Peter Craven/grand Opening

[pugwash]

I think the enquiry will find that it is in fact the EU to blame.If we weren't in the EU this wouldn't have happened

Matt Ford is now controlling the EU??

[Ghostwalker]

It didn't much, the problem was down by the kerb 4th bend, riders could have avoided that area if they wanted, just like they have to avoid ruts in middle of a meeting,

 

Well wouldn't this be the ridable but not race-able statement from Harris? It's fine if they go one by one but four riders at the same time involved in close racing

then they might not be able to avoid it? I also don't think you can just watch a video and from it determine that the track is safe or that it doesn't have any problems.

[OveFundinFan]

 

Well wouldn't this be the ridable but not race-able statement from Harris? It's fine if they go one by one but four riders at the same time involved in close racing

then they might not be able to avoid it? I also don't think you can just watch a video and from it determine that the track is safe or that it doesn't have any problems.

First let me say how I feel for the fans who travelled long or short distances, spending hard earned money for an evening entertainment.

However,

This first meeting was never going to be a classic meeting - a new track, riders not used to it etc etc. Obviously there was something wrong with the track (goes without saying).

If the problem "was down by the kerb 4th bend, riders could have avoided that area if they wanted, just like they have to avoid ruts in middle of a meeting" then the riders could have put on a show for the sake of the occasion, not "racing" within that section of the track. As someone said in one of the multi threads on this subject - treat it like yellow flags at a F1 meeting ie slow down, no overtaking.

By the riders putting n a show, the fans would have had some entertainment for the money and time they put into their evening entertainment, the press would have no "bad news" to report - which the press are good at doing, and the problem could have been sorted out..... like it is now (reports from BV say the corner 3/4 was being worked on today). The problem will be sorted, I am convinced of that, the stadium looks superb, bend 3/4 will be put right, and the racing will be excellent.

More then likely the crowds from Saturday night will get tickets for the rearranged meeting and those who don't want to travel probably get their money back.

I remember Peter Craven well, and would love to be at his memorial meeting, I may even go to the rearranged meeting and help the numbers there to make up a max attendance.

A big major slip up - certainly, and it shouldn't of happened, but lets not forget that this project (the new stadium) has to be a success for the furure of speedway in the UK - that's my opinion anyway.

 

My opinion was there was rider politics going on at Warsaw last year, and I wonder if there is some politics going on here re BV this year. Be sad if there was and I hope my thinking is wrong

[Midland Red]

I was interested to read that the "National Stadium" title was an essential part of the deal with the local authorities to create the facility

 

Perhaps many are assuming that, because it carries this title, the national speedway authorities, ie BSPA, have involvement with it, and as such have some responsibility over Saturday's unfortunate situation

 

The stadium is Belle Vue with a special name, and therefore the owners/promoters of Belle Vue are solely responsible for events (and non-events) at the site

[markyb]

Was supposed to be a memorial of Peter Craven - a speedway great of yester year and was always mentioned whenever the ONCE great Belle Vue were talked about.

 

So much dis-respect shown by the latest promotion - only hope for humanity shown to the Craven family who should have been celebrating with the rest of us (the speedway supporters) for what he provided to the sport in the UK.

 

And to think Belle Vue speedway had so much negative press in the days of Stuart Bamforth !

Edited March 21, 2016 by markyb

[TonyMac]

Whatever blame should be levelled at Belle Vue and they must take their share of the flak, I can't get past the fact that the riders did absolutely nothing to help avert a disastrous situation.

 

People who know and understand these things much better than me keep talking about fast bikes that can only be ridden flat out. Doesn't the throttle work both ways on these lethal lay-downs? Is it not possible to ride within the limits and make allowances for conditions?

 

At Belle Vue on Saturday there was a 'soft patch' on turns three and four. If there is a hole in the middle of your road, do you drive through it day after day, or engage your brain and steer around the problem area and apply a bit of common sense?

 

Trouble is, too many of today's riders are too concerned about their precious egos to compromise (remember Warsaw 2015?). Not prepared to get off the gas and accept a so-called lesser rider finishing ahead of them.

