Popular Post Tapeworm Posted October 12, 2015 Popular Post Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 I'm concerned about the current public witch-hunt being conducted against James Sarjeant's gating and hope that it doesn't spoil the two legs of the Final. If James is moving at the start, the referee shouldn't release the tapes. If the referee DOES release the tapes, he must be satisfied that the riders are not moving. Several of us were closely watching for this in yesterday's semi against the Rebels but could detect no movement on the occasions when the riders were recalled. We concluded that James is either superb at anticipating the tapes rising or he has far better reactions than others. In neither case, yesterday, when the start was declared unsatisfactory, did James touch or break the tapes. If he is a fantastic gater, what is he supposed to do ? Wait for half a second before dropping his clutch ? Or, perhaps, wait until the other 3 riders have gone before starting ? It was a wonderful response to his public warning, and displayed his competitive character, for him to shoot out of the gate in the re-run and win the heat at a canter despite the unwarranted threat of exclusion hanging over him. So, I, and many others, think this affair is the referees' problem, not James', and that they should look to their own starting procedures instead of publicly villifying one of the league's best young gaters. 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 I'm concerned about the current public witch-hunt being conducted against James Sarjeant's gating and hope that it doesn't spoil the two legs of the Final. If James is moving at the start, the referee shouldn't release the tapes. If the referee DOES release the tapes, he must be satisfied that the riders are not moving. Several of us were closely watching for this in yesterday's semi against the Rebels but could detect no movement on the occasions when the riders were recalled. We concluded that James is either superb at anticipating the tapes rising or he has far better reactions than others. In neither case, yesterday, when the start was declared unsatisfactory, did James touch or break the tapes. If he is a fantastic gater, what is he supposed to do ? Wait for half a second before dropping his clutch ? Or, perhaps, wait until the other 3 riders have gone before starting ? It was a wonderful response to his public warning, and displayed his competitive character, for him to shoot out of the gate in the re-run and win the heat at a canter despite the unwarranted threat of exclusion hanging over him. So, I, and many others, think this affair is the referees' problem, not James', and that they should look to their own starting procedures instead of publicly villifying one of the league's best young gaters. You will be in the minority in defending the indefensible. Yes, yesterday in ht8 it was as clean a gate from all 4 riders as you are likely to see but got pulled back however no riders were warned so perhaps just maybe it wasnt Sarjeant. The next rerun definitely was Sarjeant as standing from the fourth bend you could see he dropped the clutch momentarily before the tapes rose. He is notorious for it and hasnt learned this season that by his own actions he draws unnecessary attention to himself. Not a witch hunt by referees more an immaturity from the rider. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 (edited) I'm concerned about the current public witch-hunt being conducted against James Sarjeant's gating and hope that it doesn't spoil the two legs of the Final. If James is moving at the start, the referee shouldn't release the tapes. If the referee DOES release the tapes, he must be satisfied that the riders are not moving. Several of us were closely watching for this in yesterday's semi against the Rebels but could detect no movement on the occasions when the riders were recalled. We concluded that James is either superb at anticipating the tapes rising or he has far better reactions than others. In neither case, yesterday, when the start was declared unsatisfactory, did James touch or break the tapes. If he is a fantastic gater, what is he supposed to do ? Wait for half a second before dropping his clutch ? Or, perhaps, wait until the other 3 riders have gone before starting ? It was a wonderful response to his public warning, and displayed his competitive character, for him to shoot out of the gate in the re-run and win the heat at a canter despite the unwarranted threat of exclusion hanging over him. So, I, and many others, think this affair is the referees' problem, not James', and that they should look to their own starting procedures instead of publicly villifying one of the league's best young gaters. Another thing to add, I have checked back on all his tapes offences of the last 2 seasons and apart from the farcical one from 15 metres on Sky, James has only ever touched the tapes when off gate 2 or 3. Which suggests he sees some moment from 1 or 4 and goes. When he's off 1 or 4 and only has the tapes to watch, he just makes good starts. If he was anticipating he'd have far more than 5 tape exclusions in 2 seasons, he'd be touching them once a meeting surely, as nobody can get that lucky? He gets called back at least once a meeting now, how can he get lucky enough to one in every 4ish races to drop the clutch as the ref is pressing the button but only once every 20 meetings drop the clutch half a second or more before the referee presses the button? Because it's not like he rolls, he is either a witch who can anticipate with paranormal levels of accuracy or he just very good! If he was rolling or tape touching every meeting I'd say he was trying to cheat. As it is, I don't think he is. What amazes me is that a referee can be deemed eagle eyed enough to know Sarjeant jumped but Sarjeant can't be eagle eyed enough to just make good starts. All those referees calling him back are wasted in the referees box, they should all be out on track as they'd all lead every race into the 1st bend! edit> but he does need to get over this issue of jumping when he's off 2 or 3. Regardless of why it is. I wonder if James or anyone close to him is even aware it's a big issue off 2 and 3? And as such are trying to work out why. Edited October 12, 2015 by SCB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lukas Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 Shame Sky are not showing this.