Glasgow V Edinburgh The Final 16th/17th October @7.30pm/7.00pm

[Robinh88]

poor kevin and his confidence

[scotchopper]

That is no excuse for vile and despicable abuse directed at innocent bystanders, foul mouthed language including the F*** word, etc. It was disgraceful and inexcusable behaviour by the individual I mentioned earlier, and it would appear there were others as mentioned by Gazc.

 

As for the leaflet you refer to it did not contain foul mouthed language nor did it state much of what's been misinterpreted by some.

 

I'm sorry that you felt intimidated and people were verbally abused. I can assure you that the vast majority of edinburgh fans are much better than that and as far as I am concerned visiting supporters are always welcome. It doesn't make it right but every club has their share of idiots and i hope it doesn't put you off. It wouldn't be fun without opposition and their fans and banter between them, as long as we draw the line at the right place. It is great for us right now although I am sure Glasgow will get their turn soon.

 

Having said that the letter handed out on Friday did cross the line as far as edinburgh fans are concerned, you say we misinterpreted it but I completely disagree. The letter said they were boycotting armadale and basically encouraged glasgow fans to do the same.

 

I could never agree with anyone boycotting meetings for any reason and find it very juvenile and wrong that they did that. I would like to think from your username justere2cgoodspeedway that you would agree with me. I have a couple of poor experiences at ashfield, for example I actually traveled through for the infamous sun off meeting but I was still there for next meeting and will always be there to follow my team. That is actually the saddest thing about this, Glasgow could have won the Championship under the new ownership in their first season and the owners did not travel to support their team.

 

There were 2 fundamental errors in the letter as well:

1. That they were surprised with edinburgh's position, anyone who know's anything about the edinburgh promotion would have known that was going to be their answer I am sure the same conversation happened last year and nothing has changed. You can disagree with them on their position but it certainly wasn't a surprise.

2. Edinburgh do not want to harm Glasgow or stop them from being successful from a financial perspective, this couldn't be further from the truth we want to see a strong Edinburgh and Glasgow, crowds like Friday and Saturday and at the League Cup Final will be a major boost to both clubs and we want to see that happen every time. They are trying to protect their interest, again whether you agree with them or not they are doing what they think is best for edinburgh speedway nothing more and nothing less.

 

I arrived at the same time as the tigers supporters bus on Saturday and heard a few suggesting they'll be happy when armadale shuts down and from this letter I guess the new owners feel the same. Leaves a bad taste in my mouth and after friday nights dreadful meeting it doesn't want to make me rush back to ashfield but I will be there for the spring trophy next year to cheer on my team.

 

I have been hugely impressed by the improvements at Glasgow this year and met your owners at the League Cup Final, they seemed like really good folk and very welcoming and enthusiastic but the timing of that letter means i have lost a lot of respect for them. I heard there were another couple of childish things going on as well. If you disagree with someone find another solution don't just throw your toys out the pram.

 

As for the speedway. It was brilliant to see Aaron Summers walk the track at armadale before the meeting, the crash on Friday was one of the worst I have seen and was amazed and very pleased his injuries were not worse so hope he recovers soon. I think that probably did ruin Glasgow's chances and it would have been a lot closer if he had 10 rides, I still think we would have won but would have made it very tight. The rest of the Tigers dug deep and did really well to get a 7 point lead but all the daft tapes infringements threw away points. Edinburgh were poor on the night with several riders struggling and making mistakes with Rob injured early Glasgow really missed an open goal there, speedy recovery to Rob as well he really has tried hard this year and whilst he would have wanted better he has chipped in with some important points, like heat 2 in the league cup final.

 

On Saturday edinburgh upped their game big time:

Cookie passed lawson as if he wasn't there in heat 1 and only a stupid fall ruined a perfect night for him 0.2 off the track record in October after coming from the back

Sedgy after a poor first heat never looked like getting beat

Kevin was excellent as well chuffed for him

Erik finished the season with a higher average than Max Fricke in his first season, if he cuts out the wee mistakes he will be brilliant

Sam was back to his old self on the engine he is planning on using in the GP

Max Clegg had a great night beating a tiger in every race

Thanks to Liam for taking the booking at short notice was really happy for him to take a point.

