Steve Shovlar Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 I believe anything is possible with pro active negotiations which may involve thinking outside of the box! JC The reason I asked the question is because many on here think Matt Ford runs the whole show and I cant believe for a moment it is true. The bspa members do have a brain and I am pretty sure they dont follow like sheep to the slaughter house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star Lady Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 JC The bspa members do have a brain and I am pretty sure they dont follow like sheep to the slaughter house. But a chain is only as strong as its weakest link. You only need a couple of stick in the mud dinosaurs and progress is not an option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midland Red Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 If it weren't for Sky, you'd be able to watch some recorded and live stream matches online. If it weren't for Sky more fans would attend meetings at their track rather than from their armchair or pub 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurntFaceMan Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 If it weren't for Sky more fans would attend meetings at their track rather than from their armchair or pub Not true really Midland Red. Horses for courses. The majority of those armchair fans wouldn't bother attending even if it weren't televised. The revenue bought in by Sky, based on the figures JC is quoting, I would imagine easily covers those who would otherwise have attended. The benefits of live and on demand matches, which Sky are actively blocking, are that fans who are older and perhaps their age or financial situation makes attending speedway a difficulty, or fans who would like to follow their team away when travelling is impractical, can do so whilst still making a financial contribution to the sport. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 If it weren't for Sky more fans would attend meetings at their track r Like they do in every other sport Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz01 Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 The relationship between Go Speed and Sky is strained to say the very least. Go Speed have had to make an awful lot of concessions to accomodate Sky and there wasn't going to be a 5 year contract (which I believe still has 2 or 3 years remaining?) unless GSI gave them all they asked for. For example, Sky do not only hold the rights to Elite League speedway on TV but they also own every form of transmission rights except trackside recording for DVD only. Streaming and on demand rights are held by Sky. GSI wanted to stream and make some matches available for the public to watch online however Sky refused to release the rights back to them, even though Sky has no plans to use them themselves. They simply wanted to make sure that fans in the UK could only come to Sky for their once a fortnight or whatever it is speedway fix. Sky want to keep Elite League speedway on their channels, but it's very much a case of do it their way or the highway. And if they cared about the future of the sport, they wouldn't hold on to redundant rights (streaming, on demand) to the detriment of the fans. If it weren't for Sky, you'd be able to watch some recorded and live stream matches online. That cant be entirely true as bet 365 streamed meetings in 2014. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert72 Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 The relationship between Go Speed and Sky is strained to say the very least. Go Speed have had to make an awful lot of concessions to accomodate Sky and there wasn't going to be a 5 year contract (which I believe still has 2 or 3 years remaining?) unless GSI gave them all they asked for. For example, Sky do not only hold the rights to Elite League speedway on TV but they also own every form of transmission rights except trackside recording for DVD only. Streaming and on demand rights are held by Sky. GSI wanted to stream and make some matches available for the public to watch online however Sky refused to release the rights back to them, even though Sky has no plans to use them themselves. They simply wanted to make sure that fans in the UK could only come to Sky for their once a fortnight or whatever it is speedway fix. Sky want to keep Elite League speedway on their channels, but it's very much a case of do it their way or the highway. And if they cared about the future of the sport, they wouldn't hold on to redundant rights (streaming, on demand) to the detriment of the fans. If it weren't for Sky, you'd be able to watch some recorded and live stream matches online. There was a strong bspa announcement before Leicesters match last week saying anyone caught live streaming this meeting will be thrown out and banned for life from every track in the country ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 There was a strong bspa announcement before Leicesters match last week saying anyone caught live streaming this meeting will be thrown out and banned for life from every track in the country ? Lucky them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deano Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 (edited) There was a strong bspa announcement before Leicesters match last week saying anyone caught live streaming this meeting will be thrown out and banned for life from every track in the country ? So as speedway is a cash sport with 1950's type entrance tickets, they can police this how? In Poland to buy tickets you need to show ID. SO I can see them policing it. Not here though lol. Edited April 8, 2016 by Deano 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurntFaceMan Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 That cant be entirely true as bet 365 streamed meetings in 2014. Their deal was made before the Sky contract had been agreed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert72 Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 So as speedway is a cash sport with 1950's type entrance tickets, they can police this how? In Poland to buy tickets you need to show ID. SO I can see them policing it. Not here though lol. Just wondering if this bspa announcement has been at every track this season before the racing starts ? There is no way they can police it, how do they know if someone is videoing it or streaming it, secondly if caught are they going to take a picture of the person and put it up on every turn style at every track ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midland Red Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 If it weren't for Sky more fans would attend meetings at their track rather than from their armchair or pub Not true really Midland Red. Horses for courses. The majority of those armchair fans wouldn't bother attending even if it weren't televised. Sadly, it IS true - as I am guilty of it myself - I have missed several televised meetings over the years that I would have attended had they not been shown live on Sky Remember the "good old days" when the only way of watching speedway was at a track? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 Do you think the fact that because the match against kings lynn took place on a bank holiday monday (which coincidently also had one of the first days of spring sunhine) had anything to do with the amount of people who chose to attend? I was actually there and what i saw was a lot of supporters from other tracks getting their first fix of speedway in 2016. Certainly very few if any newcomers attracted by the 'big names' you have just mentioned. How do you know that, in your words "few if any newcomers attracted by the big names " ? Did you go round asking who the newcomers were and what attracted them ? How many did you speak to ? What did they say ? Another big crowd for Lakeside -v- Poole tonight. I suppose that was nothing to do with big names either and they would all have turned up regardless even if it was Berwick or Scunthorpe ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Dodds Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 How do you know that, in your words "few if any newcomers attracted by the big names " ? Did you go round asking who the newcomers were and what attracted them ? How many did you speak to ? What did they say ? Another big crowd for Lakeside -v- Poole tonight. I suppose that was nothing to do with big names either and they would all have turned up regardless even if it was Berwick or Scunthorpe ? What is the average crowd for the British GP at Cardiff - I only ask because the fact that it features all the top riders in the world must mean that it is a sellout every year with a huge waiting list for fans who will only turn up if "the best are on show". Most of these star riders cannot be seen racing in Britain on any other occasion so they are at the peak of their pulling power.. The fact that Cardiff actually draws little more than an average week of league attendances suggests that they are not the be all and end all that some claim - even to hardcore fans of the sport. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 What is the average crowd for the British GP at Cardiff - I only ask because the fact that it features all the top riders in the world must mean that it is a sellout every year with a huge waiting list for fans who will only turn up if "the best are on show". Most of these star riders cannot be seen racing in Britain on any other occasion so they are at the peak of their pulling power.. The fact that Cardiff actually draws little more than an average week of league attendances suggests that they are not the be all and end all that some claim - even to hardcore fans of the sport. Too many GPS ...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theboss Posted April 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 How do you know that, in your words "few if any newcomers attracted by the big names " ? Did you go round asking who the newcomers were and what attracted them ? How many did you speak to ? What did they say ? Another big crowd for Lakeside -v- Poole tonight. I suppose that was nothing to do with big names either and they would all have turned up regardless even if it was Berwick or Scunthorpe ? After 8 years of promoting you could say i have a good eye for guestiamating the demographics of a crowd, all though i would admit it will not and can not be 100% accurate. I am pleased to hear another crowd this evening, i would have been dissapointed to hear anything else considering it was a top of the table clash and the return of Davey Watt and Adam Ellis 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enotian Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 The problem is nobody focuses on the product. Decisions seem to be made to enable enough "promotions" to form a viable league each season with the "Have's" making enough concessions to what they want to encourage enough "Have Not's" to make up the numbers. (Typical of Motorsport. Always the factory teams accept restrictions but always end up winning) In any business the product is king. If you haven't got a product you don't have a business. More than ever you have to have a quality product in the entertainment business because there are so many alternatives for the customer, not just sporting. i.e. TV subscriptions, Concerts, Gaming, Dining Out the list goes on. So if your product is poor customers will naturally spend their disposable income elsewhere given the range of choices available. Whatever speedway in Britain becomes it must provide a product which is value for money. So what makes a good sporting product? I'd say unpredictability, a genuine contest between evenly matched teams. Isn't that why everyone is raving about this seasons football Premier League? The actual standard of football is way below previous seasons (all the best players play in Spain or Germany) but watching the same 4 clubs dominate had become stale. So crucially having a league of competitive teams is a must. Speedway with a points limit can do that more readily than any other sport but has still managed to mess it up!!!! Because the points limit leads to dysfunctional team selections. The product suffers if a GP star lines up against a novice 3.00 pointer who's in the team to make the numbers up. Total non contest. The current EL tried to avoid this by changing the format so each team has 3 teams within a team, which just hasn't worked. If you want an Elite product in this country with 7 man teams you need even the lowest averaged rider to be of an acceptable standard capable of being competitive. That is why I don't think Elite level speedway is viable in a 7 man team format in this country. The GP standard riders have so much higher budgets how can a domestic rider afford to compete. Elite teams could be filled with continental riders but the admission fee would increase and to be honest I can't see anyone paying over £20 to attend an event in a run down stadium. I guess there are now only 3 or 4 speedway venues in the UK which could justify hosting a premium priced event. Check out the competition. Even non league football stadium standards offer far greater facilities than most speedway venues. The general public expect more for their money than standing in a field. So if the facilities available don't allow premium pricing you need to find a product that is affordable within the price customers are willing to pay. The $M question I guess. Whatever that level is the product must be the focus. And that means well prepared tracks conducive to passing (no more setting tracks to ensure a home win), competitive teams in which the variance in rider standard is minimised and providing the best possible customer experience. This doesn't mean cost's can't be cut but be innovative. Try to centralise costs. i.e. track curators, medical teams resources can be shared between tracks. Contract league wide with equipment providers so riders can benefit from product discounts. Get the product right and believe in it. After all going to a great speedway meeting is so much better than all those other leisure options. We just need to make sure those great meetings are the norm and don't just happen by luck. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoke Potter Posted April 10, 2016 Report Share Posted April 10, 2016 How can a sport that only attracts fans in the 100's hope to have any real future? I wouldn't dispute the political arguments raised on here and I am no particular fan of how the BSPA appears to conduct itself, however it's not really the reason that nobody goes to watch. The product has to be right and it's not. The fact is most races at all tracks are boring processions. That needs to be fixed and to do that costs money as you need to fix the tracks. Modern day bikes have outgrown the small, narrow tracks of the UK. They all should be absolute minimum 300m and races should last at least 60 seconds otherwise it's all over too quickly. Adequate widths on straights and bends is also required. Of course all that will be shot down,mainly because of the cost but it's what needs to happen. Once you fixed the tracks then it's about having more equal teams from one to seven but that's for "Volume 2" of the debate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted April 10, 2016 Report Share Posted April 10, 2016 But small, technical tracks slow all the riders down, making it a more level playing field ....... I like to see how riders cope with all our different tracks, equally I like to see them flying round some of the huge Polish tracks ..... it's all about variety Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike.Butler Posted April 10, 2016 Report Share Posted April 10, 2016 a sport attracting crowds in 100's can have a future.. it's amateur 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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