Attendances

[billybikespeedway]

I have only been to a few meeting since Newport closed Twice to somerset but dont like a track with no straights, but my main point in lack of attendances is the noise and smell , when I went to Somerton Park In 1964 the noise and the smell made me addicted, the racing was rubbish the score irrelevant, as it was the noise but maily the smell which kept us coming back week after week, that intense smell seems to have diminished somewhat

[Stoke Potter]

You should know by now that that is a Tatum euphemism for "This visiting side are rubbish and are going to get a tonking but I have to tell the punters something to stop them turning off too early and killing the advertising revenue." !

 

If a track doesn't produce good racing it is basically only going to hurt that particular promoter whether it is big or smali so it's not the sort of thing a central body can legislate on. Anyway track size is dictated more by FIM rules than BSPA rules and I very much doubt that the A CU would back the SCB if they tried to makes rules on track si size that were more restrictive than the FIM if a promoter appealed.

 

Cardiff is a small tight track of well under 300 metres and it gets the biggest crowd anywhere so I don't think your argument on track size stands up

It's not just Tatum saying it, it's a stock phrase. "It'll make some lines later". No, prepare it so it's got some lines from Heat 1!

Cardiff is the perfect example, small, tight, generally poor racing even though it's the world's best riders.

How many go for the atmosphere or a beer? It's a one off once a year, how many would go if it were on every fortnight?

Agree with a lot of what you say Stoke Potter. Just seen a cracking football match this afternoon, goals,incident,cracking entertainment in front of a crowd who were in it for 90 minutes. No circus acts, dancing girls or young funky music just a cracking core product which lets be honest is why we follow sport in the first place. Some of the people I attend speedway with have stopped going this year simply because the racing is not good enough and they are bored,the presentation is good but the core product is not good enough often enough.You can advertise,promote all you want but if people are not impressed first off they won't be back and will follow the many other thousands who have already walked away.

That's the problem it's boring too often. People want bar to bar, elbow to elbow stuff. It just doesn't happen.

Was it Lakeside who did a free meeting and still only got 3000 or something to turn up? Joe Public think its boring, because much of the time it is.

Customer is ALWAYS right!

[E I Addio]

It's not just Tatum saying it, it's a stock phrase. "It'll make some lines later". No, prepare it so it's got some lines from Heat 1!

Cardiff is the perfect example, small, tight, generally poor racing even though it's the world's best riders.

How many go for the atmosphere or a beer? !

It still gets a far bigger crowd than any other track that only has one meeting a year. Whether the racing is good of bad is a subjective opinion. The thread is about attendances and the fact remains that for whatever reason it is a small track with a big crowd. I don't see people talking about massive crowds at Swindon, Kings Lynn, or Pete rborough,at least not parvticularly bigger than Wolves or other small tracks. Edited October 31, 2015 by E I Addio

[E I Addio]

It's not just Tatum saying it, it's a stock phrase. "It'll make some lines later". No, prepare it so it's got some lines from Heat 1!

!

f

 

Who else says it apart from TV commentators who don't want their audiences turning off before the adverts come on?

 

The best, if not one of the best races I saw last season was between Doyle AJ and Bech , Lakeside v Leicester on 25th June. Doyle gated then passed by first AJand Bech, lap 2 Dolye passed them both to retake the lead, lap 3 AJ and Bech re-pass Doyle and hold on for the win., As good a race as you'll see anywhere with six passes in three laps, all in Heat 1 on a small track. Off course not every hear 1 is like that. But nor are all other heats.

 

Maybe you don't visit many tracks but your argumement that all heat 1'sare processional and it's all down to small tracks or track prep simply doesn't stand up. Weather conditions and the experience of the various track curators play a part but the reasons for falling attendances are complex and varied but like most people you look for quick fixes and easy answers but there are none,.There are a whole range of issues that need to be addressed, both on track and off, but lack of money is one of the major obstacles.

Edited October 31, 2015 by E I Addio

[Gemini]

 

..........E I Addio..... I suppose that might be the reason Cov fans come on here more than most complaining about poor track prep too much tractor racing and late finishing meetings.

