Little Nicki Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 An incorrect observation. The difference between top riders and bottom end riders is less now than it was in the 'glory years'. Why is it an incorrect observation? Do you have any statistics to prove your opinion that the difference is less now? For example, how many Reserves beat Heat Leaders in, say, 1976, compared to 2016? Until you can prove an opinion with stats, it remains an opinion and not a fact, as you well know. Do you really believe that if you shout louder than the other person, you are right and they will give in and agree with you? Stoke Potter has as much right to his opinion as you do. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 I'm not so sure about that. With the tracks now seemingly being a lot slicker than they used to be (for whatever reason), it's getting to be the rider with the best engine wins. A lot of the skill has been taken away from the rider (though credit to them all as I think it's a brave and skilful thing to do) and many can't seem to handle a deep track. At the under 21 at Leicester a couple of years ago, the top of the track had to be taken off to allow the youngsters a chance to race. Until then, there were plenty of mistakes but a few got stuck in and showed their ability to ride in the dirt. (maybe it's a setup thing?) Formula 1 is now looking at putting the emphasis back on the driver to make his input just as important as that of the car he's driving. Hopefully the better drivers will move to the front because of their ability, not just because they're in the best car. At Leicester last Wednesday, the racing was very strung out until the latter heats. Glynn has come on here and explained why the track was prepared the way it was (thanks Glynn) and that the racing improved due the dirt building up on the outside. I agree with Danny Smith above, put more dirt on and see what happens. I don't want to see riders making mistakes I want to see them being able to take different lines to race one another, if that means putting more material on the tracks then why don't the promoters do it? Cost, moaning bloody fans cos a deep track takes more grading? I haven't seen a rider do a proper cut back at Lynn for ages, I dunno if that's the bikes, riders or the track? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinMills Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 i think league racing is quite boring, quite often...next time you stand on the terrace just look around at massive empty spaces, no atmosphere, and count how many races that evening are follow the leader. if your team wins, you probably notice less. id say gp"s and world cup certainly isn't boring. 4 riders throwing it about and a bit of passion. watch harris reaction after a gp race win he punch the air, slap his petrol tank, it means more, and if it means more passion and atmosphere is automatic as it rubs off into the crowds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 i think league racing is quite boring, quite often...next time you stand on the terrace just look around at massive empty spaces, no atmosphere, and count how many races that evening are follow the leader. if your team wins, you probably notice less. id say gp"s and world cup certainly isn't boring. 4 riders throwing it about and a bit of passion. watch harris reaction after a gp race win he punch the air, slap his petrol tank, it means more, and if it means more passion and atmosphere is automatic as it rubs off into the crowds Of course it means a lot to the riders, it's the pinnacle of their careers, adds to my disgust that IMG own the rights to our sport 😕 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrss Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 A few years ago D Norris went from the pit to the startline with 1 finger in the air to the crowd at Kings Lynn. The crowd hated him but he created an atmosphere. Shane Parker once walked the track and shook fans hands after the meeting at Lynn. He also stole the tractor at Ipswich to grade his start position. Speedway needs people like them so fans have something to remember from there night out even if the racing is poor it gives them something to talk about. No controversy means a quite crowd. A quite crowd means no atmosphere. The riders could do more to get fans involved but it seems riders are only interested in their pay cheque. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepturningleft Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 I suppose it depends what you class as a good race. Here is a meeting widely regarded as one of the best ever world finals up to then. I was there and the atmosphere was unbelievable but how many 'good races' were there? There are hundreds of youtube clips from the good old days and if this is a benchmark of speedway from then (which I really enjoyed, but I still do really enjoy speedway, I wouldn't bother otherwise) then clearly it was no better then than it is now. Yes, this is a very good example of the the rose tinted glasses effect. I think there were only 3 good races and yet, as you indicate, this meeting seems to be perceived as an all time classic. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinMills Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 dont thinkyou will witness a more boring meetin g than the 91 world final in gothenberg! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
