Woofy's Thoughts About The Team G.b. Set-up

[Deano]

you really are a halfwit aren't you , you quote latvians and admit to not knowing anything about whats going on there , well heres a shock for you , they were not 5 riders who had been going round in a field somewhere and turned up at the world cup . Daugavpils race in the Polish league and are currently second in their division , and some of the 5 are regulars in Polish elite league .. yes britain does take credit for Ivan Mauger, Barry Briggs , and Ronnie Moore , lets go halfwit...... .name an Australian, American , or Kiwi , who were not riding in Our leagues when they won their world titles . your silence will speak volumes on your lack of knowledge here . as far as Im aware Hans Nielsen and all the other nordic world champions started riding in the leagues in their own country and became skilled professional riders there so I make and never have made any claim for their success whatsoever .

 

but the Aussies who are the top of their tree right now, came over here pretty much high level Premier League standard or Elite, apart from Glen Doyle. Yes the GB leagues have made them super stars, but how did they get so good before they came over?

[Humphrey Appleby]

What I find incomprehensible is that out of the dozen Latvians, on the one track in the country, 5 of them made it to the Speedway World Cup, by means of qualification, not seeding, and shamed the British team in the final.

There are very few tracks in Britain where you can just turn up and practice on a regular basis. Swedish, Danish and Australian tracks tend to be run by clubs in the middle of nowhere, and whilst I'm sure they have restrictions on when they can be used, I'm guessing it's easier for them to stage regular training sessions at minimal cost. AFAIK, Polish teams also have training sessions for their riders as well as structured development competitions for young riders.

 

The other point of course, is that Australians and Americans have to leave their country if they want to progress beyond anything more than a local level in the sport. That's why promising riders invariably rock-up in one of the countries with a professional scene at an early age, and simply have to succeed otherwise they'll be on their way home again.

 

Latvia seems to have a well-funded club with its own stadium, which enables it to compete in the Polish League. Daugavpils is also something of a Russian enclave in Latvia, so it's not beyond the bounds of possibility that some Russian money is floating around to support Russian 'cultural institutions'.

I think that the Team GB matters are the responsibility of the SCB, as the governing body of speedway in Great Britain, although I may be wrong on this.

Bilaterally-arranged team events such as test matches were I think always the responsibility of the BSPA, and responsibility for FIM events was delegated to the BSPA years ago.

What about government funding? Has it ever been applied for? The Sports Council gives tens of millions a year to football, the richest sport of them all. Millions to rugby, athletics, even two bob sports like archery and sycronised swimming.

Lots of factors involved which include participation and growth rates, plus Olympic sports tend to get priority in the funding queue. Funding is also linked to competitive success at the highest level, which is why basketball and some other sports recently lost their funding.

 

Speedway isn't mass participation, would probably be argued to be insufficiently health and fitness based, and could be perceived as environmentally unfriendly. That's before you get to the fact that top competitions are virtually invisible in the media, so no-one would realise if British riders were successful.

Edited August 3, 2016 by Humphrey Appleby

[A ORLOV]

Whichever way you look at it the people in charge of speedway should have run it in such a way that they and the lower levels of the sport gained some financial benefit from the World Championships and GPs etc.

[The White Knight]

Whichever way you look at it the people in charge of speedway should have run it in such a way that they and the lower levels of the sport gained some financial benefit from the World Championships and GPs etc.

I couldn't agree more.

 

Why is it that I feel that British Speedway is being 'ripped off' somewhere along the line?

[steve roberts]

I couldn't agree more.

 

Why is it that I feel that British Speedway is being 'ripped off' somewhere along the line?

I know that I keep quoting the late John Berry but he was quoted many years ago saying that British Speedway no longer benefited financially from the the SGP and lost out when the FIM decided to go along the route of the GPs.

 

I admired JB and how he spoke a lot of sense about the direction in which speedway was heading. How we could do with him now in some form of administration.

[racers and royals]

I know that I keep quoting the late John Berry but he was quoted many years ago saying that British Speedway no longer benefited financially from the the SGP and lost out when the FIM decided to go along the route of the GPs.

 

I admired JB and how he spoke a lot of sense about the direction in which speedway was heading. How we could do with him now in some form of administration.

I think you will find that the BSPA turned down the chance of being the promoter of the Cardiff GP- they wouldn't take the financial risk !!!

[Humphrey Appleby]

I think you will find that the BSPA turned down the chance of being the promoter of the Cardiff GP- they wouldn't take the financial risk !!!

There's little point being the promoter of individual GPs. The money to be made is running the series and taking the television and sponsorship revenue.

[speedibee]

 

but the Aussies who are the top of their tree right now, came over here pretty much high level Premier League standard or Elite, apart from Glen Doyle. Yes the GB leagues have made them super stars, but how did they get so good before they came over?