 

To be fair the track hasn't been poor this season since the 'old' curators came back and I think any late finishing meetings ~ apart from crashes which obviously delay things ~ is down to the referee not putting the two minutes on. They're the ones with the buzzer but some are more efficient than others. Dave Watters for the double header Storm meeting had the two minutes on for the next race as soon as the riders had exited the track from the previous one. I like him.

It's not just Coventry though - often at Peterborough the tractor comes out after heat two. I just don't get the need for this to happen so soon. And don't get me started on sun breaks which Leicester and Kings Lynn have. I won't go to Lynn again after waiting 40 minutes for the Coventry match to begin. Yes the sun was out but it was still freezing cold standing around due to a fierce wind. Then another delay while the two Bees riders sorted their bikes out after a tangle with Iversen on the first bend. After that race, when it eventually got going, there was the interval. Why couldn't it have just been brought forward one race? That's what's wrong with Speedway ~ too much hanging around between races.

[Guest]

A 2,000 crowd for the speedway U21 World Team Final in Mildura, Australia, at the weekend. No surprise that the mainstream media regard speedway as a minority sport. They would appear to have every justification for their opinion based on this attendance?

I can remember bigger crowds than that watching Southern Area League racing at tracks like Eastbourne and California (-in-England) in the mid-1950s.

[iris123]

Sadly I don't think U21 meetings are that well supported even in Europe.At least I have been to a few individual and team meetings/finals and the crowds are not great

 

arnieg's post here puts the crowd in perspective though

 

http://www.speedway-forum.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=80072&page=5&do=findComment&comment=2704135

Edited November 1, 2015 by iris123

[Skid Sprocket]

I was speaking to an off road biker the other day and asked him if he went to the speedway and his reply was "It used to be near the A19 didn't it?" It closed down "near the A19" in 1996 and opened again at a new location in 2006, almost 10 years ago, he had no idea it was back even though he lives less than 10 miles from the new track. Communication is the main problem causing the lack of support from the younger generation if someone from the biking scene gives that kind of answer.

All this talk about rules, track preparation etc. etc. has its part to play but we must get the message out there that speedway does exist. The newcomers I have introduced to the sport have all had one initial reaction "Wow we didn't know about this" or words to that effect. All a newcomer needs to know about rules on their first night is that "their team" wear red and blue helmets, the rest of the complications will come later.

I made a suggestion to get youngsters interested by trying to get schools involved on a Saturday using the track for cycle speedway (might work, might not) it was only a suggestion to do something practical but it only got one negative reply and then the subject went back track and rule book problems. We need to spread the word and get on to the local media and pester the hell out of them until they take note, after all we are the readers, viewers and listeners. All this doesn't mean the promoters don't need pushing to get their side of the deal right.

[EnglishRoundabout]

I have only been to a few meeting since Newport closed Twice to somerset but dont like a track with no straights, but my main point in lack of attendances is the noise and smell , when I went to Somerton Park In 1964 the noise and the smell made me addicted, the racing was rubbish the score irrelevant, as it was the noise but maily the smell which kept us coming back week after week, that intense smell seems to have diminished somewhat

Shame people don't come back week after week anymore just for the smell and the noise! I guess the majority want much more than that before they part with their cash.

 

Speedway presentation has never been particularly contemporary. I started going in the early 70's at Swindon, and as a youngster I had never heard of the music being played. It was all early 60's music. It wasn't until around 75/76 that more up to date music was played. The year after we even progressed to a 'roving Mike man' on the centre green!

 

From then on, things gradually improved (except of course for our infamous back straight bogs)

[Shale Searcher]

Ah, this is where it gets a bit technical. If the rakers know what they are doing they wouldn't do much to bends 1 and 3 because riders are still sliding into the bends at those points. There should be a bit more dirt on bends 2 and 4 where the bikes are picking up more drive on the exit, but ideally they should watch where the tractor is dragging the dirt. I haven't been to Coventry for a while now but the last few times I went there were no rakers and the tractor was more or less following the arc of the bends down not really dragging much over so it didn't really do much for the racing. I suppose that might be the reason Cov fans come on here more than most complaining about poor track prep too much tractor racing and late finishing meetings.

You should know by now that that is a Tatum euphemism for "This visiting side are rubbish and are going to get a tonking but I have to tell the punters something to stop them turning off too early and killing the advertising revenue." !