 

As for Glasgow

Lawson tried hard and was worthy of his points on another night would have scored more. Nice touch after ht15

Don't know how long it is since theo has been on a bike but looked very rusty, not his fault that glasgow had to find a guest at short notice. Kakke would probably have scored more

putting aaron at number 3 was an interesting gamble but backfired when he went down. he would have got a lot more than 5+1 on current form

Morris was very average, don't understand why he couldn't bring his swindon or world cup form into the PL maybe injuries taking their toll. 2 tape exclusions in the first meeting was dreadful. He needed to be at his best in both meetings for Glasgow to have a chance and it didn't happen

Victor was put in a difficult position with the tactical change and it just didn't work out. I hope his withdrawal from ht13 wasn't as a result of his earlier fall

Hynek scored better than I thought he would but only finished ahead of 2 monarchs, liam carr in ht2 and benefited from cookies fall

Sarjeant tries too hard and puts too much pressure on himself I think he is being poorly advised as he has real potential. Threw his toys out the pram in the end but showed his passion for it, again hope he is ok after a couple of falls

 

All in all from a monarchs perspective a brilliant night and appropriate that our 2 stand out riders, Sam for first half of the season and Cookie for the 2nd half, brought the housedown with the 5-1 that secured the Cup. Amazing scenes afterwards in the bar, i think it almost topped last year.

 

Speedway is over for another year and we get a well earned rest now but cannot wait to see the battles again next year and hope we are talking about events on track and not off track.

[GS550]

Having said that the letter handed out on Friday did cross the line as far as edinburgh fans are concerned, you say we misinterpreted it but I completely disagree. The letter said they were boycotting armadale and basically encouraged glasgow fans to do the same.

 

I could never agree with anyone boycotting meetings for any reason and find it very juvenile and wrong that they did that.

 

There were 2 fundamental errors in the letter as well:

1. That they were surprised with edinburgh's position, anyone who know's anything about the edinburgh promotion would have known that was going to be their answer I am sure the same conversation happened last year and nothing has changed. You can disagree with them on their position but it certainly wasn't a surprise.

2. Edinburgh do not want to harm Glasgow or stop them from being successful from a financial perspective, this couldn't be further from the truth we want to see a strong Edinburgh and Glasgow, crowds like Friday and Saturday and at the League Cup Final will be a major boost to both clubs and we want to see that happen every time. They are trying to protect their interest, again whether you agree with them or not they are doing what they think is best for edinburgh speedway nothing more and nothing less.

 

 

The circular you mention or what you refer to as a "letter", which you say "crossed it line" - having read it I cannot find anything unreasonable in it. It also does not state that Glasgow fans should "boycott" Armadale, it simply says that the Glasgow management themselves will not be attending - a different thing entirely. And at no point is the word "boycott" mentioned - that appears to be an invention by Edinburgh fans. So, no, it did not cross a line, that is just nonsense. It appears that it is the Edinburgh management that are juvenile in all this, and which the Glasgow management have understandably become tired of.

 

You say Glasgow made 2 fundamental errors, in answer to your points:

1. It seems that they were surprised by how juvenile the Edinburgh management were.

2. It appears that Edinburgh management are jealous of Glasgow's financial position

 

Can we be very clear: it is complete nonsense for Edinburgh to object to Glasgow riding on a Friday, Edinburgh's apparent claim that Glasgow would somehow steal significant numbers from Edinburgh's gate/crowd is not valid and has no real basis in fact: the Edinburgh management unilaterally withdrew the mutual discount arrangement between the two clubs on the basis of there having been only 2 supporters that had used it. Edinburgh's argument just doesn't add up. Clearly, fans of each camp follow their own team and will attend accordingly. Are you seriously suggesting that you and a whole shedload of other Edinburgh fans will somehow desert Armadale en mass and instead flock to Ashfield? That argument just doesn't hold water at all. The stance on this by Edinburgh's management does seem rather pathetic. It also seems pathetic and rather childish that the Edinburgh management withdrew from what was clearly a mutual cooperation gesture originated by the Glasgow management, re the joint discount arrangement. It seems that at every turn Edinburgh have sought to be deliberately uncooperative and have shunned every attempt by the Glasgow management regarding mutual cooperation and Glasgow's attempts to encourage a more friendly atmosphere between the two sets of fans for the benefit of all. Edinburgh's management have shown themselves to be aloof at best and deliberately obstinate. This appears to have had the knock on effect of encouraging Edinburgh's supporters to follow suit and take umbrage at anything emanating from Glasgow and thereby stoking up a hostile atmosphere among its own fans towards Glasgow.

 

There is therefore no actual basis for Edinburgh to object to Glasgow running on a Friday, no actual basis at all. Edinburgh fans will not desert Armadale and flock to Ashfield instead, that is just nonsense. It seems Edinburgh have just objected because they can, for the sake of objecting and putting a spanner in the works over at Glasgow. So that again really is childish on the part of the Edinburgh management whom it would appear are just being deliberately obstructive.