van wolfswinkel Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 A few years ago D Norris went from the pit to the startline with 1 finger in the air to the crowd at Kings Lynn. The crowd hated him but he created an atmosphere. Shane Parker once walked the track and shook fans hands after the meeting at Lynn. He also stole the tractor at Ipswich to grade his start position. Speedway needs people like them so fans have something to remember from there night out even if the racing is poor it gives them something to talk about. No controversy means a quite crowd. A quite crowd means no atmosphere. The riders could do more to get fans involved but it seems riders are only interested in their pay cheque. Shane Parker was a great character, remember at a Fours meeting at Worky, a streaker ran onto the centre-green and Parks covered him with red marshal's flag. Then there were the near-naked spins at testimonials, and Leigh Adams Farewell at Swindon. Still watches speedway back home in Adelaide, my bruv spoke to him a couple of years back. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinMills Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 whilst i agree with above post, its gimmicks, the actual sport itself needs those things, as the racing on offer no longer appears to be enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 Norris and Parker would be heavily fined and quite possibly thrown out of the meetings these days. Nothing to do with riders only being interested in the pay check and everything to do with the rules. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 (edited) The man-on-the-mike is now a very, very important person to the meeting, he must be totally tuned into the meeting and the fans, he must be intuitive, bias, interesting and enthusiastic ..... have all of our clubs got these people? Edited April 17, 2016 by Trees 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrss Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 Having a good man on the mic won't bring the crowds flooding back. The racing needs to be better and closer. I watched 2 heats of Young Stars v Stoke last week it was terrible. The leader was the length of the straight ahead of last place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 Having a good man on the mic won't bring the crowds flooding back. The racing needs to be better and closer. I watched 2 heats of Young Stars v Stoke last week it was terrible. The leader was the length of the straight ahead of last place.No, not alone, but they would help to involve the crowd imo .... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New Science Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 The man-on-the-mike is now a very, very important person to the meeting, he must be totally tuned into the meeting and the fans, he must be intuitive, bias, interesting and enthusiastic ..... have all of our clubs got these people? People are not going to pay £18 quid every week just to watch a bloke trying to be funny on the centre green. We have that very man at Wolves but crowds are the lowest I've ever known.The people I know who stopped going did so for the very reason of this topic : that they were bored and the racing was not as good as it used to be.This is from the BSPA track of the year 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 People are not going to pay £18 quid every week just to watch a bloke trying to be funny on the centre green. We have that very man at Wolves but crowds are the lowest I've ever known.The people I know who stopped going did so for the very reason of this topic : that they were bored and the racing was not as good as it used to be.This is from the BSPA track of the yearDon't think I said it would, I just think it's really important to the whole package .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star Lady Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 A few years ago D Norris went from the pit to the startline with 1 finger in the air to the crowd at Kings Lynn. The crowd hated him but he created an atmosphere. Shane Parker once walked the track and shook fans hands after the meeting at Lynn. He also stole the tractor at Ipswich to grade his start position. Speedway needs people like them so fans have something to remember from there night out even if the racing is poor it gives them something to talk about. No controversy means a quite crowd. A quite crowd means no atmosphere. The riders could do more to get fans involved but it seems riders are only interested in their pay cheque. Whilst I agree wholeheartedly with you, those days are gone. Norris and Parker would have received life bans if they had tried their party pieces nowadays, but as you say people always remember them even if they have forgotten the races that happened the same night. Lynn fans looked forward with relish to the visits of Eastbourne. UK clubs meant a lot to riders then, nowadays they are just one of several. Just an observation, but several riders tweet every week about how they are looking forward to racing for their clubs in Poland. Those same riders rarely, if ever, tweet about looking forward to racing for their UK club. I wonder why 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 dont thinkyou will witness a more boring meetin g than the 91 world final in gothenberg! How about the 89 final in Munich? The worst final ever in my opinion, and also the worst line-up. At least Rickardsson livened up 91 a little! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 (edited) BWitcher, on 17 Apr 2016 - 2:30 PM, said: An incorrect observation. The difference between top riders and bottom end riders is less now than it was in the 'glory years'. Why is it an incorrect observation? Do you have any statistics to prove your opinion that the difference is less now? For example, how many Reserves beat Heat Leaders in, say, 1976, compared to 2016? Until you can prove an opinion with stats, it remains an opinion and not a fact, as you well know. Do you really believe that if you shout louder than the other person, you are right and they will give in and agree with you? Stoke Potter has as much right to his opinion as you do. Yes I'd also like to to know what factual evidence supports that claim? Edited April 17, 2016 by steve roberts 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike.Butler Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 I was at Munich in 1989. It was one of the worst meetings I've ever been to.. mainly due to the track - but you're right, Troy Butler qualified from the IC final..the final ine-up was indeed very average... coach journey back was awful too as we left after visiting a beer cellar and several people were ill all the way back to the ferry.. Yuk...every time the coach rdriver braked...well I won't go into details.. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 Briggo's Golden Greats meeting the previous evening in Landshut was a hell of a lot better. At least that made the weekend worthwhile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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