 

If a track doesn't produce good racing it is basically only going to hurt that particular promoter whether it is big or smali so it's not the sort of thing a central body can legislate on. Anyway track size is dictated more by FIM rules than BSPA rules and I very much doubt that the A CU would back the SCB if they tried to makes rules on track si size that were more restrictive than the FIM if a promoter appealed.

 

Cardiff is a small tight track of well under 300 metres and it gets the biggest crowd anywhere so I don't think your argument on track size stands up

As far as rakers raking shale off and around the kickboards, and "flinging" it into the tractors path to then be graded into the areas of the track where the bikes rear wheels need it is not done at some EL tracks at the request of the riders! Reasons given for this by riders differ, the most bizarre being "I don't like seeing parrallel lines running from the fence to the camber as it puts me off" If this shale is not raked back, it makes the shale near the fence "say 2 metres from a point half a metre from the fence, pretty unusable, as you go from the slick to 4 inches deep!!

There needs to be some manual grading to keep the shale where it's usable, tractors can not accomplish this all of the time...

Edited November 1, 2015 by Shale Searcher

[SCB]

I was speaking to an off road biker the other day and asked him if he went to the speedway and his reply was "It used to be near the A19 didn't it?" It closed down "near the A19" in 1996 and opened again at a new location in 2006, almost 10 years ago, he had no idea it was back even though he lives less than 10 miles from the new track.

If I had £1 for every person I've spoken to in Newport the last 15-20 years who I've mentioned speedway to and they have said, "Newport had a track in the 70s" I'd be a rich man. We had a track for 15 years recently but part of the reason we don't any more is people like that were not aware of it!

 

I'm not sure what the answer is really but a targeting number of people just don't seem to know about the sport. And in Newport it was all the more perplexing as almost every Monday the local paper would fill the back page of the sports supplement with speedway, often the front page of the supplement would have a full size action picture too.

Edited November 1, 2015 by SCB

[Shale Searcher]

If I had £1 for every person I've spoken to in Newport the last 15-20 years who I've mentioned speedway to and they have said, "Newport had a track in the 70s" I'd be a rich man. We had a track for 15 years recently but part of the reason we don't any more is people like that were not aware of it!

 

I'm not sure what the answer is really but a targeting number of people just don't seem to know about the sport. And in Newport it was all the more perplexing as almost every Monday the local paper would fill the back page of the sports supplement with speedway, often the front page of the supplement would have a full size action picture too.

Would advertising on tv be any good? You know, like a proper advert... What would it cost for a small 30-45 second advert....? Anyone know if it's ever been tried?

[E I Addio]

Would advertising on tv be any good? You know, like a proper advert... What would it cost for a small 30-45 second advert....? Anyone know if it's ever been tried?

You have to factor in the cost of making the advert. The cost of showing it would depend on the channel, viewing time and the size of audience reached. Making a professional advert and showing it once at peak times would probably set you into six figures but TV. Adverts are generally uneconomical for sport which is why very few sports clubs advertise that way. In fact all advertising is horrendously expensive. It has been discussed at Lakeside fans forums in the past and I forget the actual figures but just to have a stall in the car park of the shopping centre for a day was I think the best part of a thousand pounds, and to put a small add in the toilets would have cost around. £600 a year..

[steve roberts]

I personally feel that people need now to except that speedway is now a minority sport and just doesn't attract punters as it once used too. We can discuss for ever and a day the merits of track preparation, rules, music played, admission charges, the effect of the GPs etc etc. I have in the past given talks at schools, stood outside Tescos handing out leaflets promoting the sport etc but attendances are on a continual downward spiral. Despite SKY having covered the sport for twenty (?) years (I always questioned broadcasting live meetings feeling that it was detrimental) interest has wained. The authorities seriously need to consider the sport going semi-amateur (too many riders nowadays expect to make a living from speedway) and propose a split from the GP so that the sport can return to the era that tracks operated on a certain night. In my experience people want continuity. Continually changing race nights is a nonsense in my opinion. Continuity in team selection should also be a prime concern..and let's do away with the over reliance on mediocre foreign riders. I could go and on but I would only be repeating the well worn arguments for and against. My views were often shared by John Berry when he published his two most excellent books based on his years as a promoter during the 60s, 70s and early 80s.

