gazzac Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 Once again the money situation is mentioned by people who don't know , Adam neither asked for or was offered any more than last year at Birmingham, ( which was less than some other NL no1's were /are on). Dugard's asked him to help, he's eligible, it's short term and the racing fits in with his fixtures. Why shouldn't he ride ? If you're going to use the "he's far too good" excuse you may as well say let's stop anyone playing football against Lionel Messi. Young riders need track time (whatever their level of development, Adam included ) and someone / something to aspire to. You never stop learning, no track time is wasted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Nicki Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 (edited) Exactly, even the Poole fans on their own forum think it's a good move as he'll improve on smaller tracks. And he used to ride at Arena Essex / Lakeside, which is what, a big track? So he's had a fair amount of experience of riding a small track - and to a certain extent, his two years at Ipswich were on a tight cornered track too. What did Adam score in the EL for Poole at Lakeside on 08 April? He scored: 3,2,2,2,2,0. Where did he score his duck? As a nominated rider in Heat 15! Yes, the EL heat format is skewed, but it looks to me as though he has improved on small tracks already. I wasn't there that night, but Halifax Tiger was, and it would be good to hear his opinion of how Adam rode in that meeting. Once again the money situation is mentioned by people who don't know , Adam neither asked for or was offered any more than last year at Birmingham, ( which was less than some other NL no1's were /are on). Dugard's asked him to help, he's eligible, it's short term and the racing fits in with his fixtures. Why shouldn't he ride ? If you're going to use the "he's far too good" excuse you may as well say let's stop anyone playing football against Lionel Messi. Young riders need track time (whatever their level of development, Adam included ) and someone / something to aspire to. You never stop learning, no track time is wasted. You compare Adam to Lionel Messi, which is fine, it is a father's privilege - although I would suggest that Adam is a lot better looking than Lionel, but anyway, you are suggesting that we should stop people playing against Messi because he is 'too good'? Is Lionel Messi playing football in the third tier of Spanish football to supplement his income or to gain experience? No, he is not. What benefit would it be to Messi's development in his chosen sport? None. Would it possibly lead to Messi getting injured as the lower level players are not up his standard and, maybe, reckless or even wilful in tackling Messi? Very possibly. Result = Messi is out injured. OK, he will continue to earn a fortune while he is out injured, unlike a speedway rider, but he still won't be playing. Do you not think Adam runs that risk too, in dropping back down to the NL? That he may suffer from the' tall poppy' syndrome and that some riders, far less experienced, not as his level and, maybe, just damn wilful, could possibly target the 'Star' rider in the NL, which could lead to accidents and, perish the thought, injury? Where does that then leave Adam's decision to return to his little pool? I am not suggesting it will happen, but a certain person made comments on this forum when it was announced that Adam was joining Eastbourne. That person is the Title sponsor of the NL and also has an association with Mildenhall Fen Tigers. If I was a really evil man and in that person's shoes, whose back would I be drawing a mental target on for my riders to 'aim at'? Yep, Adam's. I love Adam to bits and only wish him well. I would love to see him continue his EL form, make the World U21 Final and help win Team GB the World U21 Team Cup. If there was a choice between riding in the PL or NL for him, would I prefer to see him riding in the PL - with no mental target on his back? Yes. Do I fear for Adam's well being riding in the NL? I must say I do a bit. Even if not 'targeted' - and I don't mean targeted to be knocked off, but as the target to beat - there must be a considerably increased risk of falls and injuries in the NL, just because of the nature of the beast. I don't agree. The National League might be for development but its also a business. That means the product has to attract paying customers and they simply won't come to something that is little more than a training session. In addition, we all know only too well what happens to the attendances of teams that regularly lose at home - with the resultant risk to their existence. That means you have to have riders above the development stage, although I could make fair argument that of those riding last night only Knight, Halsey and Armstrong would fall into that category and the benefit of having one experienced rider around the youngsters is an obvious one. Eastbourne lost their number 1 rider, and they can't replace him with a 3.00 junior. You might question Ellis' motives for riding in a league where he will be almost unbeatable (although I think he has a lot of motives, all with the queens head on) but it seems to me that he is happy, Eastbourne are happy, he is a developing rider who is eligible for the NL and the league has a star who might just pull in a few extra fans wherever he goes. I don't have an issue with that. Back to the meeting. Closer than I thought on a track that was slippery to start with but settled down. Big congratulations to Sam Bebee on winning his first NL ride Yes, I agree with everything you say there, HT, I was remiss in not considering the joy that Adam will bring to his NL promoter, the crowds at the NL tracks that will have the pleasure of seeing him ride and the promoters at the NL tracks he may ride at. (Nice touch too mentioning Sam Bebee's win - which was recorded as being 10.7 seconds slower than Adam's winning time in the preceding heat. I thought I would never see the day again when such a disparity was recorded.) Ok well let's face it if we didn't have Adam at number 1 our team would be a bit poor, I think by having a 10.14 rider we have levelled out the farce reserves berths at the moment. Tom Brennan looked to be flying compared to them and rode the track much better. Hope Nick gets well soon. I would possibly have argued to strengthen the bottom end and get an 8 point number 1 but we have 3 very good heatleaders all of them on maximums or paid maximums had it not been for one fall and a race to the line after a wide run. Hopefully our top 4 will carry the momentum into today. I'm happy with Harris scoring 4 when he should really be a reserve as