PHILIPRISING Posted October 30, 2015 Report Share Posted October 30, 2015 THE Chapman/Godfrey combo are very keen to embrace the views of fans, to listen to their gripes and their suggestions. Not all can be implemented, of course, but the fact that they are not deaf to what the public want would be a massive step in the right direction. They appear to have an innovative agenda and would certainly not be afraid to make some of the changes that people on here and elsewhere have been clamouring for. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted October 30, 2015 Report Share Posted October 30, 2015 THE Chapman/Godfrey combo are very keen to embrace the views of fans, to listen to their gripes and their suggestions. Not all can be implemented, of course, but the fact that they are not deaf to what the public want would be a massive step in the right direction. They appear to have an innovative agenda and would certainly not be afraid to make some of the changes that people on here and elsewhere have been clamouring for. Have a word with them about getting rid of 'Double Points' then Philip please. Then I can return to attending Speedway Meetings. Thanking you in anticipation. Yours in hope, Ian. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted October 30, 2015 Report Share Posted October 30, 2015 They appear to have an innovative agenda and would certainly not be afraid to make some of the changes that people on here and elsewhere have been clamouring for. The question is why now express an opinion these things after years of avoiding any critical comment? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g13webb Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 Exactly, so why go on about forcing clubs to say two nights. Let the promotions run on the most convenient night for their track. Letting the Promoters have a free hand is the reason our sport barely exists. The Sport needs structure. All the other countries like Poland, Sweden, Denmark, do it right yet you say we must continue with out shambled way of existence..... Lets imagine Torun or Leszno wanted to run on Tuesdays. .....Your saying that should be OK.. I bet the Polish authorities would think differently. To race in the Ekstraliga you race on Sundays only, anything else you drop down a division... That's the difference ..... Have a word with them about getting rid of 'Double Points' then Philip please. Then I can return to attending Speedway Meetings. Thanking you in anticipation. Yours in hope, Ian. You amaze me , you talk about the rights and wrongs of the sport and have strong opinions about race days and saying you don't want to see clubs folding, and then you mention that you would return to attending meeting if they did away with 'Double Points' . The 'Double Points' is a rubbish idea, but in the scale of importance in the sport it means nothing. All it does is gives a false impression of the score, so supporter can gloat or wallow in make believe. It doesn't hide the excitement of the races or have any impact on ones enjoyment. For you to use that as an excuse not to go is bewildering. The sport is desperate for all the support it can get, and you turn your back because of something so irrelevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A ORLOV Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 The question is why now express an opinion these things after years of avoiding any critical comment? Either they have finally realised that the fans are important and that some do have good ideas, they are suffering from a reduction in income and/or can finally see the demise of the sport. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arnieg Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 Either they have finally realised that the fans are important and that some do have good ideas, they are suffering from a reduction in income and/or can finally see the demise of the sport. I read Humph's comment as being a query about the Star breaking cover, not the promoters who remain anonymous and are just engaging in routine internal organisational politics/backstabbing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromafar Posted October 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 The question is why now express an opinion these things after years of avoiding any critical comment? If Philip Riseing said White you would say Black.!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) I read Humph's comment as being a query about the Star breaking cover, not the promoters who remain anonymous and are just engaging in routine internal organisational politics/backstabbing. I think it's interesting that the Star is only now reporting on what appears to be the dirty laundry of the BSPA - beyond of course the theatre of arguments over points limits and eligible/ineligible guest nonsense. It's always stayed away from that in the past, so either there's a serious fall-out in the BSPA or Philippe has some sort of interest in reporting this. Either they have finally realised that the fans are important and that some do have good ideas, they are suffering from a reduction in income and/or can finally see the demise of the sport. I think it's clear the current leadership has little idea how to address the problems - that came over from the Alex Harkess interview - but in fairness they are difficult problems to solve. One wonders what the BSPA office's interest is in trying to influence the choice of candidates though, unless of course someone is going to be held to account in the office for something if a particular candidate wins. The fiasco over the visas earlier this year was certainly down to the incompetence of someone. Edited October 31, 2015 by Humphrey Appleby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A ORLOV Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 I read Humph's comment as being a query about the Star breaking cover, not the promoters who remain anonymous and are just engaging in routine internal organisational politics/backstabbing. Apologies, can now see that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) If Philip Riseing said White you would say Black.!! Because when it comes to the SGP at least, he's very selective in what he reports and on occasions it's been