[SCB]

Would advertising on tv be any good? You know, like a proper advert... What would it cost for a small 30-45 second advert....? Anyone know if it's ever been tried?

I honestly doubt it. Advertising on national tele for local speedway is a waste of time as 95% of people who see it are not your target audience. Even a BSPA "all clubs" advert wouldn't work as you wouldn't be able to sell each club.

[Stoke Potter]

f

 

Who else says it apart from TV commentators who don't want their audiences turning off before the adverts come on?

 

The best, if not one of the best races I saw last season was between Doyle AJ and Bech , Lakeside v Leicester on 25th June. Doyle gated then passed by first AJand Bech, lap 2 Dolye passed them both to retake the lead, lap 3 AJ and Bech re-pass Doyle and hold on for the win., As good a race as you'll see anywhere with six passes in three laps, all in Heat 1 on a small track. Off course not every hear 1 is like that. But nor are all other heats.

 

Maybe you don't visit many tracks but your argumement that all heat 1'sare processional and it's all down to small tracks or track prep simply doesn't stand up. Weather conditions and the experience of the various track curators play a part but the reasons for falling attendances are complex and varied but like most people you look for quick fixes and easy answers but there are none,.There are a whole range of issues that need to be addressed, both on track and off, but lack of money is one of the major obstacles.

Who else says that the tracks will be better after a few heats? The riders when interviewed for one.

Yes even the worst track in the country will get a decent heat 1, heat 15 or any of them in between from time to time.

I've been watching since the late 70's and seen plenty of tracks.

I'm quite convinced that the stats would back me up (should they exist) that most heat1's at most tracks are processional. The shortest way is the fastest early on due to the way the tracks are prepared. The fact that you are even denying it is bizarre.

Heat1's being processional is not down to small tracks, I've never claimed that.

When is speedway at its best as a spectacle? Big fast tracks, multiple lines, wide open spaces, correctly banked, and the right shape.

Tracks need to be more than big, as a stated previously.

[Guest]

Is what is now happening to speedway in the UK following a similar pattern that has happened elsewhere in the world - that in the end people tire if team racing?

It has happened in New Zealand, South Africa, Holland - all once had flourishing league competitions with overseas riders in their club sides. League racing has also been tried to a lesser extent in Australia and the USA but eventually dropped by the local promoters.

Are we in the UK now seeing the start of a similar trend in which in a few years time what tracks are then left will be staging only individual racing, probably over a shorter season say from mid-May to mid-September, using far fewer riders than we need these days, but of a highly professional and talented nature?

This is just a thought on my part. I will be ready to dodge the flak that I expect to be fired at me by the usual team of gustix critics. But please carefully consider all aspects of what I envisage before trying to shoot the messenger.

[Bryn]

Is what is now happening to speedway in the UK following a similar pattern that has happened elsewhere in the world - that in the end people tire if team racing?

It has happened in New Zealand, South Africa, Holland - all once had flourishing league competitions with overseas riders in their club sides. League racing has also been tried to a lesser extent in Australia and the USA but eventually dropped by the local promoters.

Are we in the UK now seeing the start of a similar trend in which in a few years time what tracks are then left will be staging only individual racing, probably over a shorter season say from mid-May to mid-September, using far fewer riders than we need these days, but of a highly professional and talented nature?

This is just a thought on my part. I will be ready to dodge the flak that I expect to be fired at me by the usual team of gustix critics. But please carefully consider all aspects of what I envisage before trying to shoot the messenger.

 

Not being an avid/fanatical speedway historian myself, I wonder if perhaps you would care to clarify exactly when team racing ceased in the five countries you've named above as I can't personally recall league racing being staged in any of them. I'm sure you can provide the necessary information. From my own point of view I've always preferred team racing to individual meetings.

Edited November 1, 2015 by Bryn

[customhouseregular]

Not sure about Holland but league racing has been tried in the others, albeit on a very small scale with mini-leagues. From memory the USA tried it in the 80's with a 5-team league.

[iris123]

http://www.knmv.nl/motorsport/Nieuws-motorsport/2015/mei/dutch-speedway-league-van-start-in-veenoord/