Glasgow V Edimburgh Ko Cup Sunday 31 July 2016

[cyclone]

We were crap today and Glasgow were good, no problem admitting that.

 

Agree that Erik Riss was rightly penalised for faffing about at the gate too long, although he gave us our single highlight when sweeping past the otherwise unbeaten Lawson on lap2 of heat 10.

 

Tigers did look a complete unit today, with Lunna & Bach, particularly impressive.

 

Finally a a message to Lucifer Sam - you really have a problem understanding the SCB Regulations.

 

For your benefit here, for the nth time, is the relevant Section where a NL fixture does take priority for the services of a Doubling Up rider.

 

Either vanity is preventing you from acknowledging this, or your mind has been degraded by supporting Jeremy Corbyn

:-

16. FIXTURES, MATCH AVERAGES and GENERAL RULES

The authority of the SCB and BSPA extends over all Meetings listed on the Official BSPA produced and maintained Fixture List.

Changes, including Fixture re-stagings must be approved by the BSPA and no Meeting may be staged unless on the Fixture List.

16.1 Fixtures shall take priority as follows:

FIM SGP, SWC, SGP Qualifying Meetings, FIM Junior Speedway Championship Meetings

British Championships (Senior, Junior), BSPA Shared and Fee Events

Official Competitions: 1. Elite League; 2. Premier League; 3.National League.

NB. Non-Official Competitions have no priority over any of the above.

A Rider must be released to take part in a higher priority Meeting, unless he is “Doubling Up” or is an “EDR, in which case the priority for a clash of Official Meetings is as follows:

16.1.1 The “owning” Club (ie. on Club’s Retained List) or before the start of the Season was

transferred with the full Transfer Fee being paid.

16.1.2 If neither Club has “ownership”, then it is determined by the League status of the Club that

does “own” the rider. If that Club is a NL Club then agreement can be made otherwise Art.16.1 applies.

16.1.3 The Original Fixture if there is a clash with a re-Arranged Fixture

PS 19.9.3 does not override the above, it specifies that the NLRC will take priority over any PL fixture clash.

Oh & BTW still awaiting for you to acknowledge that you falsely stated the Monarchs had advised the change on the Sunday morning which was exposed as untrue in the SCB Statement.

Here's the link as it appears you might not have read this:-

http://www.speedwaygb.co/news.php?extend.30910

.

Edited July 31, 2016 by cyclone

[george.m]

We were crap today and Glasgow were good, no problem admitting that.

 

Agree that Erik Riss was rightly penalised for faffing about at the gate too long, although he gave us our single highlight when sweeping past the otherwise unbeaten Lawson on lap2 of heat 10.

 

Tigers did look a complete unit today, with Lunna & Berge, particularly impressive.

 

Like. For your honesty.

 

Except for the reference to Berge.

[Mr Blobby]

If I'm not mistaken Campbell & Harkess took over in 1986 - so 17 years before they managed to win their first league championship. I have a feeling that the Facennas will do it a bit quicker than that.

 

More than likely but they have millions to spend in trying to do that.

Edited July 31, 2016 by Mr Blobby

[george.m]

More than likely but they have millions to spend in trying to do that.

Not really.

Couple of mill invested mainly in the stadium.

Not on team building.

 

If we had millions to invest in the team we would have had won the league last year ... riders would have been paid enough to give Poland a miss on Sundays.

[cyclone]

Like. For your honesty.

 

Except for the reference to Berge.

 

Apologies for post traumatic shock - I can't tell my Berge from my Bach

[damosuzuki]

Edinburgh have beat us at Armadale by more than 24 points in the recent past, but we should get through. Bewley is just too slight for our set up at the moment although he one of the most talented reserves.

 

The thing is with Lunna and Bach performing as they are we have a phenomenal top 5 at home.

[lucifer sam]

 

 

Finally a a message to Lucifer Sam - you really have a problem understanding the SCB Regulations.

 

For your benefit here, for the nth time, is the relevant Section where a NL fixture does take priority for the services of a Doubling Up rider.

 

Either vanity is preventing you from acknowledging this, or your mind has been degraded by supporting Jeremy Corbyn

:-

16. FIXTURES, MATCH AVERAGES and GENERAL RULES

The authority of the SCB and BSPA extends over all Meetings listed on the Official BSPA produced and maintained Fixture List.

Changes, including Fixture re-stagings must be approved by the BSPA and no Meeting may be staged unless on the Fixture List.