 

Then there is the position of Alex Harkess. He should surely not play a part in deciding on this issue or various issues upon which Edinburgh are involved. There is far too much self interest in the sport and conflict of interest by those running it.

 

It appears that Edinburgh's position is one of sheer jealousy that Glasgow are doing alright financially and with their stadium etc and they don't want Glasgow to be successful. That's what its about. Sheer jealousy and childishness by the Edinburgh management. And from there total non-cooperation in anything by Edinburgh. Little wonder that the Glasgow management became tired of it all and hence the circular you refer to which in fact contains nothing which crosses any line at all.

 

The summary of the riders, yes I agree with much of your summary. You missed one aspect though. Wolbert substantially lowered his average at Glasgow last season and by some coincidence substantially raised it again. This raises a serious question i.e. was it deliberate on his part? If it was then that brings the sport into disrepute and begs a number of other questions including fraud and corruption of those involved. He isn't the first rider to do so and I'm sure won't be the last.

 

The dreadful performance of Glasgow's team at Armadale, the track does tend to suit the home team more than most and if you aren't dialled in then no matter how hard a team tries they will get nothing, not as neutral and fair as Powderhall was so that kind of one sided result was always on the cards at Armadale, a bit like Berrington Lough used to be.

[TheScotsman]

Deary me.

 

And regarding the track, Glasgow had already won there this season.

[Shadders]

Regarding the track, Rye House used to be a place where no away team enjoyed to visit. Now it's more or less help yourself. It's not just the track, it's the standard of the home riders. Edinburgh seem to be pretty decent away, so you can't put it all down to home advantage.

Edited October 19, 2015 by Shads

[Gazc]

 

The circular you mention or what you refer to as a "letter", which you say "crossed it line" - having read it I cannot find anything unreasonable in it. It also does not state that Glasgow fans should "boycott" Armadale, it simply says that the Glasgow management themselves will not be attending - a different thing entirely. And at no point is the word "boycott" mentioned - that appears to be an invention by Edinburgh fans. So, no, it did not cross a line, that is just nonsense. It appears that it is the Edinburgh management that are juvenile in all this, and which the Glasgow management have understandably become tired of.

 

You say Glasgow made 2 fundamental errors, in answer to your points:

1. It seems that they were surprised by how juvenile the Edinburgh management were.

2. It appears that Edinburgh management are jealous of Glasgow's financial position

 

Can we be very clear: it is complete nonsense for Edinburgh to object to Glasgow riding on a Friday, Edinburgh's apparent claim that Glasgow would somehow steal significant numbers from Edinburgh's gate/crowd is not valid and has no real basis in fact: the Edinburgh management unilaterally withdrew the mutual discount arrangement between the two clubs on the basis of there having been only 2 supporters that had used it. Edinburgh's argument just doesn't add up. Clearly, fans of each camp follow their own team and will attend accordingly. Are you seriously suggesting that you and a whole shedload of other Edinburgh fans will somehow desert Armadale en mass and instead flock to Ashfield? That argument just doesn't hold water at all. The stance on this by Edinburgh's management does seem rather pathetic. It also seems pathetic and rather childish that the Edinburgh management withdrew from what was clearly a mutual cooperation gesture originated by the Glasgow management, re the joint discount arrangement. It seems that at every turn Edinburgh have sought to be deliberately uncooperative and have shunned every attempt by the Glasgow management regarding mutual cooperation and Glasgow's attempts to encourage a more friendly atmosphere between the two sets of fans for the benefit of all. Edinburgh's management have shown themselves to be aloof at best and deliberately obstinate. This appears to have had the knock on effect of encouraging Edinburgh's supporters to follow suit and take umbrage at anything emanating from Glasgow and thereby stoking up a hostile atmosphere among its own fans towards Glasgow.

 

There is therefore no actual basis for Edinburgh to object to Glasgow running on a Friday, no actual basis at all. Edinburgh fans will not desert Armadale and flock to Ashfield instead, that is just nonsense. It seems Edinburgh have just objected because they can, for the sake of objecting and putting a spanner in the works over at Glasgow. So that again really is childish on the part of the Edinburgh management whom it would appear are just being deliberately obstructive.

 

Then there is the position of Alex Harkess. He should surely not play a part in deciding on this issue or various issues upon which Edinburgh are involved. There is far too much self interest in the sport and conflict of interest by those running it.