number 2 is a tall order for such a short lad. Very good post Al3x200. All well and good if you have a PL side to put them in once they've "developed". To attract people through the gate you need three or four riders who know what they're doing to balance out the wobblers. Doubt sides like Eastbourne & Birmingham would be in business if they had a team of rookies. Rye House are a different kettle of fish entirely. They have a PL side and own the stadium. Their entire existence doesn't rest on how the Raiders are doing. Ah, yes Shads, I understand where you are posting from, but in Adam's case he is not an asset of / attached to a NL club so the comparison doesn't work. I agree, that there is not a 'natural progression' at Eastbourne for a rider to progress 'in-house' from NL to PL. like there is at Rye House, but Adam is already contracted to an EL club and has already ridden in the PL. My point is, that Adam has effectively regressed when he dropped back into the NL. He should, in my mind, have either simply stayed riding in the EL only with Poole, whilst earning extra money with his continental exploits or, he should have taken one of the PL offers he received and ridden in both the EL and PL. That is the direction that I would have expected his further development to have gone Edited April 24, 2016 by Multumesc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazzac Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 (edited) Hit the nail on the head, the track was really tricky last night, especially in the early heats and even Adam looked to have a couple of moments especially out of bend 2.Even though he did win his heats with relative ease, didn't look 'easy with the conditions and he must have learnt from that. I believe you maybe associated/family with Adam, just pass on to him the negative posts on here aren't from any Eastie fans, we're pleased to have him in for however long he's with us, and hope he continues the upward curve .(Sorry this is a reply to Jonny the Spuds post ) Edited April 24, 2016 by gazzac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waco Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 Jonny the spud makes good points,,If you do not agree with some one of Adams class riding in this league ,you can only blame the rules that allow it,not the rider or the club that have every right to take advantage .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Nicki Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 Jonny the spud makes good points,,If you do not agree with some one of Adams class riding in this league ,you can only blame the rules that allow it,not the rider or the club that have every right to take advantage .. Not so much Adam's class, waco, more his already proven ability. A 10.14 MA indicates his ability has already been tested and proven at NL level. Time to move on, surely as.I trust, it is not a sign of a lack of ambition and as his father has alluded to many times, it is not about the £, apparently. I just truly hope this does not backfire on the lad who, apart from this decision I admire and whose career I have followed since 2012. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazzac Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 Ok well let's face it if we didn't have Adam at number 1 our team would be a bit poor, I think by having a 10.14 rider we have levelled out the farce reserves berths at the moment. Tom Brennan looked to be flying compared to them and rode the track much better. Hope Nick gets well soon. I would possibly have argued to strengthen the bottom end and get an 8 point number 1 but we have 3 very good heatleaders all of them on maximums or paid maximums had it not been for one fall and a race to the line after a wide run. Hopefully our top 4 will carry the momentum into today. I'm happy with Harris scoring 4 when he should really be a reserve as number 2 is a tall order for such a short lad. Agree, shame Harris isn't one of the reserves, if all this had happened a few day's earlier sure Kelsey would have come in at 2 and done a job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teaboy279 Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 I don't agree. The National League might be for development but its also a business. That means the product has to attract paying customers and they simply won't come to something that is little more than a training session. In addition, we all know only too well what happens to the attendances of teams that regularly lose at home - with the resultant risk to their existence. The only thing I will add to that is, does a rider half a lap ahead of everyone produce a product to attract a paying public?That's a genuine question by the way. Since Kent have been in existence I by far enjoyed our first season the best, despite proping up the league with stoke. We had 3 "wobblers" but we got to see them develop as the season went on. Don't think we won a competive meeting till July 29th, but then we beat Coventry Stoke and then The Mighty heathens in the next few meetings. What a buzz that was, and our crowds stayed massive all season long despite knowing we were going to get turned over each week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityrebel Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 The track looked overwatered to me last night, considering the freezing conditions it was never going to dry out quickly. This led to a few nasty crashes in the early heats, but there was some decent racing once the track dried out. The crowd was poor, but this was understandable due to the Artic weather! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gee jay Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 anyone think 12 points will be anywhere near enough to get through this afternoon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazzac Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 anyone think 12 points will be anywhere near enough to get through this afternoon? Just I think, if the reserves score a few more than last night may even come away with a narrow win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex2000 Posted April 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 i think we have strengthened with strudwick ( never would say that last season) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Nicki Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 (edited) i think we have strengthened with strudwick ( never would say that last season) Hey pal, if you are going to have a dig, don't do it like a coward, thinking I'm not registered on the Updates site, and presuming you have got away with an insult behind my back. And at least have the courtesy to get the name right if you are going to have a dig, and not spell it wrong like you did. (No doubt you will be familiar with the words to the popular children's nursery rhyme:' Every night when I get home. The monkey's on the table. Take a stick and knock it off. Pop goes the weasel.') The fact that Adam Ellis dropped a point in the first heat today at Mildenhall does not change one iota my previously stated opinion. It was 'Ben91' who suggested that a rider 'too good for the NL' was one who had a MA of 12.00, not me. What is Adam's MA over two KOC matches? 