Boring

[BWitcher]

 

Why is it an incorrect observation? Do you have any statistics to prove your opinion that the difference is less now? For example, how many Reserves beat Heat Leaders in, say, 1976, compared to 2016?

 

Until you can prove an opinion with stats, it remains an opinion and not a fact, as you well know.

 

Do you really believe that if you shout louder than the other person, you are right and they will give in and agree with you? Stoke Potter has as much right to his opinion as you do.

 

 

 

As reserves didn't race heat leaders in scheduled races in the Elite League in 2016 they clearly wouldn't be beating them very often would they!

 

As Waihekeaces has already explained, riders averages are far more condensed which demonstrates they are all beating each other on a regular basis.

 

So, as said, it's an incorrect observation and absolutely nothing at all to do with an opinion.

Edited April 18, 2016 by BWitcher

[Trees]

The worrying thing for me is the art of team riding it is slowly dying.I saw an incident in the Swindon v Coventry meeting Sedgeman gated was on a 5/1 with Doyley going along nicely then Doyley forced his way through and on the last lap Harris forced his way past Sedgy.We all are entitled to an opinion,and in reality you should never compare era,s the 90s era was the one i least enjoyed the late 60s 70s and 80s were my favourite eras glad i was around then to see it.

I thought that paid points had been done away with? If not yeah riders should always look to team ride, the fans love it They ought to practice it tbh

[waiheke1]

 

but 'heat leaders' - i.e. riders of heat leader ability (cf Freddie Lindgren) - can find themselves at no 4 in their team averages and thereby end up riding against reserves.

And of course the reason a rider like Lindgren can end up at 2nd string us because of the heat format which pitches "like against like" resulting in an abundance of riders averaging +/- 6pts.

[RobMcCaffery]

And of course the reason a rider like Lindgren can end up at 2nd string us because of the heat format which pitches "like against like" resulting in an abundance of riders averaging +/- 6pts.

EL averages are now totally worthless since they rely far too much on a rider's place in the team rather than his abilities.

[Halifaxtiger]

Having a good man on the mic won't bring the crowds flooding back.

 

No he won't but he won't put people off going either.

 

An annoying, self important presenter (and they are out there) might just be the straw that breaks the camels back.

 

I'm with you on this. While it makes a change to do something out of the ordinary, having done it a couple of times I'm not in a rush to do it again.

 

However what I can recommend is a spot in the referee's box. Great view and some interesting insights into how the meeting is run.

I agree, too. Brilliant as a one off but I wouldn't want it every week.

 

 

Having said that, probably the most incident-packed meeting I've ever been to, was Scunthorpe vs Ipswich last year. That was speedway on steroids - riders passing each other all over the place, a rider knocking off another rider post-race, a sit-down protest on the track, a separate punch-up between two other riders, etc.

 

I tend to pick and choose my meetings these days, and avoid anything that I consider might be 'boring'. A good starting point is watching half my speedway up at Scunny - speedway is never dull up there.

 

All the best

Rob

 

Best meeting I went to last season and would have been so without the track sit in and the fisticuffs in and out of the pits.

Edited April 18, 2016 by Halifaxtiger

[Shale Searcher]

Deep dirt on the outside lines now seems to either kill the engine, or the bike grabs far to much grip and the riders lose their bikes!

Also, the dirt on the outside lines needs fettling, and some degree of packing, otherwise it's like riding on kittie litter!!

[waiheke1]

EL averages are now totally worthless since they rely far too much on a rider's place in the team rather than his abilities.

Which proves bwitchers point

[Gavan]

 

Gavan, you've got your years muddled. Jan O suffered the injured tripping up while watching karting (he wasn't even doing it!) in 1990. In 1989, he was injured in the Dudley-Wolves trophy the weekend before the World Final, which is why Troy Butler (first reserve) replaced him in the line-up.

 

All the best

Rob

i knew Butler was reserve in 1989 and only got in because of Pedersens injury just couldnt remember what injury

[Little Nicki]

You clearly don't understand the El heat formula if you are asking about reserves beating heat leaders!

As for proof - look at the averages of the top riders in the El, that will show you that races are more unpredictable than ever. In fact, the majority or riders average somewhere between 5-7, which was never the case historically. If that doesn't prove that races are more evenly matched than ever then nothing will

 

I didn't think we were discussing unpredictability, rather BWitcher's firm opinion that there the gap between top riders and others is not the same now.

 

 

 

 

As reserves didn't race heat leaders in scheduled races in the Elite League in 2016 they clearly wouldn't be beating them very often would they!

 

As Waihekeaces has already explained, riders averages are far more condensed which demonstrates they are all beating each other on a regular basis.

 

So, as said, it's an incorrect observation and absolutely nothing at all to do with an opinion.

 

Which proves that you can't compare the gap between then (say 1976) and now (2016), so still just an opinion then.

