foreverblue Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 Matt has his sponsors' Xmas gathering scheduled for this weekend so there should be the announcement before that!! Ok good so look forward to Holder and Watt announcement this week or is there a surprise in store? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWitcher Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 If it is Holder and Watt then the grading of Buzz is irrelevant. Â The issues will arise if you sign someone such as Pawlicki. It also mentions "assessed" which wouldn't apply to buzz? Â Spot on. Â It's clear how the meeting panned out. Poole will have known the rider they wanted pre-meeting and ensured of course nobody else did. They'll have argued the merits of certain riders being on or off the list (ones they aren't interested in) before finally conceding. This of course leads the other hapless fools into thinking they've 'got one over on Poole'. The whole time they were being played as Buzz sneaks under the radar and doesn't appear on the list. Â The problem is the promoters fall for it every single year.. Ford is just too clever for them. Â Before Starman et al starts taking a pop, this post is actually praising Ford. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starman2006 Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 If it is Holder and Watt then the grading of Buzz is irrelevant. Â The issues will arise if you sign someone such as Pawlicki. Â Spot on. Â It's clear how the meeting panned out. Poole will have known the rider they wanted pre-meeting and ensured of course nobody else did. They'll have argued the merits of certain riders being on or off the list (ones they aren't interested in) before finally conceding. This of course leads the other hapless fools into thinking they've 'got one over on Poole'. The whole time they were being played as Buzz sneaks under the radar and doesn't appear on the list. Â The problem is the promoters fall for it every single year.. Ford is just too clever for them. Â Before Starman et al starts taking a pop, this post is actually praising Ford. Well done Bwitcher, what you say is very true. But Matt doesn't sit on his backside, he will look at every single angle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post E I Addio Posted November 30, 2015 Popular Post Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 But Matt doesn't sit on his backside, Â That would be very difficult with you up it 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWitcher Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015  That would be very difficult with you up it  Very true, but at long last Starman has admitted Ford sets out to manipulate things his way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salty Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 At a time when the sport is crying out for simpler rules, the promoters have gone the opposite direction. I have no doubt that the FTR and the Heat leader list were conceived with the best of intentions, but the sad truth is they have far too many loopholes and the smarter promoters will immediately examine ways how they can gain the greatest benefit. Premier averages being used for the reserves gave Poole a big advantage in that Newman was classed far too low in the first tier enabling a much better pick in the second tier than they should have got. They have now managed to sign a rider in Buzz who for some reason has not being classed as a heat leader. Kudos to Ford for being shrewd, but the other promoters need a good boot up the hole. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveLyric2 Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 If it is Holder and Watt then the grading of Buzz is irrelevant. Â The issues will arise if you sign someone such as Pawlicki. Â Spot on. Â It's clear how the meeting panned out. Poole will have known the rider they wanted pre-meeting and ensured of course nobody else did. They'll have argued the merits of certain riders being on or off the list (ones they aren't interested in) before finally conceding. This of course leads the other hapless fools into thinking they've 'got one over on Poole'. The whole time they were being played as Buzz sneaks under the radar and doesn't appear on the list. Â The problem is the promoters fall for it every single year.. Ford is just too clever for them. Â Before Starman et al starts taking a pop, this post is actually praising Ford. Actually I'm not even sure that MF was at the meeting??! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWitcher Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 Actually I'm not even sure that MF was at the meeting??! Â Did I say he was? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy robin Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 If it is Holder and Watt then the grading of Buzz is irrelevant. Â The issues will arise if you sign someone such as Pawlicki. Â Â Spot on. Â It's clear how the meeting panned out. Poole will have known the rider they wanted pre-meeting and ensured of course nobody else did. They'll have argued the merits of certain riders being on or off the list (ones they aren't interested in) before finally conceding. This of course leads the other hapless fools into thinking they've 'got one over on Poole'. The whole time they were being played as Buzz sneaks under the radar and doesn't appear on the list. Â The problem is the promoters fall for it every single year.. Ford is just too clever for them. Â Before Starman et al starts taking a pop, this post is actually praising Ford. If Davey is on the heatleader list then If Buzz wiuld've been as well they couldn't have both of them. Â Makes Buzz's grading not irrelevant really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 If Davey is on the heatleader list then If Buzz wiuld've been as well they couldn't have both of them. Â Makes Buzz's grading not irrelevant really. No but Davey shouldn't be on the list in most people's view. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starman2006 Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 Â Â Very true, but at long last Starman has admitted Ford sets out to manipulate things his way. I didn't say that, and neither did you... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy robin Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 No but Davey shouldn't be on the list in most people's view. I agree he shouldn't but if he is it gives it a different outcome as Poole wouldn't have been able to have Buzz if he was as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 I agree he shouldn't but if he is it gives it a different outcome as Poole wouldn't have been able to have Buzz if he was as well. True but if Bucko isn't on the list and Davey is then it balances out, i am sure Bucko is only in the team because he isn't a heat leader. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 No but Davey shouldn't be on the list in most people's view. Most people's view ? A few on here maybe that want to jump,the gun but until we see the list, know how long it is, and what the criteria was ( assuming it wasn't just guesswork) I don't think anyone can say whether he should or shouldn't be on it. Â I am mystified as to how Danny King coukd be on there and not Davey, ( if it's true that Danny is on there) but it's difficult to say without seeing who else is on it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INCOGNITO Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 There are currently only 18 riders listed as heat leaders from an original list of 37 so some teams will start with 1 or 2 recognised heat leaders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevebrum Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 Most people's view ? A few on here maybe that want to jump,the gun but until we see the list, know how long it is, and what the criteria was ( assuming it wasn't just guesswork) I don't think anyone can say whether he should or shouldn't be on it. I am mystified as to how Danny King coukd be on there and not Davey, ( if it's true that Danny is on there) but it's difficult to say without seeing who else is on it. We know only 18 from this season are on it, that's the only thing confirmed. But yea I agree. King, like Watt are of a similar ability right now. Again, how do you judge that? Well we know that the promoters themselves voted who is and isn't on the list. So no one can blame anyone of the promoters for the list being their fault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted December 1, 2015 Report Share Posted December 1, 2015 (edited) We know only 18 from this season are on it, that's the only thing confirmed. But yea I agree. King, like Watt are of a similar ability right now. Again, how do you judge that? Well we know that the promoters themselves voted who is and isn't on the list. So no one can blame anyone of the promoters for the list being their fault. No, we believe there are 18 riders on it because that's what CVS said ( I think it was CVS ) and while I accept that he is one of the more reliable promoters in his announcements, despite being the target of all kinds of abuse by some on here, this is still Speedwáy so I personally prefer to wait till we see the list in black and white. Unfortunately the discussion on here has been generating more heat than light so far, partly by the pronouncements of some who think they are "in the know" when they clearly are not, and partly because of the hyperbole of some who clearly cannot read a simple press release. The heatleader list is obviously not a definitive list of who is a heatleader and who is a second string. It is merely an attempt to ensure that there is a reasonable spread of riders and reasonable competitiveness between teams. Whether it is successful in those objectives remains to be seen, but there are bound to be a few anomalies or a few that some fans think are wrong, but the acid test is the general competitiveness of the final line ups when all are finally announced.  EDIT: the comparison between Davey and Danny is a case in point. Personally I would have Davey over Danny any day , but others will have a different view, so we are unlikely to get a list that everyone thinks is great, but we can only judge it when we see it. Edited December 1, 2015 by E I Addio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted December 1, 2015 Report Share Posted December 1, 2015 Most people's view ? A few on here maybe that want to jump,the gun but until we see the list, know how long it is, and what the criteria was ( assuming it wasn't just guesswork) I don't think anyone can say whether he should or shouldn't be on it. Â I am mystified as to how Danny King coukd be on there and not Davey, ( if it's true that Danny is on there) but it's difficult to say without seeing who else is on it. Ok so it is only a majority view on here, it is not a case of jumping the gun, it is just the opinion of most on this forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveLyric2 Posted December 1, 2015 Report Share Posted December 1, 2015 (edited) I can't see what all the issues are other than some clubs having a race night that is clearly not suited to some overseas riders....... The list of 18 HLs was clearly discussed and agreed by all promotions - and accepted that some clubs may get 2 and some get 3 HLs from the list. Â No matter who is or who is not on it, every club has the same opportunity to talk to and sign whoever they want to fit within the agreed team building criteria. Â Neither Buzz nor Hans are Poole assets yet Poole got the necessary permissions to negotiate and sign them - or even assuming they didn't get permission (as some posters will undoubtedly claim), there has been no complaining from any of the other clubs - just an alleged comment from Mr Horton that 'MF has stolen a march' on everyone again!! Â Â ps. No Poole place for Kacper Gomolski in 2016 - and doesn't want to ride for any one else so no EL at all. Edited December 1, 2015 by Skidder1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluPanther Posted December 1, 2015 Report Share Posted December 1, 2015 I can't see what all the issues are other than some clubs having a race night that is clearly not suited to some overseas riders....... The list of 18 HLs was clearly discussed and agreed by all promotions - and accepted that some clubs may get 2 and some get 3 HLs from the list. Â No matter who is or who is not on it, every club has the same opportunity to talk to and sign whoever they want to fit within the agreed team building criteria. Â Neither Buzz nor Hans are Poole assets yet Poole got the necessary permissions to negotiate and sign them - or even assuming they didn't get permission (as some posters will undoubtedly claim), there has been no complaining from any of the other clubs - just an alleged comment from Mr Horton that 'MF has stolen a march' on everyone again!! Buzz and Hans are Frost assets, it's unlikely the Pirates would not get the permission required from a team sponsor. They are more likely to get a healthy discount on the loan fees.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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