Islander15 Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 Hard luck to them. Blame those who abused the system, as poorly thought out as it may have been. If it was my business, I'd be more worried about persistent lost income through a group of people who use an NUS card questionably on a regular basis than the money lost from a one-off student not attending. Sorry, but I've got no time for spongers or freeloaders. There are people who clearly got hold of an NUS card which they would not otherwise have had, just to take advantage of a well intentioned discount offer from the Bees promotion. Technically, they have done nothing wrong, but morally they have. We could all have done it but I suspect many people, such as myself, would have decided that to do so would be morally wrong. So you're saying tough luck to students who are the next generation of supporters and have done nothing wrong but can't afford to pay the price that adults in full-time emolument can! As short sighted as most of the promoters. You don't remove a system because some people flaunted it, you change the rules to stop the people flaunting it! That way unfortunate people aren't penalised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21st century heathen Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 Clarification was sought pre-season by some and it was stated clearly by the club that an NUS card constitutes that required to be admitted at the student cost. I've not seen it myself but I've seen two people mention, including the text quoted above by SCB, that the club even posted yesterday afternoon stating an NUS card is required to gain entry at the student rate only to withdraw the offer completely a few hours later. There is nothing on the website admissions page suggested that there are any Ts&Cs beyond this statement (that an NUS card will suffice) nor that the offer is at the management's discretion and may be amended or withdrawn at any time etcetera, as you would usually expect to see stated if there were any kind of question mark over how long an offer may stand (at least by any professionally run business!). As usual the sole problem is speedway living in the dark ages and not understanding the world changed around it about 30 years ago. I bet students don't have to take an admissions letter to Co-op to get their 10% off every time they do their food shopping, or remember to apply for a special card prior to visiting one of the many thousands of attractions/shops to offer discounts to NUS card holders. This season so far, and I can't see it getting any better, has been a complete an utter PR disaster for British Speedway. So sad, so very, very sad. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacques Posted April 5, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 (edited) What is? If the deal is open to NUS card holders and these people have an NUS card what is fraudulent? Anyone working for an educational establishment will generally as one of their work place benefits be eligible for an NUS card (I was, I know of two others who are). Are they "abusing" the system? Is what they're doing "fraudulent"? If someone was printing their own student card that would be fraudulent. Bear in mind this statement, "We require proof of full-time student status, and therefore an NUS card will be required to gain entry at the student rate." from Coventry Speedway! The issue is that an NUS card is NOT "proof of full-time student status" and never has been. It's proof you're a member of the student union. What you are describing is a different offence. Using an NUS card when you are not a student. to benefit by getting discounts is! I was a full time student 2010-2011 I had one and got a student season ticket to cover the period I was in full time education. Since then I have paid the full price and not diddled anyone. If you obtain an NUS card and produce it at the turnstile and induce the person taking the money that you are a student, in education, be it full time or part time to gain a benefit ( ie money off admission) knowing you are not entitled to, that is deception. The offence isn't absolute when you purchase one, it's when you actually use it to deceive! Edited April 5, 2016 by Jacques 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Jones Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 So,another knee jerk reaction fron the biggest jerk in Coventry promotional history. He annoyed the pensioners now he's dishing the students. What will be left? Doesn't he realise that he has been the one stealing from the fans for years, serving up this season a team of no hopers who may just about cut it in the premier league. The mans history is a catalogue of disasters. The removal of Colin Pratt, the falling out with Blayne , the falling out with the best presentation team and centre green presenter ,the Simpson brothers. Cancelling the aftermeeting music and get together with the riders. Putting together a shocking team with the help of a team manager who as a rider was great but lacks any credentials as team manager. No Horton and Watsons experience and passion for Coventry remains at zero. It will be mainly Horton who kills off speedway in Coventry . He alone has reduced a nights entertainment to the dark ages of speedway with his lack of finesse in dealing with people who had the best interests of the club at heart throughout recent years. That just about sums up my feelings too. The sad part of it all is that I said this would happen the day he was announced as the new promoter. Coventry Bees a great club being wrecked by an underhanded and incompetent promotion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 Except it really wasn't. People were tweeting the club before the first meeting to ask what constituted a "student" and then they were told NUS card holders. So if you had an NUS card that was deemed enough, nowhere else was there any other convoluted rules of "spirit" or "what they meant". If they didn't mean