 

With great respect to the late Peter Craven, this was a routine open meeting, not a round of the GP, and they should've considered the paying public. Instead, most don't give a toss.

 

Was it beyond the realms of possibility for the BV management to explain the track concerns to the 6-7,000 crowd and then for the riders to at least put on some 'exhibition' laps - maybe one versus one match-races where it would have been easier to avoid the dodgy patch? The track is 347m long, has excellent width and various racing lines.

 

On the eve of his richly deserved testimonial meeting at Brandon, Chris Harris soon joined promoters Chris Morton and David Gordon in offering an explanation for the fiasco. In doing so, 'Bomber' admitted during his public address that they 'could have ridden, but not raced'.

 

Which begs the question: so why didn't they?

 

How many Elite League matches have we seen where riders have simply gone through the motions anyway?

 

Wouldn't something, albeit diluted, have been better than nothing for those who paid good money - and in many cases travelled hundreds of miles - just to be there?

 

Even if the riders (if not all, then the majority) had agreed to make some effort, dissatisfied customers could still have been offered a full refund. My bet, though, is that speedway fans being the tolerant, long-suffering souls that they are, they would have appreciated that some effort was being made and waived their right to a refund.

 

The riders would have received a guaranteed appearance fee; the fans went home empty-handed and feeling cheated.

 

Former Belle Vue junior Bernie Collier, one of numerous ex-Aces among the capacity crowd, recalled more pragmatic times when he told me: "We were riding at Newcastle one night in the early 80s. The track was diabolical and the meeting probably should have been called off. But Diamonds promoter Ian Thomas told us riders: 'The track's s*** but I'll pay you £100 each to just go out and put on a show for the fans' - and that's what we did."

 

But regardless of the differences in modern-day machinery compared to now, the days of 'where there's a will, there's a way' no longer seem to exist.

 

This meeting would never have been off in the pre-90s, when less precious riders would have just got on with it and more empowered promoters would have made sure they did. Imagine riders telling the likes of Silver, Fearman, Thomas, McCormick, Ochiltree, etc, etc, that they were refusing to make ANY effort to put on some form of show on their opening meeting. Had they done so, the chances are those riders would never have received an open booking there again.

 

It's riders who rule speedway today and as Warsaw and now Belle Vue have sadly demonstrated, that's not healthy. What these two shameful events have reinforced is my belief that British speedway needs to ditch its so-called 'stars' and go back to basics with mainly unpretentious young Brits racing slower machinery. Speed doesn't necessarily equal good entertainment.

 

How to slow the bikes is another issue and should be the responsibility of an SRA/SCB/BSPA 'technical committee', because speedway cannot afford any more repeats of Warsaw and Belle Vue.

 

Meanwhile, what should have been an occasion to remember for so many good reasons, is consigned to the sport's expanding hall of shame.

 

I'm just glad and fortunate to have covered speedway when I did.

Edited March 21, 2016 by tmc

[Fromafar]

Whatever blame should be levelled at Belle Vue and they must take their share of the flak, I can't get past the fact that the riders did absolutely nothing to help avert a disastrous situation.

 

People who know and understand these things much better than me keep talking about fast bikes that can only be ridden flat out. Doesn't the throttle work both ways on these lethal lay-downs? Is it not possible to ride within the limits and make allowances for conditions?

 

At Belle Vue on Saturday there was a 'soft patch' on turns three and four. If there is a hole in the middle of your road, do you drive through it day after day, or engage your brain and steer around the problem area and apply a bit of common sense?Excellent Post.

 

Trouble is, too many of today's riders are too concerned about their precious egos to compromise (remember Warsaw 2015?). Not prepared to get off the gas and accept a so-called lesser rider finishing ahead of them.

 

With great respect to the late Peter Craven, this was a routine open meeting, not a round of the GP, and they should've considered the paying public. Instead, most don't give a toss.