I would say it's a little too far to say that they were already high standard when they arrived here . someone like SCB would most likely be able to show the statistics that give an accurate picture of that , but taking the case of holder who i assume would be someone you would say was out of the box ready . yet he spent 3 seasons in premier league working his way up . had he remained in Australia riding in filler races in car meetings that is exactly where he would have been today . Doyle been racing in the UK for 11 years . up until 2 years ago ,he was a journeyman premier league heat leader and eltie second string . so not exactly out of the box ready . the fact that Aussies achieve a higher standard more quickly once they arrive here is born of necessity , when they want sunday dinner ,they have to go and earn it , when british riders cant afford sunday dinner they nip home to mum and dad . and for every chris holder , there are 10 journeymen Aussies who are at best mediocre ,

[steve roberts]

I think you will find that the BSPA turned down the chance of being the promoter of the Cardiff GP- they wouldn't take the financial risk !!!

Of course during the days of the one-off World Finals the British event (Wembley and later Bradford) profits would be distributed amongst the British tracks and often was a life saviour for some of the promotions at the time. However when the GPs were introduced this income disappeared much to the annoyance of John Berry.

[Trees]

Of course during the days of the one-off World Finals the British event (Wembley and later Bradford) profits would be distributed amongst the British tracks and often was a life saviour for some of the promotions at the time. However when the GPs were introduced this income disappeared much to the annoyance of John Berry.

IMG knew with the advent of satellite tv they were onto a good thing, it was so wrong of the FIM to sell off speedway's crown jewel and the World Team Championship

[racers and royals]

Of course during the days of the one-off World Finals the British event (Wembley and later Bradford) profits would be distributed amongst the British tracks and often was a life saviour for some of the promotions at the time. However when the GPs were introduced this income disappeared much to the annoyance of John Berry.

So who is the promoter of the Warsaw GP ?? the BSPA had the chance with Cardiff.

[sparkafag]

Holder spent two seasons in the PL, the first he averaged over 8 the second he averaged over 10, it was obvious to anyone with a hole in their arse he was a special talent from the moment they saw him race.

 

He also finished 5^th and 2^nd in the Under 21s while he was in the PL. The reputation of the Holders is that they are seemingly cash rich so it is little to do with the need to earn a crust rather than a genuine talent on a motorbike, the whole being a World Champion thing confirms that….

 

Ward was arguably better than Holder on arrival, averaging over 9 in his debut PL season and actually wining the Under 21 Championship that same year, if that is achievable on the back of a seasons PL experience you have to scratch your head and wonder why a few more Brits haven’t achieved it more often…

 

I would say it is because racing PL speedway didn’t “make” either of those riders they were brilliant before they arrived.

 

Australian riders in general are far more complete from an earlier age than the majority of Brits with very few Brits actually seeming to be “special” from a very young age, arguably none for about 20 years who are actually “home nurtured”, the closest being riders like Kennet and Bridger who didn’t achieve the same level of dominance/obvious talent the likes of Holder or Ward did or had from first viewing.

 

It seems to me British riders have to fight and scratch to become good, eg Harris and Richardson rather than being placed on a path that leads to an end result...based on volume in recent years it appears Australia are far better at that.

 

The depth in talent between Team GB and Australia is pretty big when considering the setup in GB

(and that is before even considering the injury to Ward and that Woffinden feasibly could have picked Australia over Team GB) , to me it seems little to do with league structure rather than a far more advanced training ground in Australia, if the scale of good Australian riders to poor is 1 in 10, GB is about 1 in 50.

Edited August 4, 2016 by The Mockingjay

[speedibee]

What about government funding? Has it ever been applied for? The Sports Council gives tens of millions a year to football, the richest sport of them all. Millions to rugby, athletics, even two bob sports like archery and sycronised swimming.

 

Surely putting together a very good synopsis of what would be attained with the funding could put speedway in a position where a few hundred thousand could come our way?

Yes , whateveer happened to the sports council funded Jan .O Pedersen training academy ?

[Humphrey Appleby]

So who is the promoter of the Warsaw GP ?? the BSPA had the chance with Cardiff.

The PZM isn't it?

 

The BSPA might have had the chance with Cardiff, but on what terms? For example, would they or BSI get the money from the Welsh Government?

 

You take on the risk of staging a GP as a local promoter, but see nothing of the television and sponsorship monies.

[speedibee]

Obviously , staging a GP is a money loser , thats why the Poles have ditched one of their rounds this year

[no-brakes-uk]

I would say it's a little too far to say that they were already high standard when they arrived here . someone like SCB would most likely be able to show the statistics that give an accurate picture of that , but taking the case of holder who i assume would be someone you would say was out of the box ready . yet he spent 3 seasons in premier league working his way up . had he remained in Australia riding in filler races in car meetings that is exactly where he would have been today . Doyle been racing in the UK for 11 years . up until 2 years ago ,he was a journeyman premier league heat leader and eltie second string . so not exactly out of the box ready . the fact that Aussies achieve a higher standard more quickly once they arrive here is born of necessity , when they want sunday dinner ,they have to go and earn it , when british riders cant afford sunday dinner they nip home to mum and dad . and for every chris holder , there are 10 journeymen Aussies who are at best mediocre ,

Darcy Ward...

[speedibee]

Darcy Ward...

Of course theres always 1 person you can claim makes a counter argument , but it's a bit crap really , how about I say .well we must be doing something right, because Dan Bewley got an 18 point max in his first NL meeting , our system has to be working for a Kid like that to come from nowhere and be something special immediately