NUS card holders they should have explained this. The point is they didn't know and they don't know now do they? If they had some clear rules they would state them, the fact they have removed it (possibly as a temp thing) suggests they didn't know themselves! I think telling people they "abused" the offer is pretty pathetic when they asked on twitter and got an answer. So for the stupid people, who was the offer aimed at? Bearing in mind the club posted this yesterday afternoon 6 hours before removing the student price, "STUDENT ADMISSION Monday April 04, 2016 COVENTRY wish to clarify the arrangements for student admission at Elite and National League meetings this season. We require proof of full-time student status, and therefore an NUS card will be required to gain entry at the student rate. We hope this clarifies any previous confusion over this issue." It was obviously, in my mind, aimed at those people who have no other income but from their student loan\bursaries .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LisaColette Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 At Poole they wrote down your NUS number, your name and address and made you sign next to it. Maybe to check your details out in own time? But then Poole didn't ever really advertise student prices, you always had to inquire. So if anyone did abuse it wouldn't have been many! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeedwayTShirts Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 If people are an OAP they are an OAP regardless of wealth. If they are a student and qualify for an NUS card then they are a student regardless of time spent in college / university. Look at all the other clubs that are happy with this set up! Discussions with local colleges will do nothing to help fans travelling from further afield which obviously applies to away fans and some home fans. As an example we live 90 mins away, are Coventry Speedway going to be speaking to educational establishments in Stoke On Trent. And comically how the hell would Manchester United police this when the majority of their fans aren't local lol. If an NUS card is good enough for other tracks and also the likes of Apple, Amazon, Spotify, Frankie and Benny's etc etc you'd think it would suffice for Coventry Speedway. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 So you're saying tough luck to students who are the next generation of supporters and have done nothing wrong but can't afford to pay the price that adults in full-time emolument can! As short sighted as most of the promoters. You don't remove a system because some people flaunted it, you change the rules to stop the people flaunting it! That way unfortunate people aren't penalised. How the hell do you change the rules to only allow those who are in full time education with no other income in though?b They have to rely on people's honesty and integrity ..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G the Bee Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 So you're saying tough luck to students who are the next generation of supporters and have done nothing wrong but can't afford to pay the price that adults in full-time emolument can! As short sighted as most of the promoters. You don't remove a system because some people flaunted it, you change the rules to stop the people flaunting it! That way unfortunate people aren't penalised. No. I've never said remove the student discount. Read my posts. I've said the club should change the rules to stop people flaunting the system in my original post. I said that that the club should issue their own cards. Unfortunately, It will mean that some students, attending on a one-off basis, won't be able to get in cheap. It will also affect students from other clubs too. I doubt, on a meeting-by-meeting basis, there would be many of them anyway. There is no ideal solution. Blame the spongers and freeloaders who abused a well intentioned system and, like so many things in life, have spoiled it for the rest. And comically how the hell would Manchester United police this when the majority of their fans aren't local lol. If an NUS card is good enough for other tracks and also the likes of Apple, Amazon, Spotify, Frankie and Benny's etc etc you'd think it would suffice for Coventry Speedway. The difference is, these multi-national corporations probably know the scam is going on, and can afford to take it on the chin. And due to sheer weight of numbers, it's difficult, and certainly not cost-effective for them to control. For a speedway promotion, the opposite is the case. They can't afford to take it on the chin but, because they don't have the sheer weight of numbers abusing the system as a large corporation have, they are able to monitor the situation and control it. Which is precisely what they have done. I suspect, (and perhaps they should have done some more research) the well-intentioned promotion underestimated how easy it is to get hold of an NUS card. They believed that an NUS card, in itself, was proof of full-time student status. They were wrong. They've been taken advantage of as a result. They appear to have recognised this now and are changing the system. In the meantime, the student offer has unfortunately been (I suspect temporarily) withdrawn. No big deal. But, again, it's the fault of those who abused the system spoiling it for everyone else. You know who you are. Shame on you! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21st century heathen Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 I've said the club should change the rules to stop people flaunting the system in my original post. The difference is, these multi-national corporations probably know the scam is going on... What rules are you referring to? The club clarified more than once that the rule is that you must produce an NUS card. The statement is short, simple and absolute. What scam? Those producing an NUS card are legally entitled to one. Unless of course the NUS have illegally issued one or the card produced is a forged card, neither of which I believe we're debating here. You also seem talk about speedway in general which is unfair on other clubs that have not taken this stance. Incidentally, also a stance never before taken by Coventry Speedway (that I'm aware of - apologies in advance if this statement is inaccurate) which has accepted an NUS card to qualify for a discounted admission cost in the past. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeedwayTShirts Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 A lot of a little is better than a little of a lot. More people spending more money in the stadium will benefit the Bees in their final year of trading and create a better atmosphere assuming of course that the team is competitive. I'm more than happy to pay full price at the closing fixture of the 2016 season and say farewell to Brandon where I have many many memories however I doubt I'll be attending inbetween. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz01 Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 (edited) The problem is it seems easy to get an NUS card, my mate did an internet course and was entitled to one. Any one of us could done the same without any intention of doing the course. I have more respect than to do something like that, shame some others don't have similar morals. The people it hinders most are the people who genuinely needed the rate, hopefully the club will announce how students can get a cheaper rate soon but they only way I can see it working is having a student age limit. The change is only temporary at this moment. Edited April 5, 2016 by woz01 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damosuzuki Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 Done it myself when I was younger - booked a course costing 60 quid and got all manner of discounts. Age limit is the way to go - Maybe under 20 or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LisaColette Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 (edited) The problem is it seems easy to get an NUS card, my mate did an internet course and was entitled to one. Any one of us could don't he same without any intention of doing the course. I have more respect than to do something like that, shame some others don't have similar morals. The people it hinders most are the people who genuinely needed the rate, hopefully the club will announce how students can get a cheaper rate soon but they only way I can see it working is having a student age limit. The change is only temporary at this moment.It is such a massive cut in price, I am not surprised people are abusing it! Done it myself when I was younger - booked a course costing 60 quid and got all manner of discounts. Age limit is the way to go - Maybe under 20 or something. Under 20 are you having a laugh? After doing A levels at college that takes you to 18 and then if you go to Uni for 3/4 years that takes you to 21/22. So should be at least that. Edited April 5, 2016 by lisa-colette Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonB Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 A lot of a little is better than a little of a lot. More people spending more money in the stadium will benefit the Bees in their final year of trading and create a better atmosphere assuming of course that the team is competitive. I'm more than happy to pay full price at the closing fixture of the 2016 season and say farewell to Brandon where I have many many memories however I doubt I'll be attending inbetween. Unfortunately spending more money in the stadium is unlikely to help the Bees as most of that will go to the stadium owners 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz01 Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 It is such a massive cut in price, I am not surprised people are abusing it! Under 20 are you having a laugh? After doing A levels at college that takes you to 18 and then if you go to Uni for 3/4 years that takes you to 21/22. So should be at least that. Its not an excuse! People who need it most are now hurt by this more than the people who abused it! Agree it should be around 21-22 years of age, it wouldn't stop it being abused entirely but would certainly stop a lot of it. I know some football clubs do similar with students but cap it to a certain age. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shale Searcher Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 It's easy for to get conformation from the educational institute involved, a conformation by return fax/email is easily achieved. Had a similar problem myself, easily sorted.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A ORLOV Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 It is such a massive cut in price, I am not surprised people are abusing it! Under 20 are you having a laugh? After doing A levels at college that takes you to 18 and then if you go to Uni for 3/4 years that takes you to 21/22. So should be at least that. Still sponging off the state at 22, shocking, should have had a job by then and paying tax into the system to pay OAPs pensions . 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 My son is now at uni at 26 so I'm not sure an age limit is the best way to go. Unless the offer really is aimed at young (not job experienced) students ..... probably it is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz01 Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 My son is now at uni at 26 so I'm not sure an age limit is the best way to go. Unless the offer really is aimed at young (not job experienced) students ..... probably it is? I say it should be to 22 as that is around the natural time students generally finish education. If you're older and a student I guess more than likely that's a choice to carry on with education? Difficult one but there has to be an age limit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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