 

It appears that Edinburgh's position is one of sheer jealousy that Glasgow are doing alright financially and with their stadium etc and they don't want Glasgow to be successful. That's what its about. Sheer jealousy and childishness by the Edinburgh management. And from there total non-cooperation in anything by Edinburgh. Little wonder that the Glasgow management became tired of it all and hence the circular you refer to which in fact contains nothing which crosses any line at all.

 

The summary of the riders, yes I agree with much of your summary. You missed one aspect though. Wolbert substantially lowered his average at Glasgow last season and by some coincidence substantially raised it again. This raises a serious question i.e. was it deliberate on his part? If it was then that brings the sport into disrepute and begs a number of other questions including fraud and corruption of those involved. He isn't the first rider to do so and I'm sure won't be the last.

 

The dreadful performance of Glasgow's team at Armadale, the track does tend to suit the home team more than most and if you aren't dialled in then no matter how hard a team tries they will get nothing, not as neutral and fair as Powderhall was so that kind of one sided result was always on the cards at Armadale, a bit like Berrington Lough used to be.

A nuetral's perspective and very well put instead off one side against the other.

[TheScotsman]

Doesn't read very neutral to me.

[Gazc]

Doesn't read very neutral to me.

Reads to me the way they see it from a neutral.

Edited October 19, 2015 by Gazc

[TheScotsman]

Seriously Gazc?

 

It's just a total anti all things Edinburgh post.

 

Even I am better balanced towards Glasgow than that.

[mudflaps]

Well done Edinburgh - by far the best team in the PL this season!

[scotchopper]

Don't know the person but they certainly aren't neutral.

 

I intentionally did not touch on the subject of Friday night racing in my post because even if all of your claims and the claims in the letter (or whatever you want to call it) were true imo it does not justify it. The timing was atrocious and it was flawed. There can be no justification for boycotting another track.

 

If I was a Glasgow fan I would be worried that they did not travel to support their team in such a huge meeting regardless of the reason.

 

Anybody who spends more than 2 mins on the bsf will know that what is written can be easily interpreted many ways, sometimes accidentally or innocently and sometimes mischievously or vindictively. In the same way it can be written to have multiple meetings again unintentionally or completely on purpose.

 

As far as I am concerned the letter can be summed up in a sentence: thank you to our fans and boycott evil edinburgh. It doesn't say that but it might as well

[Young51]

Doesn't read very neutral to me.

You got that one spot on..could have been penned in Possil.Usual guff i'm afraid ..it seems that a fair percentage of the West Coast lot are trying to paint the Monarchs as bullies in all this..laughable!That letter handed out on friday is a pure spit oot the dummy moment.The Glasgow Nostra Promotion have done wonderful things to the new improved Slashfield stadium and must be applauded for that...but it seems they've not learned from previous promotions stunts..June 2010 for example..This blatant mass pisstake quite rightly scunnered many Monarchs fans like myself who previously were more than happy to attend Ashfield.Not only that it ripped the pish out of their their own supporters..But no instead of trying to mend fences with us and herald 'a new beginning for Scottish speedway' it appears they've declared war..oh dear.. From what i understand an offer was made to discuss this whole matter after the dust had settled on the Grand Final..but no they had to pre-empt that and hand out this piece of crap.. I hope things can be worked out but the way things have gone so far i won't hold my breath!Anyways..who won the Grand Final????Oh aye it was the men in Blue & Gold What a night and what a fantastic achievement by the Mighty Monarchs to win back to back to back titles..to say i feel proud would be an understatement!The best team over the season won thankfully.5 (yes 5 ) titles in 12 years is fantastic,especially when you sadly have to dismantle your winning team..big respect to our promotion and everyone involved behind the scene to achieve this without having the dosh of say..the Possil Park Galacticos lol.. However,none of this extra curricular guff coming from the West can take the gloss off this..superb! GIRUYT Hope everyone has a fantastic close season..i may pop up from time to time if anything comes of interest during the methanol withdrawal season..have a good one my friends

Edited October 19, 2015 by Young51

[SCB]

I do love a Glasgow/Edinburgh thread. I was worried before the meetings everything was too nice, this is more like it. FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT!

[Fromafar]

c'mon guys your upsetting the Berwick Fans with all this bickering,hogging the limelight.!!!!

[Young51]

Losing Aaron was too much he only rode in one race and scored 3 points in his second he was involved in a horrific crash. The effort after that from the rest of the boys showed true spirit to have a lead for second leg. I think edinburgh know that they only won due to our captain being injured. They weren't the best over two legs. We chose a guest who the night before was down scunny at the awards ceremony probably getting rubbered and it showed in his performance at armadale. So well done cookie and co on your title.

What council thing damosuzuki?