quite palpable nonsense. I accept that in what is a very small sector that you somewhat need to maintain good relations with those you're reporting on, but the sport is not being well served by many of the current international (FIM/BSI/OneSport) and domestic (BSPA/GSI etc..) arrangements and a supposedly independent journal should be critiquing that. After years of avoiding that and expressing only the mildest and largely irrelevant critical comment, it does suddenly seem like a conversion on the road to Damascus. In fairness it's what I've been saying for a long time is needed from the Star, but actually we're not a lot wiser from this latest piece as we don't really know what's behind it all. For example, why does someone (allegedly) not want Buster Chapman near the levers of power? Edited October 31, 2015 by Humphrey Appleby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 Seems like every committee that ever existed will have those in it or those administering it who will try to influence things far beyond what their official capacity should be. I doubt the BSPA are much different in that way to most sports. I don't for the life of me get the continual criticism of Speedway promoters there may well be a couple I wouldn't pee on if they were on fire but I still accept that it's their time and money that keeps the sport going. Far from making a fortune out of killing the sport they must generally be trying not to lose the one they made elsewhere keeping it afloat. I have my opinion on how things could be improved and there is no doubt that it is far too difficult for new promoters to get things changed but in many cases the 'old' promoters are the ones who have managed to survive while others went to the wall so perhaps they have a valid point. Then it gets into the ideas that having set race nights will be the saviour of the sport. Can't see how it'll bring the massive influx of new fans in myself, losing a couple of tracks to it would lower overall crowd levels in my opinion. Same with guests, riding abroad and so on, its just more of the tinkering that the BSPA gets accused of at this time every year. That tinkering can help slow the demise but none of it will ever make the sport popular with the general public again. The only way that can happen is with a complete overhaul that changes the image of the sport and then I suspect most of us would be complaining that it's not the sport we loved any more. My opinions are just that, not necessarily solutions and I could be wrong on some or all counts. Since its not my money at risk they are worth very little in the scheme of things! Perhaps that's worth remembering by all of us. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 Of course we have to remember we are only putting in our £17 a week but there are plenty if us doing so still which the promoters are doing what they will with ..... Main thing for me is they do all the things for the sport that actually don't cost a penny, just a bit of effort and thought ..... which might actually please their customers and keep them coming back! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryn Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 Of course we have to remember we are only putting in our £17 a week but there are plenty if us doing so still which the promoters are doing what they will with ..... Main thing for me is they do all the things for the sport that actually don't cost a penny, just a bit of effort and thought ..... which might actually please their customers and keep them coming back! Care to list exactly what you have in mind Mother T? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) I would say one of the main things that doesn't cost extra money is to get the show running efficiently without too many breaks.Of course maybe doing that does cost money as they want to drag things out to collect more at the bar etc,but it does end up being counter productive and p people off For me although it probably never happens in the Uk I would also ask for a professional job to be done.For example it was announced a while back that today there would be a memorial meeting for Tobi Busch's father.Over a period of a week or more,riders were teasingly announced,then all of a sudden they declared that the council hadn't given the permission for the meeting and it was off and not even delayed to tomorrow or next week because the weather could be dodgy!!!!!!! Edited October 31, 2015 by iris123 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 I don't for the life of me get the continual criticism of Speedway promoters there may well be a couple I wouldn't pee on if they were on fire but I still accept that it's their time and money that keeps the sport going. Far from making a fortune out of killing the sport they must generally be trying not to lose the one they made elsewhere keeping it afloat. I have my opinion on how things could be improved and there is no doubt that it is far too difficult for new promoters to get things changed but in many cases the 'old' promoters are the ones who have managed to survive while others went to the wall so perhaps they have a valid point. I think it's fair to say many really can only be in it for the love of the sport or thrill of the chase, as there are certainly easier ways to make (and lose) money. I think the problem though, is that most appear totally out-of-step with the modern world - what people are interested in, how they communicate, and what they're prepared to tolerate. The problem is compounded by the fact the sport is so under-capitalised that it makes it difficult to really change anything even if you recognise the issues, and there seems to be no idea of how to attract sponsors or any other forms of funding that might help the situation. Similarly, any talented person who might be able to make progress on these things either wouldn't touch the sport with a bargepole, or very quickly become frustrated and move on. Years ago I was involved with the administration of a local football league and whilst most of the committee members were a lovely bunch who devoted a lot of time and in some cases their own money to running the competition, they'd been doing it for too long and were out of step with reality, to the point where I'm