 

Was it beyond the realms of possibility for the BV management to explain the track concerns to the 6-7,000 crowd and then for the riders to at least put on some 'exhibition' laps - maybe one versus one match-races where it would have been easier to avoid the dodgy patch? The track is 347m long, has excellent width and various racing lines.

 

On the eve of his richly deserved testimonial meeting at Brandon, Chris Harris soon joined promoters Chris Morton and David Gordon in offering an explanation for the fiasco. In doing so, 'Bomber' admitted during his public address that they 'could have ridden, but not raced'.

 

Which begs the question: so why didn't they?

 

How many Elite League matches have we seen where riders have simply gone through the motions anyway?

 

Wouldn't something, albeit diluted, have been better than nothing for those who paid good money - and in many cases travelled hundreds of miles - just to be there?

 

Even if the riders (if not all, then the majority) had agreed to make some effort, dissatisfied customers could still have been offered a full refund. My bet, though, is that speedway fans being the tolerant, long-suffering souls that they are, they would have appreciated that some effort was being made and waived their right to a refund.

 

The riders would have received a guaranteed appearance fee; the fans went home empty-handed and feeling cheated.

 

Former Belle Vue junior Bernie Collier, one of numerous ex-Aces among the capacity crowd, recalled more pragmatic times when he told me: "We were riding at Newcastle one night in the early 80s. The track was diabolical and the meeting probably should have been called off. But Diamonds promoter Ian Thomas told us riders: 'The track's s*** but I'll pay you £100 each to just go out and put on a show for the fans' - and that's what we did."

 

But regardless of the differences in modern-day machinery compared to now, the days of 'where there's a will, there's a way' no longer seem to exist.

 

This meeting would never have been off in the pre-90s, when less precious riders would have just got on with it and more empowered promoters would have made sure they did. Imagine riders telling the likes of Silver, Fearman, Thomas, McCormick, Ochiltree, etc, etc, that they were refusing to make ANY effort to put in some form of show on their opening meeting. Had they done so, the chances are those riders would never have received an open booking there again.

 

It's riders who rule speedway today and as Warsaw and now Belle Vue have sadly demonstrated, that's not healthy. What these two shameful events have reinforced is my belief that British speedway needs to ditch its so-called 'stars' and go back to basics with mainly unpretentious young Brits racing slower machinery. Speed doesn't necessarily equal good entertainment.

 

How to slow the bikes is another issue and should be the responsibility of an SRA/SCB/BSPA 'technical committee', because speedway cannot afford any more repeats of Warsaw and Belle Vue.

 

Meanwhile, what should have been an occasion to remember for so many good reasons, is consigned to the sport's expanding hall of shame.

 

I'm just glad and fortunate to have covered speedway when I did.

Excellent Post IMO Edited March 21, 2016 by Fromafar

[ytsejam]

FURIOUS Belle Vue Chief Executive Officer David Gordon hit back at the criticism which followed the disastrous abandonment of Saturdays inaugural meeting at the new National Stadium, saying: This was NOT our fault.

 

Gordon and Chris Morton had to face a sell-out crowd to say the Peter Craven Memorial Trophy meeting had been called off after riders said the track wasnt safe following a practice session.

They were locked in an emergency meeting early on Monday with the Manchester City Council Project Team and stadium builders, ISG, to discuss what went wrong and what was to happen next.

 

Gordon stressed that all aspects of the stadium construction , including the laying of the track, were carried out under the stadium build contract. Belle Vues only responsibility was the erection of the safety fence, a specialist operation, which it was agreed would be done by track curator Colin Meredith.

 

Gordon said: There was a problem with the sub base of the track around the third and fourth bends which was recently completed. there were contractors workmen and machines out there first thing on Monday working to correct the problems."

 

 

Track work commenced early this morning

 

We had internal meetings on Sunday and meetings with the Council and the building contractors on Monday. The whole investigation process into what happened is ongoing. We will not comment until everything has been clarified.

 

The fact of the matter is that we didnt receive what we were supposed to receive. I cannot stress too much that we did not build this track, it was the responsibility of third parties and it was not fit for purpose.