Aye right dream on Baba..were you hitting the Buckfast Cocktails early..dearo dear.. Even with Spud..who is still very much liked at Armadale by the way..it wouldnt have stopped the Peugeot Weegie Wagon sinking..NEWSFLASH>>The best team won over the two legs and over the whole season..get over it lol..

Edited October 19, 2015 by Young51

[Fromafar]

I would like to know how many Monarchs FANS genuinely think Tigers running on the same night would affect attendances at Armadale.IMO the Tigers promotion have a point,but do feel the last couple of paragraphs in the "Letter" are a little petty and unprofessional.

[SharpenRake]

This is gonna run and run basically Edinburgh fans are being told what the letter really meant, they obviously can't be trusted to read it for themselves - god they might think Glasgow have a point!

For those not on facebook give it a go its got even more 'interesting' views. someone suggested that Wolbert cheated the Glasgow public last year and edinburgh has benefitted - does that make him a 'benefits cheat'? as if anyone from Edinburgh would do such a thing! Surly the Daily Mail should investigate?

[george.m]

You got that one spot on..could have been penned in Possil.Usual guff i'm afraid ..it seems that a fair percentage of the West Coast lot are trying to paint the Monarchs as bullies in all this..laughable!That letter handed out on friday is a pure spit oot the dummy moment.The Glasgow Nostra Promotion have done wonderful things to the new improved Slashfield stadium and must be applauded for that...but it seems they've not learned from previous promotions stunts..June 2010 for example..This blatant mass pisstake quite rightly scunnered many Monarchs fans like myself who previously were more than happy to attend Ashfield.Not only that it ripped the pish out of their their own supporters..But no instead of trying to mend fences with us and herald 'a new beginning for Scottish speedway' it appears they've declared war..oh dear.. From what i understand an offer was made to discuss this whole matter after the dust had settled on the Grand Final..but no they had to pre-empt that and hand out this piece of crap.. I hope things can be worked out but the way things have gone so far i won't hold my breath!Anyways..who won the Grand Final????Oh aye it was the men in Blue & Gold What a night and what a fantastic achievement by the Mighty Monarchs to win back to back to back titles..to say i feel proud would be an understatement!The best team over the season won thankfully.5 (yes 5 ) titles in 12 years is fantastic,especially when you sadly have to dismantle your winning team..big respect to our promotion and everyone involved behind the scene to achieve this without having the dosh of say..the Possil Park Galacticos lol.. However,none of this extra curricular guff coming from the West can take the gloss off this..superb! GIRUYT Hope everyone has a fantastic close season..i may pop up from time to time if anything comes of interest during the methanol withdrawal season..have a good one my friends

You have a good one too!

[Mr Blobby]

This is gonna run and run basically Edinburgh fans are being told what the letter really meant, they obviously can't be trusted to read it for themselves - god they might think Glasgow have a point!

For those not on facebook give it a go its got even more 'interesting' views. someone suggested that Wolbert cheated the Glasgow public last year and edinburgh has benefitted - does that make him a 'benefits cheat'? as if anyone from Edinburgh would do such a thing! Surly the Daily Mail should investigate?

 

Ah Facebook some wonderful Glasgow fans on there wishing Edinburgh closed the stadium got burned down etc. Smashing people really, clearly never took Saturday night very well.

[damosuzuki]

Hopefully we won't have to stomach any of this next year then.

 

http://www.speedway-forum.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=80123

 

 

It's broken, I don't know how to fix it, nothing to do with me, ......Oh look someone is trying to fix it, Lets try and stop them. Oh and by the way, we aren't going to do anything about our infrastructure at Armadale, we don't own it, there's nothing we can do, next season we'll be out of business, give us your money...etc etc etc.

 

Speedway is an incredibly exciting sport and exists in the same market as Ice Hockey, Basketball etc. IE massive family market. Not football, but potentially in the thousands. But for that you need certain things - and the current Edinburgh Head honchos have done nothing about it. I am not blaming Edinburgh speedway fans - it happens at every club. It happened at Glasgow. It all costs money that I certainly don't have.

 

But I am blaming tptb at Edinburgh for saying they can't see a solution and then when someone starts to seriously attempt a solution - they kybosh it. My big hope is that someone of vision buys into Edinburgh speedway. They are a sleeping giant - great side on the track but eeking out an existence at Armadale. I saw this happen in football 20 years ago when clubs were dragged into the twenty first century and I believe it will happen at Edinburgh, just not under the present management who have done incredibly well on the track but by their own admission have run out of ideas for making speedway popular.

 

Even Edinburgh Supporters must see this.