OK, lets try Heat Leaders versus No.s 4 & 5 by MA then - 1976 versus 2016. Present some data and we can see then whether it is fact or opinion. Thanks.

[sparkafag]

I think Hollyoaks is pretty crap, I wouldn’t bother registering on their forum to post that though, nor would I start with the “happy clapper chat” if people said they did enjoy it.

The “happy clappers who wish the sport dead” chat is the wankiest load of nonsense that is posted on this forum. If people genuinely don’t enjoy the sport to the point they like posts by people who find it boring, why bother going on a speedway forum.

Edited April 18, 2016 by sparkafag

[robert72]

Speedway has been a massive part of my life but I only attend now if nothing else is on but normally regret going and think its been a waste of money.

 

Same as Cardiff I got bored of that awhile ago and not gone.

 

I was only bothered watching it on tv now and again last season

 

Speedway promoters have let it slip for the last 30 years to this sad state.

 

It needs a genius to bring it back again.

 

British Speedway badly needed a world champion racing here, let's hope fans show him the same lack of respect at Cardiff as he shows British speedway & his home fans.

Edited April 18, 2016 by robert72

[E I Addio]

Why is it an incorrect observation? Do you have any statistics to prove your opinion that the difference is less now? For example, how many Reserves beat Heat Leaders in, say, 1976, compared to 2016?

 

Until you can prove an opinion with stats, it remains an opinion and not a fact, as you well know.

 

Do you really believe that if you shout louder than the other person, you are right and they will give in and agree with you? Stoke Potter has as much right to his opinion as you do.

If you bother to read Stoke Potters post properly you will see he didn't offer it as an opinion. He said it was a REALITY that most races were boring.

 

He also said most people are in denial. I don't know how many people's opinions he asked in order to come to that conclusion but I would suggest it was probably not many, and possibly not any. Maybe he thinks people are in denial because they just happen to not agree with him.

[Little Nicki]

British Speedway badly needed a world champion racing here, let's hope fans show him the same lack of respect at Cardiff as he shows British speedway & his home fans.

 

It's ok with you then if we support the British World Champion at the SWC Final at Belle Vue in July?

 

I remember being at Rye House in 1992 just after Gary Havelock had won his World Title in Wroclaw and everyone was saying: 'this will be shot in the arm that speedway in Britain needs'. Unfortunately, it didn't turn out like that and speedway carried on its spiral downwards from the heady days of the mid-70's when, if the World Champion was in town, it was promoted and would add numbers to the attendance. Now, would it? Maybe a few, but not enough surely to right all of the sport's ills?

If you bother to read Stoke Potters post properly you will see he didn't offer it as an opinion. He said it was a REALITY that most races were boring.

 

He also said most people are in denial. I don't know how many people's opinions he asked in order to come to that conclusion but I would suggest it was probably not many, and possibly not any. Maybe he thinks people are in denial because they just happen to not agree with him.

 

I tend to ignore posters who commence their post with the words: 'If you bother to read the post properly'. To me it smacks of someone who feels they are superior, like my old English teacher - and he was a right pr1ck too.

 

TBH, I thought BWitcher was being rude and condescending to Stoke Potter, so I posted in support. There are a few posters on here who seem to debate a subject by trying to impose their opinion on others by repeating the same thing over and over again, getting louder as they do. Just like an English tourist in, say, Portugal who can't speak the native language and to get their point across, they start speaking s-l-o-w-e-r and LOUDER, before waving their arms around, banging their fist on the counter and jumping up and down. They normally always have to have the last word or, storm off in a huff, like a petulant teenager. No names mentioned of course. Always gives me a chuckle though.

Edited April 18, 2016 by Multumesc

[Gavan]

Speedway has been a massive part of my life but I only attend now if nothing else is on but normally regret going and think its been a waste of money.

 

Same as Cardiff I got bored of that awhile ago and not gone.

 

I was only bothered watching it on tv now and again last season

 

Speedway promoters have let it slip for the last 30 years to this sad state.

 

It needs a genius to bring it back again.

 

British Speedway badly needed a world champion racing here, let's hope fans show him the same lack of respect at Cardiff as he shows British speedway & his home fans.

pathetic that you put a cheap shot in on every post. do us all a favour and stop all the Tai bashing its quite boring and tiresome

[Daniel Smith]

Deep dirt on the outside lines now seems to either kill the engine, or the bike grabs far to much grip and the riders lose their bikes!

Also, the dirt on the outside lines needs fettling, and some degree of packing, otherwise it's like riding on kittie litter!!

 

Don't agree at all. At King's Lynn you needed throttle control to negotiate the bends and rider's and you hear them do it. Now its slick its pretty much maximum throttle all the way round.

 

Of course bikes will react with dirt now because nobody knows how to set their machinery for that only to have their throttle twisted south to the maximum.