 

We tried our best to get this meeting on but we were let down by circumstances beyond our control. We are now in serious dialogue with all concerned."

 

The contractors, who are not under our instructions, were working on the track first thing on Monday morning. The Belle Vue track curator is out there giving them advice and we hope his experience will help them get it put right.

 

Gordon added: The riders reaction not to race was understandable. The track was not raceable and how do you tell them not to race?

 

The work on the track will be reviewed by the stadium project team hourly and we will take a decision at 9am on Wednesday about whether or not we can run Fridays home meeting against Wolverhampton. If the remedial work is successful completed and tested then we will race.

 

We will be making a separate statement about re-staging and refunds for Saturday when we have taken advice about the contractual obligations that the other parties are subject to.

 

Asked about a Promoters Association statement blaming Belle Vue for what happened, Gordon said: No comment. I wouldnt make a statement like the BSPA have until I was in receipt of the full facts of the matter.

 

He concluded: Belle Vue Speedway are not to blame for Saturdays disaster. Other parties need to accept their responsibility and deal with the consequences.

 

What an embarrassingly pathetic excuse! Should be ashamed of himself for that disgraceful statement and offer his resignation as Chief Executive.

[Aceslider]

Was supposed to be a memorial of Peter Craven - a speedway great of yester year and was always mentioned whenever the ONCE great Belle Vue were talked about.

 

So much dis-respect shown by the latest promotion - only hope for humanity shown to the Craven family who should have been celebrating with the rest of us (the speedway supporters) for what he provided to the sport in the UK.

 

And to think Belle Vue speedway had so much negative press in the days of Stuart Bamforth !

Couldn't agree more markyb!

 

Total lack of respect shown for a wonderful ambassador of British speedway.

 

The front page of the meeting programme reflects everything this meeting was supposed to be about, a fact which was clearly forgotten when the opening speeches were made.

 

Without articulating the frustration of a wasted journey from Newcastle and a waste of money into boot, it was this undignified failure by the promoters to show a modicum of class in recognising the achievements and commitment of one of our finest riders ever which frankly really p****d me off.

 

I sincerely hope BV and indeed British speedway recover from this whole calamity.

[GASBLOKE]

OK OK OK, It would appear that nobody will accept the blame for this debacle. It's time to come clean, I broke into the stadium Friday night and dug a couple of holes on bend 3 and filled them with playdough. See, I am to blame.

Remember, it used to be called "Dirt Track Racing". Now its "lets make it flat, smooth and easy for the luvvies so

that the first out the gate will win, with no overtaking ---- Speedway.

[RobMcCaffery]

Whatever blame should be levelled at Belle Vue and they must take their share of the flak, I can't get past the fact that the riders did absolutely nothing to help avert a disastrous situation.

 

size=12]People who know and understand these things much better than me keep talking about fast bikes that can only be ridden flat out. Doesn't the throttle work both ways on these lethal lay-downs? Is it not possible to ride within the limits and make allowances for conditions?[/size]

 

At Belle Vue on Saturday there was a 'soft patch' on turns three and four. If there is a hole in the middle of your road, do you drive through it day after day, or engage your brain and steer around the problem area and apply a bit of common sense?

 

Trouble is, too many of today's riders are too concerned about their precious egos to compromise (remember Warsaw 2015?). Not prepared to get off the gas and accept a so-called lesser rider finishing ahead of them.

 

With great respect to the late Peter Craven, this was a routine open meeting, not a round of the GP, and they should've considered the paying public. Instead, most don't give a toss.

 

Was it beyond the realms of possibility for the BV management to explain the track concerns to the 6-7,000 crowd and then for the riders to at least put on some 'exhibition' laps - maybe one versus one match-races where it would have been easier to avoid the dodgy patch? The track is 347m long, has excellent width and various racing lines.

 

On the eve of his richly deserved testimonial meeting at Brandon, Chris Harris soon joined promoters Chris Morton and David Gordon in offering an explanation for the fiasco. In doing so, 'Bomber' admitted during his public address that they 'could have ridden, but not raced'.