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pogo1 Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 Referees are now watching James Sarjeant in every race he is in , I can't believe that they can watch the other three riders properly when doing this, On Fri at Somerset R Worrall got a flyer in one race as he did yesterday in heat 14, what happened? Nothing! In heat 8 yesterday he made a perfect start only to be pulled back, yes he has been a victim of his own downfall while riding for Coventry but now every time he makes a gate it's questioned, watch on Sat night at Armadale if he makes a gate, all the blue jacket brigade will put there arms up in the air to the ref as they done in the league match trying to get him excluded, Rant over lol 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenway Bleachers Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 Its really easy for Skippy Sarjeant. Sit still don`t anticipate the start. Keep front wheel still. Drop clutch when tapes rise. Give it a try, you might catch on......... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazc Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 Its really easy for Skippy Sarjeant. Sit still don`t anticipate the start. Keep front wheel still. Drop clutch when tapes rise. Give it a try, you might catch on......... TBF not once did he move yesterday i stand right at the tapes and he was just making perfect start's think this is overlooked more often than not the boy is just a great gater and for that reason he is being tarred by a certain few because he is a great gater Anyway what was your view on his gating yesterday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damosuzuki Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 Ticket prices tigers £17. TBH I'm fortunate enough can afford it, and we are getting our moneys worth this season. But hopefully this isn't putting anyone off. One things for sure, regardless of the speedway, Ashfield will put on a good show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromafar Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 TBF not once did he move yesterday i stand right at the tapes and he was just making perfect start's think this is overlooked more often than not the boy is just a great gater and for that reason he is being tarred by a certain few because he is a great gater Anyway what was your view on his gating yesterday. I think the Refs just panic if some gets a perfect start,Summers got a flier in one race IMO and was not pulled back.I though Sargeant had 1 really perfect start but the ref pulled it back.I Personaly think the number of races pulled back is joke. The start Marshal needs get get the riders nearer the tapes to stop "anticipation"IMO 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenway Bleachers Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 If the ref thinks someone is anticipating the start, why can`t he/she then alter the timing so to stop this? or am i missing something? Once green light they can push button when he /she deems fit and if necessary hold them a second or 2 longer to catch the jumpers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan_Jones Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 Its really easy for Skippy Sarjeant. don`t anticipate the start. Why not? It's a legitimate tactic. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromafar Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 This might sound stupid and I am willing to take some stick on this matter,but IMO the bottom Tape should be lower down, so as the rider has to wait longer before he drops the clutch after the magnets release to get under them,that way riders definitely have to stay still.I will still be the same for every body when to drop the clutch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barncooseboy Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 good idea from I am sure that back in the 50s at St Austell the tapes had 4 elements across which put the bottom tape closer to the ground I guess the reduction in tapes is to save money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyclone Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 Will Friday's meeting be the first time that the floodlights have been used at Ashfield ? If so, remembering the problems they had when they installed a new starting gate, I hope they are fully tested before Friday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyretrax Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 Will Friday's meeting be the first time that the floodlights have been used at Ashfield ? If so, remembering the problems they had when they installed a new starting gate, I hope they are fully tested before Friday. No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazc Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 No. I was going to reply but after the pub posting by Cyclone your answer is more than adequate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arson fire Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 Its really easy for Skippy Sarjeant. Sit still don`t anticipate the start. Keep front wheel still. Drop clutch when tapes rise. Give it a try, you might catch on......... Cook was one of the biggest culprits before Sarj came along ffs 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruno Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 surely theres nothing wrong with anticipating the start as long as your not moving 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gr8scot Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 I go back a long way in speedway and remember the days when Dougie Templeton used to "duck under" the tapes before they were right up (well.... my Mum reminded me!) As far as I am concerned, if a rider anticipates the start without rolling and without touching the tapes...... let it go!!! Personally, I feel for James. When a young rider is under so much scrutiny, it must be really difficult to "get it right" 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyretrax Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 good idea from I am sure that back in the 50s at St Austell the tapes had 4 elements across which put the bottom tape closer to the ground I guess the reduction in tapes is to save money It's not the number of tapes that there is, the slide on the gate would have to be lower to make tapes lower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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