16.1 Fixtures shall take priority as follows:

FIM SGP, SWC, SGP Qualifying Meetings, FIM Junior Speedway Championship Meetings

British Championships (Senior, Junior), BSPA Shared and Fee Events

Official Competitions: 1. Elite League; 2. Premier League; 3.National League.

NB. Non-Official Competitions have no priority over any of the above.

A Rider must be released to take part in a higher priority Meeting, unless he is “Doubling Up” or is an “EDR, in which case the priority for a clash of Official Meetings is as follows:

16.1.1 The “owning” Club (ie. on Club’s Retained List) or before the start of the Season was

transferred with the full Transfer Fee being paid.

16.1.2 If neither Club has “ownership”, then it is determined by the League status of the Club that

does “own” the rider. If that Club is a NL Club then agreement can be made otherwise Art.16.1 applies.

16.1.3 The Original Fixture if there is a clash with a re-Arranged Fixture

PS 19.9.3 does not override the above, it specifies that the NLRC will take priority over any PL fixture clash.

Oh & BTW still awaiting for you to acknowledge that you falsely stated the Monarchs had advised the change on the Sunday morning which was exposed as untrue in the SCB Statement.

Here's the link as it appears you might not have read this:-

http://www.speedwaygb.co/news.php?extend.30910

.

 

Here we go again

 

Just to point out again (for the nnnnth time ) that there is no such thing as doubling-up between the NL and the higher leagues. Riders can ride NL in addition (where eligible) but it's not doubling-up, it's simply riding in an additional league. NL never takes priority except when it's the NLRC.

 

If you read the SCB statement, it doesn't refer to section 16 at any point, because this section is irrelevant when it comes to the NL.

 

Please point out where rule 16.1.3 is quoted in the SCB Press Release.

 

Monarchs making up the rules as they go along, as usual, but it didn't do you much good against Glasgow today. 'Mon the Tigers.

 

All the best

Rob

Edited July 31, 2016 by lucifer sam

[MD]

Edinburgh have beat us at Armadale by more than 24 points in the recent past, but we should get through. Bewley is just too slight for our set up at the moment although he one of the most talented reserves.

 

The thing is with Lunna and Bach performing as they are we have a phenomenal top 5 at home.

Lunna at reserve for the next month will be a trump card though Fernando has gone off the boil making the jump up to No2. Need to be at our best to beat Somerset in 3 weeks.

[lucifer sam]

Glasgow's results are still inconsistent... massive win at Berwick, surprise defeat at Redcar, humping the Monarchs today, but I still reckon it's between them at Somerset this season.

 

All the best

Rob

Edited July 31, 2016 by lucifer sam

[bri1966]

The mighty diamonds will have something to say about that

[Fromafar]

still trying to figure out how Ht 15 was not run,the rain had stopped the track was rideable IMO .Public short changed again .Health and Safety no doubt.Need to get brakes fitted next.Masters still suffering from night before IMO .

[cyclone]

 

Here we go again

 

Just to point out again (for the nnnnth time ) that there is no such thing as doubling-up between the NL and the higher leagues. Riders can ride NL in addition (where eligible) but it's not doubling-up, it's simply riding in an additional league. NL never takes priority except when it's the NLRC.

 

If you read the SCB statement, it doesn't refer to section 16 at any point, because this section is irrelevant when it comes to the NL.

 

Please point out where rule 16.1.3 is quoted in the SCB Press Release.

 

Monarchs making up the rules as they go along, as usual, but it didn't do you much good against Glasgow today. 'Mon the Tigers.

 

All the best

Rob

You really are making yourself look incredibly stupid - I'll highlight it again for you - pay attention!:

 

A Rider must be released to take part in a higher priority Meeting, unless he is “Doubling Up” or is an

“EDR, in which case the priority for a clash of Official Meetings is as follows:

16.1.1 The “owning” Club (ie. on Club’s Retained List) or before the start of the Season was

transferred with the full Transfer Fee being paid.

16.1.2 If neither Club has “ownership”, then it is determined by the League status of the Club that

does “own” the rider. If that Club is a NL Club then agreement can be made otherwise Art.

16.1 applies

If you cannot directly relate rule 16.1.3 to the following part of the the SCB Statement, viz.:

The BSPA instructed Edinburgh that as the Buxton v Belle Vue fixture was in the original Fixture List, and the above Meeting wasa re-arranged Meeting, having been postponed on June 12th, that Dan Bewley had to ride at Buxton and Edinburgh were therefore entitled to a Guest as per art 18.10 (d),

As Monty Python would say "Time you visited Curry's and got a new brain"

See you ignore to mention this part of the SCB:-

"Furthermore, Edinburgh advised Scunthorpe by SMS at 15:14 on Friday 15th July (72 hours prior to the Meeting Start time) of the fact that Mitchell Davey would be the G rider replacing Dan Bewley."

