Notoriously Dirty Riders

[steve roberts]

1 hour ago, Sings4Speedway said:

Whilst slightly off the topic i think the above also illustrates the tremendous reactions shown by some in avoiding accidents and laying the bike down, over the years i have seen some tremendous feats of this underrated skill and big injuries prevented. Sadly in contrast i have seen riders travel significant distances and still collide with a fallen rider. It still slightly baffles me that we operate in a sport where big throttle use is often the only requirement for entry and safety/ability is not always the over riding requirement. 

Recall that Len Silver wouldn't allow someone to take to the track during his Training Schools until they had satisfied him that they were able to lay the bike down...I did read that he used to jump in front of a rider forcing them to drop the bike but I'm not sure if I actually believe that? Just read in the latest "Backtrack" magazine that it was also a requirement insisting upon by Ken Marshall who used to run Training Schools at Felton under the instruction of John Robson "...if they couldn't lay a bike down, they couldn't go out on the track."

[Vince]

1 hour ago, steve roberts said:

Recall that Len Silver wouldn't allow someone to take to the track during his Training Schools until they had satisfied him that they were able to lay the bike down...I did read that he used to jump in front of a rider forcing them to drop the bike but I'm not sure if I actually believe that? Just read in the latest "Backtrack" magazine that it was also a requirement insisting upon by Ken Marshall who used to run Training Schools at Felton under the instruction of John Robson "...if they couldn't lay a bike down, they couldn't go out on the track."

Trouble is that there is a world of difference knowing you have to lay the bike down and then doing it at the right time when you don't even get chance to think about it. 

I think all riders who go round a dirt oval eventually get to the stage where they lay the bike down automatically it's at the novice level it's often a problem and I doubt it's something you can actually teach in reality. I think that all that sliding out when learning takes away the fear of a lowside crash so laying it down becomes less of a mental block with time.

[steve roberts]

1 hour ago, Vince said:

Trouble is that there is a world of difference knowing you have to lay the bike down and then doing it at the right time when you don't even get chance to think about it. 

I think all riders who go round a dirt oval eventually get to the stage where they lay the bike down automatically it's at the novice level it's often a problem and I doubt it's something you can actually teach in reality. I think that all that sliding out when learning takes away the fear of a lowside crash so laying it down becomes less of a mental block with time.

I always remember when at Ipswich when Oxford were the visitors Kai Niemi got into trouble directly in front of Hans Nielsen and Hans immediately shut the throttle off all within a split second whilst remaining sat on his bike and not having to lay it down...very impressive.

Edited February 10, 2021 by steve roberts

[Tsunami]

1 hour ago, Vince said:

Trouble is that there is a world of difference knowing you have to lay the bike down and then doing it at the right time when you don't even get chance to think about it. 

I think all riders who go round a dirt oval eventually get to the stage where they lay the bike down automatically it's at the novice level it's often a problem and I doubt it's something you can actually teach in reality. I think that all that sliding out when learning takes away the fear of a lowside crash so laying it down becomes less of a mental block with time.

Yes, in the old days things were thrown onto the track to make a rider show he could drop the bike. I gather it went out of fashion due to the riders getting hurt and/of damaging their bike. I think nowadays new riders, trying to slide and drop it, are really practicing, unbeknown to them, ready for when they have to drop it.

[Sings4Speedway]

17 minutes ago, Tsunami said:

Yes, in the old days things were thrown onto the track to make a rider show he could drop the bike. I gather it went out of fashion due to the riders getting hurt and/of damaging their bike. I think nowadays new riders, trying to slide and drop it, are really practicing, unbeknown to them, ready for when they have to drop it.

In days gone by riders learnt on 2nd hand bike and in 2nd hand kit, now many juniors turn up on new gear with personalised covers, guards and kevlars. Try telling them or their parents that they need to chuck it up the track a few times as part of the learning exercise.

[steve roberts]

4 minutes ago, Sings4Speedway said:

In days gone by riders learnt on 2nd hand bike and in 2nd hand kit, now many juniors turn up on new gear with personalised covers, guards and kevlars. Try telling them or their parents that they need to chuck it up the track a few times as part of the learning exercise.

Funny but when I went to one of Olle Nygren's Training Schools at King's Lynn many, many years ago it was never discussed...and we certainly never laid any bikes down intentionally I recall.

[Vince]

31 minutes ago, steve roberts said:

Funny but when I went to one of Olle Nygren's Training Schools at King's Lynn many, many years ago it was never discussed...and we certainly never laid any bikes down intentionally I recall.