 

Which begs the question: so why didn't they?

 

How many Elite League matches have we seen where riders have simply gone through the motions anyway?

 

Wouldn't something, albeit diluted, have been better than nothing for those who paid good money - and in many cases travelled hundreds of miles - just to be there?

 

Even if the riders (if not all, then the majority) had agreed to make some effort, dissatisfied customers could still have been offered a full refund. My bet, though, is that speedway fans being the tolerant, long-suffering souls that they are, they would have appreciated that some effort was being made and waived their right to a refund.

 

The riders would have received a guaranteed appearance fee; the fans went home empty-handed

 

But regardless of the differences in modern-day machinery compared to now, the days of 'where there's a will, there's a way' no longer seem to exist.

 

This meeting would never have been off in the pre-90s, when less precious riders would have just got on with it and more empowered promoters would have made sure they did. Imagine riders telling the likes of Silver, Fearman, Thomas, McCormick, Ochiltree, etc, etc, that they were refusing to make ANY effort to put in some form of show on their opening meeting. Had they done so, the chances are those riders would never have received an open booking there again.

 

It's riders who rule speedway today....

 

I'm just glad and fortunate to have covered speedway when I did.

Agree 100 per cent Tony, especially about that last line.

 

Was that track really worse than those in several Grands Prix or in certain Sky matches being forced through to heat 10?

Edited March 21, 2016 by rmc

[speedibee]

I blame the riders 100% , but thats my opinion and others have different , one thing that can be seen from the video posted on this thread is the potential for this track to be as fabulous as the old Hyde road one . what I would like to see now is the BSPA ,SCB and Belle Vue management , stop trying to pass the buck and work together to limit the damage that has been done to the sport . there must be a danger that Manchester City Council ,having invested a large amount of money into this venture and winding up with egg on their faces , will seek to limit the damage to their own credibility by withdrawing their support for the speedway and seek to use the stadium which has obvious suitablity for another purpose . I'm pretty sure No speedway fan whoever they blame would want to see that ,but I think it's a distinct possibility , time maybe for us all to put the football mentality aside and get behind the promoters who have done such a great deal against the odds ,to procure this fabulous venue for all of speedway .

[WembleyLion]

did anyone get out of control or fall during these practises ?

Yes Kildemand was out of control but no more than usual!

[Trevor]

I was there on Saturday night and was also at the Belle Vue v Poole meeting some years ago when with the SKY cameras there and Poole needed the win to get into the play offs so the match was 'raced' on a far worse track than Saturday night.

[speedwaysliders]

Anyone know who the ref was?

Really cant understand why they didnt try to stage heat 1,did he not have the balls to make them try?

Also just out of interest does this new track come with any high tech covers to safeguard other important meetings?

[Pinny]

The track was laid by people with no knowledge of laying a speedway track?!

 

In other news, its rumoured the meeting was arranged by two imbeciles with no knowledge on how to run a speedway meeting...

[Bagpuss]

Yes 'cause Kings Lynn would never have a track issue during a high profile meeting with GP stars in it would they? #purubbishthroughforskysake

 

If you are referring to the ELRC of 2007, as embarrassing as it was the difference is that the track was sorted on the night and the meeting ended up being a very good one.

Edited March 22, 2016 by Gordon Bennett

[ouch]

ELRC mate.

[Dornier]

In my opinion its the Belle Vue managements fault. After the track had been handed over as finished by the contractors it was down to the Aces track prep team to give it the final seal of approval, I would have expected the Aces management and track staff to be on site watching the final build of the track. A full scale track testing should have taken place days before the proposed meeting was attempted to be run. The stadium ran away with them and they forgot the track bit.

[baba]

Are some riders bikes tuned up that much that if they hit a rut they would have no control at all ?.

I just watch the awful crash when Darcy got injured, it looks like he hits unexpected grip and lifts coming out of fourth bend. These guys know their wringing the neck of the bike exiting bend four could this have been a majority gut feeling amongst the riders after discussions.