11.60. The only way it seems that you would strengthen, Al3x200, would be for you to grow a pair. I look forward even more now to my first trip to Arlington this season. You will not be too difficult to spot. You will be the one with the bright yellow stripe down your back, getting aroused watching arider half a lap in front of the other three. Comments taken from Updates: 'FTG'. 'FTG miles clear'. 'Ellis won with ease'. 'FTG, Ellis miles clear'. 'FTG, easy for the Eagles'. 'Max tonight by Ellis and I have a feeling I'll be saying that again'. Is that the type of speedway heat that is going to advance Adam Ellis' speedway education? Is that the type of speedway heat that's going to have the punters queueing up at the turnstiles? He would have earned some pocket money though, like shooting fish in a barrel. Enjoy your speedway............................................................ Door opening implement, in silks, riding a horse. Edited April 24, 2016 by Multumesc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex2000 Posted April 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 (edited) that's it let it all out, you feel better for that? Lol you won't be to hard to spot either the one pacing up and down with a cold sweat aggravated by every comment and thinking of an essay to counter attack with. And as you say enjoy your speedway and guess what EL riders at the price of NL.... Bargain! Edited April 24, 2016 by Al3x200 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Nicki Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 Thanks for the rant appreciate it Pleasure. You set em up and I can assure you that I will knock em down. You are like something unpleasant I stepped in, and to think that I bothered to commend you on a post. What do they say, if you give a troop of monkeys some keyboards to play with, eventually they'll come up with something worth reading. Keep on hitting those keys, naive, yellow belly. Haha, even Adam Ellis' dad called you naive. Bored now exchanging posts with a cowardly weasel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonny the spud Posted April 24, 2016 Report Share Posted April 24, 2016 Haha, even Adam Ellis' dad called you naive. Did I ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Nicki Posted April 25, 2016 Report Share Posted April 25, 2016 Yep, in the EL Riders in the NL Thread, Mr Ellis. See copies of relevant posts below: So you have changed your mind because your club has signed Adam Ellis. Really!? And you can't really be suggesting that Adam is struggling in the EL this season? Now you are showing up your speedway naivety. Adam should have taken one of the PL berths he was offered this season. I didn't say I didn't want him in the league just that they are top riders not really getting any challenge. I haven't changed my mind about that although I support him as he is in my team. He should have taken a PL team especially with how well BWD is doing this season he would have done Just as well if not better. He isn't struggling at the moment as such but who's to say he won't have a form dip as the season goes on? I think the ££££ has something to do with where he goes.... maybe you can call me naive but I'm not the bspa why does everyone keep going on about £££££££'s, he wasn't offered or asked for any more than last year, ( which was equal to other NL No1's) you are naive ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halifaxtiger Posted April 25, 2016 Report Share Posted April 25, 2016 (edited) Once again the money situation is mentioned by people who don't know , Adam neither asked for or was offered any more than last year at Birmingham, ( which was less than some other NL no1's were /are on). Dugard's asked him to help, he's eligible, it's short term and the racing fits in with his fixtures. Why shouldn't he ride ? If you're going to use the "he's far too good" excuse you may as well say let's stop anyone playing football against Lionel Messi. Young riders need track time (whatever their level of development, Adam included ) and someone / something to aspire to. You never stop learning, no track time is wasted. If its not about money, what is it that motivates a rider to compete in a league that is, by everyone's opinion, way below his ability ? Track time ? Against the likes of Sam Bebee, Jack Thomas and Tyler Govier ? You must be having a laugh. If we talking Lionel Messi, this is somewhere near him signing for Preston North End. Doubt very much if he would do that because I suspect he wants to play at the highest level possible. If they paid him double his present contract he might, though. According to James Easter, Ellis has been offered contracts by 3 PL clubs and refused them all. What is more likely to help him 'aspire to something', riding against the above or competing with Lambert, Stead and King ? As I said, its his choice and, frankly, I don't have a problem with him riding in the NL. If he does want to get on, though, I simply don't understand why he is doing so. The only thing I will add to that is, does a rider half a lap ahead of everyone produce a product to attract a paying public? That's a genuine question by the way. To be fair, it doesn't although let me assure you he wasn't that far ahead yesterday - especially when Danny Halsey beat him. I think the attraction is whether someone will beat him which, as was shown yesterday, can happen. Will he definitely beat your heat leader trio ? I am not so sure that he will. Edited April 25, 2016 by Halifaxtiger 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teaboy279 Posted April 25, 2016 Report Share Posted April 25, 2016 Both Shanes and Ayres (as well as Baseby and Morley) all beat him at CP last year, so fair shout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurnTwo Posted April 25, 2016 Report Share Posted April 25, 2016 I must say I enjoyed watching an out and out number one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waco Posted April 25, 2016 Report Share Posted April 25, 2016 Adam Ellis the debate continues ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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