OK someones arithmetic is poor (Rob Godfrey perhaps? )as it was 48 hours prior, but you appear not to have the cojones to admit your post #69 on the Scunny vs Edinburgh thread, asserting Edinburgh only informed Scunny of the change, late Sunday morning, was completely false.

[lucifer sam]

Oh dear, poor old Cyclone still hasn't got it.

 

Dear chap, there is no such thing as doubling up between National League and the higher leagues. The clue is in the name, really. When a rider competes in both the EL & PL, the EL club has the opportunity to name a second rider to cover the slot e.g. Ben Barker at Coventry. Hence "Doubling Up".

 

16.1.2 makes clear that, in the case of a rider doubling up between EL/PL and the rider being owned by a NL club, then the EL/PL clubs can agree to who has priority. I can see where you've got confused here, but it doesn't refer to a rider who is riding in both the PL and NL. In fact, Edinburgh actually even clarified the case with Dan Bewley, after which Belle Vue were informed that Edinburgh took precedence in fixture clashes.

 

There is only one rule in the rulebook that covers a EL/PL rider also riding in the NL:

 

19.9.3 Where a rider is additionally declared in a PL and/or EL Team, the EL and/or PL Team shall have priority, except that a rider nominated for the NLRC must appear in the NLRC.

 

Note there is NO reference in the above to "Doubling Up", because it's not that. There is no second rider available to the EL/PL team in such cases. It's simply a rider competing in an additional team. It's allowed (as long as the rider is eligible, of course), but 19.9.3 (which is unusually succinct for the rulebook) makes clear that the EL/PL has priority, except when it comes to the NLRC.

 

Got it now??????

 

All the best

Rob

Edited August 1, 2016 by lucifer sam

[Gazc]

Totally humped the Monarchs and still moaning. You have a good team Glasgow. Celebrate that. Seems to be a bit after the Lord Mayors show with some of the Edinburgh boys. Points make prizes boys. Get back on the treadmill, quickly please.

What is your definition off moaning all i can see is a great deal off gloating and the observation that your captain & officials behaved like spoilt brats.

 

In fact i was concerned for my safety at one point as the ferocity Sam the Bam spat his dummy it could easily have taken an eye out.

[Pogo1]

A very determined Glasgow side was the difference yesterday, Edinburgh don't seem to have a Cookie type who won't settle for second best,

I recall Masters and Harkess being interviewed at the sky match a few weeks a go and saying you can't pass at Ashfield!

Yesterday I counted 10 passes in 14 heats and Masters was on the receiving end of two!

Maybe he meant he couldn't pass, ahh that's what he meant lol

 

A track prepared for racers and Glasgow have them in abundance this season

[speed ace]

We simply were not very good today at all. Didn't start that great then the rain came and we just didn't fancy it in the slightest. Tie over as I don't see us pulling 24 points back.

 

What's your excuse then as you have millions and still can't win a thing.

If it was football, the team manager would be the one to get it in the neck.

[scotchopper]

A very determined Glasgow side was the difference yesterday, Edinburgh don't seem to have a Cookie type who won't settle for second best,

I recall Masters and Harkess being interviewed at the sky match a few weeks a go and saying you can't pass at Ashfield!

Yesterday I counted 10 passes in 14 heats and Masters was on the receiving end of two!

Maybe he meant he couldn't pass, ahh that's what he meant lol

 

A track prepared for racers and Glasgow have them in abundance this season

 

 

Think you may be exaggerating slightly there, there were some passes yesterday but if you are on the right line it is still very difficult to pass at ashfield. There were some other good fast close races but I would hardly call it vintage speedway. e.g. Max Clegg just refuses to ride wide there for some reason and is easy pickings and I also think that was Lawson's problem he just assumed he was going to win and as the conditions were getting difficult he started coasting a lap early and fair play to erik he pounced on the mistake. I don't count genuine passes until the 3rd bend so my total was 3 and maybe 4 but nothing spectacular.

 

Fair play to Glasgow they have built a really solid team and were very worthy winners yesterday. They have a great chance of picking up trophies this year especially now rene Bach is picking up points. Could depend on the reserves in away meetings but big home wins might be enough although I still think Worrall and Lawson have some fragile moments so still plenty to think about.