[steve roberts]

The only time a reserve will ride against a heat leader is if he takes an extra reserve ride (or rider replacement ride) or when a third heat leader takes a rider replacement ride for no 4 in the averages in a heat with reserves and second strings.

 

Edit: I forgot the possibility that a reserve could get a heat 15 nomination.

 

but 'heat leaders' - i.e. riders of heat leader ability (cf Freddie Lindgren) - can find themselves at no 4 in their team averages and thereby end up riding against reserves.

Thanks for that! It's just that previous posters were giving the impression that reserves no longer get to meet heat leaders which evidently they do if circumstances decry.

[BWitcher]

 

It's ok with you then if we support the British World Champion at the SWC Final at Belle Vue in July?

 

I remember being at Rye House in 1992 just after Gary Havelock had won his World Title in Wroclaw and everyone was saying: 'this will be shot in the arm that speedway in Britain needs'. Unfortunately, it didn't turn out like that and speedway carried on its spiral downwards from the heady days of the mid-70's when, if the World Champion was in town, it was promoted and would add numbers to the attendance. Now, would it? Maybe a few, but not enough surely to right all of the sport's ills?

 

I tend to ignore posters who commence their post with the words: 'If you bother to read the post properly'. To me it smacks of someone who feels they are superior, like my old English teacher - and he was a right pr1ck too.

 

TBH, I thought BWitcher was being rude and condescending to Stoke Potter, so I posted in support. There are a few posters on here who seem to debate a subject by trying to impose their opinion on others by repeating the same thing over and over again, getting louder as they do. Just like an English tourist in, say, Portugal who can't speak the native language and to get their point across, they start speaking s-l-o-w-e-r and LOUDER, before waving their arms around, banging their fist on the counter and jumping up and down. They normally always have to have the last word or, storm off in a huff, like a petulant teenager. No names mentioned of course. Always gives me a chuckle though.

 

Bless, still trolling and insulting I see.

 

Some folk are intelligent enough to learn other languages.

 

As for any 'debate'. Still not grasping that it's not a debate, it's simply someone being corrected on an incorrect statement.

[mikebv]

For a good few, four riders, clutch start, no brakes, no gears, no fear etc etc is enough...

 

For them, it will never be boring..

 

Sadly not enough anymore it would appear share the same enthusiasm...

 

Those happy with watching any four riders ride round will always have that 'functional loyalty' to the sport...

 

Unfortunately trying to get what is essentially an individual sport into a team dynamic means it often struggles to get enough fans to buy into their local team, and bring with them the 'emotional loyalty' that would make the largest difference to its fanbase..

 

The irony is that in clubs' quest to 'win at home' and 'everyone be equal' to maintain its following, it then uses various 'ludicrous' scenarios such as literally sharing riders around under some contrived average limit...

 

Why have emotional loyalty for a team that can technically be made up of anyone at anytime depending on circumstances?

 

Watching a team made up of riders 'not yours' would I would suggest make the result irrelevant for most fair minded sports fans..

 

Maybe even boring to watch when the results ultimately don't really matter...?

[Little Nicki]

 

Bless, still trolling and insulting I see.

 

Some folk are intelligent enough to learn other languages.

 

As for any 'debate'. Still not grasping that it's not a debate, it's simply someone being corrected on an incorrect statement.

 

Not a Troll as explained on the Matt Ford - No Sympathy thread, on which I have just responded to a question you raised earlier that I had missed.

 

Not quite sure why you say that I was 'insulting'. Just re-read my post and can't see any insults there. Just expressing my opinions and how I view things, just like you do on here, and no doubt in your real life. Bless you. Don't worry yourself about me.

 

I don't know if intelligence is gauged by how many languages a person speaks, but if it is, how intelligent is someone who speaks four? English, French, Russian and Romanian are the ones, if that matters to you. Can't speak Portuguese though, even though I once had a neighbour who was Portuguese and I picked up a few words like 'obrigado'.

 

You do seem to like 'correcting' people don't you. Is that your profession?

[BWitcher]

 

Not a Troll as explained on the Matt Ford - No Sympathy thread, on which I have just responded to a question you raised earlier that I had missed.

 

Not quite sure why you say that I was 'insulting'. Just re-read my post and can't see any insults there. Just expressing my opinions and how I view things, just like you do on here, and no doubt in your real life. Bless you. Don't worry yourself about me.

 

I don't know if intelligence is gauged by how many languages a person speaks, but if it is, how intelligent is someone who speaks four? English, French, Russian and Romanian are the ones, if that matters to you. Can't speak Portuguese though, even though I once had a neighbour who was Portuguese and I picked up a few words like 'obrigado'.

 

You do seem to like 'correcting' people don't you. Is that your profession?

 

I'm not going to get any further involved in your nonsensical trolling. Run along to one of the other threads you're insulting people on.