Work Permits - A Novel Approach

[AlanF]

I don't think that the way work permits are handed out is either fair or results in the best riders coming to Britain. I don't see how a rider performs on an 180 metre indoor track in NSW bears any resemblance to how he will perform in Britain. So what is the alternative?

 

A quick scan of the riders signed in Speedway Star suggests that there is a current need for about 25 work permit riders, give or take a few. I also believe there are more than 25 riders who would love to ride here, so why not get them to compete against each other for the privilege.

 

At a specified cut off date (let's say August 31st 2015) the top 15 work permit riders in the averages automatically qualify for a 2016 work permit. Use whatever multiplier is in effect to accurately compare EL riders to PL. Would also need some rule about which average to use for double uppers.

 

Any other rider who wants a work permit for 2016 has to apply by August 31st. Let's say that the 10 who finished outside the top 15 want to come back and 10 other riders apply. Those riders would then compete in a Grand Prix style format in several rounds across UK tracks in September. The top 10 get permits, the others can try again next year. Not only do we get the riders who can perform on British tracks, but also have some additional exciting meetings.

 

I know there are lots of details that would need to be defined such as somebody who qualifies and then declines a contract etc., but I think the basic premise is good.

 

Good idea or just crazy?

[waiheke1]

Main issue is who would pay to watch these meetings? What happens when riders pull out of the 2nd half of the series as they are out of contention?

And would such an approach really get the ok from UKVI?

[AlanF]

Was only thinking of about 3 rounds. One each on large, medium and small tracks. Din't know if if would fly with UKVI, don't they take direction from the BSPA on qualifying criteria?

Edited December 11, 2015 by AlanF

[SCB]

Where would you host it? It's an expensive way to compare Americans and Aussies and they'd need to do a lot of travelling. For me, if a rider doesn't hit a 7 point average for me that it, no work permit for 2 seasons - don't care what you do in Aus next year, you're not good enough. Then I'd say top 2 Americans and top 10 Aussies in the American and Aussie titles.

[foamfence]

I don't think that the way work permits are handed out is either fair or results in the best riders coming to Britain. I don't see how a rider performs on an 180 metre indoor track in NSW bears any resemblance to how he will perform in Britain. So what is the alternative?

 

A quick scan of the riders signed in Speedway Star suggests that there is a current need for about 25 work permit riders, give or take a few. I also believe there are more than 25 riders who would love to ride here, so why not get them to compete against each other for the privilege.

 

At a specified cut off date (let's say August 31st 2015) the top 15 work permit riders in the averages automatically qualify for a 2016 work permit. Use whatever multiplier is in effect to accurately compare EL riders to PL. Would also need some rule about which average to use for double uppers.

 

Any other rider who wants a work permit for 2016 has to apply by August 31st. Let's say that the 10 who finished outside the top 15 want to come back and 10 other riders apply. Those riders would then compete in a Grand Prix style format in several rounds across UK tracks in September. The top 10 get permits, the others can try again next year. Not only do we get the riders who can perform on British tracks, but also have some additional exciting meetings.

 

I know there are lots of details that would need to be defined such as somebody who qualifies and then declines a contract etc., but I think the basic premise is good.

 

Good idea or just crazy?

Crazy.

[Humphrey Appleby]

Good idea or just crazy?

 

The fatal flaw, aside from who'd pay for these meetings, is that Australian riders would have the expense of shipping equipment and setting themselves up in the UK for a few meetings. Few are going to be interested in doing that without any guarantee of a contract.

[AlanF]

 

The fatal flaw, aside from who'd pay for these meetings, is that Australian riders would have the expense of shipping equipment and setting themselves up in the UK for a few meetings. Few are going to be interested in doing that without any guarantee of a contract.

I think if you put them on NL tracks they would be very attractive meetings and would attract a good crowd.

 

Don't a lot of these guys come over for practice laps on UK tracks anyway? In any case, i think the onus is on the rider to get here if they want a permit. Those that are likely to have a chance of making it are likely to already have some form of sponsorship or unofficial agreement with a UK promoter if they make it.

 

I doubt it's the greatest solution, but it's much better than the current system.

[foamfence]

I think if you put them on NL tracks they would be very attractive meetings and would attract a good crowd.

 

Don't a lot of these guys come over for practice laps on UK tracks anyway? In any case, i think the onus is on the rider to get here if they want a permit. Those that are likely to have a chance of making it are likely to already have some form of sponsorship or unofficial agreement with a UK promoter if they make it.

 

I doubt it's the greatest solution, but it's much better than the current system.

British Speedway isn't run for their benefit, neither should it bend over backwards to suit them. They either fulfil the criteria or they don't come.

[AlanF]

I think we agree. That's why I and saying get over here and show us what you can do. My argument is that the current criteria is flawed. Finishing 4th on an indoor 180 metre track against little or no opposition is not a good indicator.

Edited December 11, 2015 by AlanF

[BWitcher]

British Speedway isn't run for their benefit, neither should it bend over backwards to suit them. They either fulfil the criteria or they don't come.