That's because they were Olle's bikes  plus with two riders half a lap apart it shouldn't be necessary. Those schools of his must have been the start of many a Speedway career.

[Midland Red]

5 hours ago, Sings4Speedway said:

Whilst slightly off the topic i think the above also illustrates the tremendous reactions shown by some in avoiding accidents and laying the bike down, over the years i have seen some tremendous feats of this underrated skill and big injuries prevented. Sadly in contrast i have seen riders travel significant distances and still collide with a fallen rider. It still slightly baffles me that we operate in a sport where big throttle use is often the only requirement for entry and safety/ability is not always the over riding requirement. 

I’m sure Bees fans will never forget the night at Blackbird Road when John Boulger somehow managed to lay his bike down behind a stricken Nigel Boocock. Booey suffered a hairline skull fracture from his mishap, what the outcome would have been without Boulger’s reaction doesn’t bear thinking about.

[steve roberts]

58 minutes ago, Vince said:

That's because they were Olle's bikes  plus with two riders half a lap apart it shouldn't be necessary. Those schools of his must have been the start of many a Speedway career.

One lad bought his own bike and it was a bugger to start...remember three of us pushing it an entire lap before it kicked into life! My brother went to one of Olle's schools a couple of years before me and shared a bike with Chris Prime who was later to lose his life at Newcastle.

[TheWatcher]

There was an article in Speedway Star in the early 70s about Ivan running training schools in New Zealand during the UK winter. He said the first thing the novices were taught was how to lay it down safely.

[Diamondboy]

On 2/8/2021 at 7:28 PM, Tsunami said:

He acquired that name by Roy, the presenter at Newcastle, who gave all Diamonds riders nicknames for his commentary. He didn't earn it as, as you say, he does chases back wheels and doesn't give up.

 

On 2/8/2021 at 7:48 PM, Blupanther said:

Lambert's nickname came from his days of helping his father on work sites as a young lad, its creation is not related to his speedway career...

Someone is talking crap, I know who my money is on 

[BluPanther]

5 minutes ago, Diamondboy said:

 

Someone is talking crap, I know who my money is on 

He told me that personally, why don't you ask him yourself...

[Diamondboy]

32 minutes ago, Blupanther said:

He told me that personally, why don't you ask him yourself...

What makes you think my money was on you?

[BluPanther]

8 minutes ago, Diamondboy said:

What makes you think my money was on you?

I don’t, just thought I would tell you what he told me as a courtesy...

[sommelier]

On 2/8/2021 at 7:48 PM, Blupanther said:

Lambert's nickname came from his days of helping his father on work sites as a young lad, its creation is not related to his speedway career...

Spot on regarding Lamberts nickname

[Skodaman]

13 hours ago, TheWatcher said:

There was an article in Speedway Star in the early 70s about Ivan running training schools in New Zealand during the UK winter. He said the first thing the novices were taught was how to lay it down safely.

This was mandatory in Aussie

[*JJ]

13 hours ago, TheWatcher said:

There was an article in Speedway Star in the early 70s about Ivan running training schools in New Zealand during the UK winter. He said the first thing the novices were taught was how to lay it down safely.

Some years ago, I drove a new rider around to the training sessions; nobody taught him how to lay it down (mind you, nobody taught anyone anything). However, when he was in about his last MDL match, a rider fell in front of him, and he laid it down in a flash. I don't know how he knew how to do this, though; probably having slid off onto his backside plenty of times!

[Tsunami]

1 hour ago, *JJ said:

Some years ago, I drove a new rider around to the training sessions; nobody taught him how to lay it down (mind you, nobody taught anyone anything). However, when he was in about his last MDL match, a rider fell in front of him, and he laid it down in a flash. I don't know how he knew how to do this, though; probably having slid off onto his backside plenty of times!

The problem is when they don't drop it, but freeze and continue to hit the fallen rider. 

[steve roberts]

2 hours ago, Tsunami said:

The problem is when they don't drop it, but freeze and continue to hit the fallen rider. 

I seem to recall a fallen rider was killed by someone who was some way behind who failed to drop the bike?

[Vince]

5 hours ago, Tsunami said:

The problem is when they don't drop it, but freeze and continue to hit the fallen rider. 

You also see novices sometimes get so fixated on looking at a fallen rider because they are trying to miss him that instead they head towards him. I went to quite a few amateur meetings with a lad a few years back and saw that quite often. We also see it regularly in the rookie class at flat track.