 

Monarchs just didn't turn up on the day, Sam was well under par but understandable given the week he just had, looked to be something wrong with the bike in ht11 as he just seemed to stop in front of Mark on the 1st corner. Mark actually acquitted himself very well and probably would have won ht8 if Garcia hadn't fallen, badly baulked by masters in ht11 after a good gate. Erik started so slowly a bad habit he needs to break as he has now seen most tracks at least once, deservedly excluded in ht12. Ryan looked good in ht3 but seemed under power thereafter and will be disappointed at being beaten by Garcia and Lunna. Very average performance from Kevin: beats reserves and 2nd strings but never really threatened the Glasgow top 3, need more from him. Max Clegg just can't ride Glasgow, he has been there often enough now and should be doing better but it seems a mental block. Dan was never really in it either, needs to grow a bit for a track like ashfield.

 

the make up of the monarchs team means there was a chance we will have days like this, so far the top 3 have really pulled us through in away meetings but none of them fired yesterday. Looks like that means the KO Cup has gone for this year as we are not hammering anyone at home but we are improving month on month and if Dan and Max can score like last Friday it is not a foregone conclusion. Certainly won't give it up and hopefully that is the bad meeting out the way now so we can get better if we come back in the play offs.

[Pogo1]

Something wrong with Masters bike in heat 11, that's a good one, and Fisher looked underpowered lol

So Lunna going round the fence on bend two and passing Fisher is not a genuine pass in your book as it wasn't on bend three or four of the first lap?

I think what you got from Wolbert yesterday is what he does round Ashfield, 6 in the sky match and 6 yesterday , ohh and that's what he averaged racing for us in 2014, and that's not exaggerating lol.

 

Bewley is a talent no doubt but Clegg just doesn't to be kicking on after last season.

Pretty sure Edinburgh will make top 6 and will fancy there chances against most over two legs, as there tough to beat at home with there 7 track experts that race for them according to J Campbell

[damosuzuki]

 

 

Think you may be exaggerating slightly there, there were some passes yesterday but if you are on the right line it is still very difficult to pass at ashfield. There were some other good fast close races but I would hardly call it vintage speedway. e.g. Max Clegg just refuses to ride wide there for some reason and is easy pickings and I also think that was Lawson's problem he just assumed he was going to win and as the conditions were getting difficult he started coasting a lap early and fair play to erik he pounced on the mistake. I don't count genuine passes until the 3rd bend so my total was 3 and maybe 4 but nothing spectacular.

 

Fair play to Glasgow they have built a really solid team and were very worthy winners yesterday. They have a great chance of picking up trophies this year especially now rene Bach is picking up points. Could depend on the reserves in away meetings but big home wins might be enough although I still think Worrall and Lawson have some fragile moments so still plenty to think about.

 

Monarchs just didn't turn up on the day, Sam was well under par but understandable given the week he just had, looked to be something wrong with the bike in ht11 as he just seemed to stop in front of Mark on the 1st corner. Mark actually acquitted himself very well and probably would have won ht8 if Garcia hadn't fallen, badly baulked by masters in ht11 after a good gate. Erik started so slowly a bad habit he needs to break as he has now seen most tracks at least once, deservedly excluded in ht12. Ryan looked good in ht3 but seemed under power thereafter and will be disappointed at being beaten by Garcia and Lunna. Very average performance from Kevin: beats reserves and 2nd strings but never really threatened the Glasgow top 3, need more from him. Max Clegg just can't ride Glasgow, he has been there often enough now and should be doing better but it seems a mental block. Dan was never really in it either, needs to grow a bit for a track like ashfield.

 

the make up of the monarchs team means there was a chance we will have days like this, so far the top 3 have really pulled us through in away meetings but none of them fired yesterday. Looks like that means the KO Cup has gone for this year as we are not hammering anyone at home but we are improving month on month and if Dan and Max can score like last Friday it is not a foregone conclusion. Certainly won't give it up and hopefully that is the bad meeting out the way now so we can get better if we come back in the play offs.

 

 

Good post.

[MD]

the make up of the monarchs team means there was a chance we will have days like this, so far the top 3 have really pulled us through in away meetings but none of them fired yesterday.

EDI dont have the luxury of Sedgmen to step up to the plate like they did last year when that happens. Im sure they would have thought Eric Riss would have grown more into that role this year but like Clegg he really hasnt pushed on from 2015. Mark Riss looks much of a muchness of his brother, be interesting to see his final average in October.