't like it, why do you expect the media to suddenly cotton on that this speedway lark is the real deal.

 

Speedway will only be saved by 13 heats and tac-sub for being six in arrears. We all know it...

 

Another thing to help it move towards being taken more seriously by this man of sense, is ban bloody riders from multi-tasking and riding all over the place. It is team speedway that the sport thrives on, and that importance has evaporated over the past 10 years or so. I saw it start in the mid-90s, when a four-team meet at Belle Vue had to be delayed while some riders got delayed on their way back from the Swedish League or something. Nothing like staring at your programme for upto an hour while the boys booked to appear manage to drop by. I knew then we were just a day-in-the-week for many. They spread themselves much to fine, some of them do.

 

Like somebody else mentioned, I couldn't give two doodles if riders decide to take their greed elsewhere. The main thing is that a fan, like me, can believe the blokes in their side are doing their best for his club. I mean, how many believe that superstar singer who greets his audience with the line "the best audience I've had." I'm amazed he knows where he even is... as I am about today's riders. When you ply your trade here, there and everywhere, it is just a job. When a rider in your team has a bad meeting, you want to know it's because he isn't saving himself or perhaps arranged with his boss to drop his average and allow for another signing for the Play-Offs.

 

It makes me cringe, it does... when that Nige Pearson constantly tells the audience "he (whoever he may be)

races here, in Sweden, Denmark, sometimes Poland and Russia, over here, over there....

 

Speedway riders have become agency workers and clubs are being used like company rep cars.

 

Now... let's all have a go at moxey... Then again, I know whiteknight will give me a "like."

Spot on moxey63.

 

You and I have very similar views on Speedway.

 

 

 

So ideally you would run a meeting in about 30 minutes and would encourage tactical tape touching?

Yes.

 

No.

 

Don't change anything, then things won't get worse than they now.

Don't kid yourself.

Thirteen Heats is the way to go.

 

Second Halves were a great Training Ground for young, up and coming Riders. I think that there has been a reduction in young Riders coming through the system since the advent of fifteen Heats and scrapping the Second Halves.

 

I have no doubt at all that people will say that I am looking backwards with those rose coloured spectacles again - but to me, he proof of the pudding is in the eating.

 

I know a number of people went home straight after the Meeting - but I enjoyed watching the youngsters.

 

Emm yes they do, it generally boils peoples piss when meetings are called off after 12 races when they have paid for 15.

 

Does it not slightly negate reducing the cost paid to riders if you are also reducing the cost of admission? Could argue it also cheapens the perception of value for money in most peoples psyche that they are now seeing less of what they have been used to for a long time now.

Not if you get more people coming in to see more 'value for money' Racing.

Edited August 4, 2016 by The White Knight

[moxey63]

 

Emm yes they do, it generally boils peoples piss when meetings are called off after 12 races when they have paid for 15.

 

Does it not slightly negate reducing the cost paid to riders if you are also reducing the cost of admission? Could argue it also cheapens the perception of value for money in most peoples psyche that they are now seeing less of what they have been used to for a long time now.

 

 

So it is about keeping riders happy, is it, or actually trying to keep fans coming through the turnstiles that I do genuinely believe help to pay the riders.

 

Speedway needs a total rethink. It is supposed to be a family sport. Always sold itself on that. So by cutting two heats, cutting admission, it possibly wouldn't make a fan on his own dance at the saving, but what about the family of four. They could save a tenner even.

 

Let us stop trying to put the future of the sport at risk because of the riders. We need to get back to maintaining a sport that its public can afford. The riders have too much power now. If they don't wish to race here for a lower wage, then what do you do - keep placing the future of speedway at risk, even one more track, just so it can keep its top boys.

 

Now is the time to trim. I mean, we have no world champion riding over here... but is he missed? Now is the chance to put a plan together. To do it when there were real stars - Crump, Rickardsson, Hamill, Adams - would have been more noticeable. But we have never been so low on star performers, and I mean globally and not just in Britain.

 

I am just trying to discuss ways to save the sport, that's all.

 

Only my views.

Edited August 4, 2016 by moxey63