afraid to say they were actually detrimental to the future of the league. They had no clue about the importance of communication, how to leverage sponsorship, and certainly no idea about the Internet, and would likely have resisted any change anyway on the grounds that things 'had been done this way for 100 years' etc... I've seen the same pattern repeated in the motor sport clubs and competitions I've latterly been involved with - the result being that some formerly very big clubs are barely surviving, whereas the smaller ones prepared to move with the times are overtaking them. Quite simply it's sometimes better for the 'dedicated blazers' to stand aside than hang around, because it'll clearly signal that new blood needs to step in if the club/sport is to survive, and having something of a clean slate can encourage new people who otherwise couldn't be bothered dealing with the old politics. I'd accept speedway is more complex than amateur sport because it has significant costs and requires a reasonable investment on the part of the promoter, but as someone who's more or less an outsider nowadays, everything associated with the sport just seems incredibly old fashioned now. Even the photo of Len Silver (for whom BTW, I have every respect in sense of his contribution to the sport down the years) in this week's Speedway Star just evokes faint childhood memories of the type of person who ran rides at the end of the pier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromafar Posted October 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 I think it's fair to say many really can only be in it for the love of the sport or thrill of the chase, as there are certainly easier ways to make (and lose) money. I think the problem though, is that most appear totally out-of-step with the modern world - what people are interested in, how they communicate, and what they're prepared to tolerate. The problem is compounded by the fact the sport is so under-capitalised that it makes it difficult to really change anything even if you recognise the issues, and there seems to be no idea of how to attract sponsors or any other forms of funding that might help the situation. Similarly, any talented person who might be able to make progress on these things either wouldn't touch the sport with a bargepole, or very quickly become frustrated and move on. Years ago I was involved with the administration of a local football league and whilst most of the committee members were a lovely bunch who devoted a lot of time and in some cases their own money to running the competition, they'd been doing it for too long and were out of step with reality, to the point where I'm afraid to say they were actually detrimental to the future of the league. They had no clue about the importance of communication, how to leverage sponsorship, and certainly no idea about the Internet, and would likely have resisted any change anyway on the grounds that things 'had been done this way for 100 years' etc... I've seen the same pattern repeated in the motor sport clubs and competitions I've latterly been involved with - the result being that some formerly very big clubs are barely surviving, whereas the smaller ones prepared to move with the times are overtaking them. Quite simply it's sometimes better for the 'dedicated blazers' to stand aside than hang around, because it'll clearly signal that new blood needs to step in if the club/sport is to survive, and having something of a clean slate can encourage new people who otherwise couldn't be bothered dealing with the old politics. I'd accept speedway is more complex than amateur sport because it has significant costs and requires a reasonable investment on the part of the promoter, but as someone who's more or less an outsider nowadays, everything associated with the sport just seems incredibly old fashioned now. Even the photo of Len Silver (for whom BTW, I have every respect in sense of his contribution to the sport down the years) in this week's Speedway Star just evokes faint childhood memories of the type of person who ran rides at the end of the pier. Excellent Post IMO .That just sums the up the sport for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 In so many ways I agree with HA, the one issue is that there's not a queue of young people with fresh ideas waiting to put their money in. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star Lady Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) For example, why does someone (allegedly) not want Buster Chapman near the levers of power? Presumably because Buster is not a yes man and says what he thinks regardless of whether others agree or not. A few years back I had several conversations with Buster about the state of the sport and some of his ideas were radical to put it mildly, but I actually approved of several of them. Some, if they had been implemented at that time may well have had a beneficial effect on many British clubs and British speedway but there wasn't a snowball in hells chance of them ever getting passed. I have no idea if he still thinks the same way but I doubt he has done a complete about turn in his thinking. Edited October 31, 2015 by Star Lady Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanF Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) Communication and marketing by the BSPA is very poor. I live in the USA now but still follow the sport closely. However, there is absolutely nothing out there that would allow my interest to be turned into cash by the BSPA. I would pay good money for an app or site that let me see full Matches or highlights the following day or a subscription to a weekly highlights and news show. There must be a lot of people like me out there. You can't just rely on income through the turnstiles. Even minor league soccer here has a deal with You Tube where you can see any match played. Congrats to the Speedway Star for moving into the 21st century. You gained an extra subscriber. Edited October 31, 2015 by AlanF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 Congrats to the Speedway Star for moving into the 21st century. You gained an extra subscriber. At least two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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