 

Tbf, his proposal isn't doing anything for their benefit, nor is it bending over backwards, quite the opposite really.

[Humphrey Appleby]

My argument is that the current criteria is flawed. Finishing 4th on an indoor 180 metre track against little or no opposition is not a good indicator.

 

Using the criteria of a state championship to award work permits is quite frankly ridiculous anyway. It should be done on Australian Championship positions only, even if it means going down the field a bit.

 

The Australian Championship is at least over 4 rounds and should be a better measure of ability.

Edited December 11, 2015 by Humphrey Appleby

[foamfence]

I think we agree. That's why I and saying get over here and show us what you can do. My argument is that the current criteria is flawed. Finishing 4th on an indoor 180 metre track against little or no opposition is not a good indicator.

I agree with that but it should be up to them to get their own house in order. Better qualifying rounds might help, I think the idea of letting someone come here, fail and be sent straight home several thousand pounds out of pocket, is unlikely to happen. More could be done to help young British riders develop as well, it's ridiculous when you have a PL team fully stocked with overseas riders (except for the enforced number seven) and NL teams with too many long term career novices blocking the way.

[The White Knight]

Big thing for me about this suggestion is Cost.

 

I cannot see British Promoters paying for travel to get these Riders and Equipment over here and, to be honest, I wouldn't expect it of them.

 

The Riders themselves will not pay for the Trip, as Humphrey says, without some form of Contract.

 

Whilst in theory this could be a good idea. Practically it is unworkable.

 

So for me - a none starter I'm afraid.

[AlanF]

Big thing for me about this suggestion is Cost.

 

I cannot see British Promoters paying for travel to get these Riders and Equipment over here and, to be honest, I wouldn't expect it of them.

 

The Riders themselves will not pay for the Trip, as Humphrey says, without some form of Contract.

 

Whilst in theory this could be a good idea. Practically it is unworkable.

 

So for me - a none starter I'm afraid.

 

Would not suggest that the BSPA should pay for it.

 

I think where we differ is in the riders willingness to pay their expenses. If they are not willing to invest in their career and will not do anything without a guaranteed contract, then it is good to weed them out and not waste a year struggling in the PL. If they want a career in a foreign country, the onus is on them to make the effort. The Aussies are such a tight knit group anyway, that I am sure they would be able to use equipment already here. I am sure that the riders we want in the UK, such as the Darcy Ward's and Brady Kurtz's of this world would have been well funded before they arrived in this country. Alternatively, go pick up some meetings in Europe to fund the trip.

 

If a rider is going to give up at the first hurdle put in front of them, they are unlikely to be successful anyway.

[The White Knight]

 

Would not suggest that the BSPA should pay for it.

 

I think where we differ is in the riders willingness to pay their expenses. If they are not willing to invest in their career and will not do anything without a guaranteed contract, then it is good to weed them out and not waste a year struggling in the PL. If they want a career in a foreign country, the onus is on them to make the effort. The Aussies are such a tight knit group anyway, that I am sure they would be able to use equipment already here. I am sure that the riders we want in the UK, such as the Darcy Ward's and Brady Kurtz's of this world would have been well funded before they arrived in this country. Alternatively, go pick up some meetings in Europe to fund the trip.

 

If a rider is going to give up at the first hurdle put in front of them, they are unlikely to be successful anyway.

I would imagine most of these Riders that you talk about could not afford such a Trip, on the offchance of getting in to the top group of your Competition.

 

A very long way to come for an Engine Failure, Tape Exclusion or Fall to cost a place in the top group and you go home having spent a lot of money for nothing.

 

What might possibly work would be to hold the Meetings at various Tracks in Australia but would British Promoters be prepared to invest in them. Personally - I doubt it.

[waiheke1]

Various meetings in Australia is exactly what is currently used?!?

[The White Knight]

Various meetings in Australia is exactly what is currently used?!?

Qualifying Meetings I meant. A set of Meetings which would be run to get Riders qualified to ride over here.

 

Say five Meetings at five different Tracks and the top five or ten or whatever number you like qualify to ride in Britain.

 

It is only an idea.

[waiheke1]

How would that be better than the current system of running six different meetings which riders can qualify from?

Who would go to watch these extra meetings, and how would it be better than the current system?

What it should be IMHO is the top "x" from the aussie final plus those who have met the required averages . Top 4 from state is ludicrous

[The White Knight]

How would that be better than the current system of running six different meetings which riders can qualify from?

Who would go to watch these extra meetings, and how would it be better than the current system?

What it should be IMHO is the top "x" from the aussie final plus those who have met the required averages . Top 4 from state is ludicrous

Basically it would be exactly the same Riders in all of the Meetings.

 

Hope that helps.

[Alan_Jones]

It's called the Australian Senior Solo Speedway Championship, held over 4 rounds this year, from which the top 8 or so should be made visa eligible, the number of qualifiers being adjusted to reflect the number of top riders not bothering to enter.