stevebrum Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 once again, where is your evidence that his engines were substandard , apart from your assumption ? Has he said so ? if they were substandard , what was different about his UK engines compared to his continental engines ? How do you know they were not the engines from the previous year when he was doing well ? after all Peter Johns said in SS a couple of years ago that Holder had been using the same engines over here for three or four years, so it could well be the same for Tai... Again, for comparison look at the trouble PK had with his engines at Lakeside, and he still lost his job. Where is my evidence?? Really? why did he make the point he was bringing his best engine for the British final if his English equipment was as good? That in itself speaks volumes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWitcher Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 More poor examples ...AJ is from Sweden so expect him to do better in his homeland ...unlike Tai who in his homeland in a much weaker league had a massive drop ..as has been said before when you were beating the top riders all over the world you hardly likely to be worried by a format that makes you take on Batch and Watt on a Monday night on your own track ..so with respect in tai case it makes a massive difference what he was doing elsewhere as most of the Wolves fans on this topic have said . Not poor examples at all. They are actual factual examples. Andreas Jonsson has been racing in Poland for nigh on 15 years, so it makes no difference whether its his 'homeland' or not. You keep wittering on about a much weaker league, showing a lack of understanding as the format used counters that. All over the world has NO relevance to the riding in Britain. Just as Sweden has no relevance to Poland. Completely different tracks, bike setups, backup teams. If you can't grasp that simple concept there is little point you debating the subject. I also notice you ignore the other points that don't fit your argument. Basically you just decide 'he's not trying'.. as many do when riders are in a rut for any particular reason. Why exactly would they not bother trying? There is no benefit at all. Where is my evidence?? Really? why did he make the point he was bringing his best engine for the British final if his English equipment was as good? That in itself speaks volumes. Why did he ride his British engine in the Gorzow GP and score 18? The British Final is a much easier meeting than a league match these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 Not poor examples at all. They are actual factual examples. Andreas Jonsson has been racing in Poland for nigh on 15 years, so it makes no difference whether its his 'homeland' or not. You keep wittering on about a much weaker league, showing a lack of understanding as the format used counters that. All over the world has NO relevance to the riding in Britain. Just as Sweden has no relevance to Poland. Completely different tracks, bike setups, backup teams. If you can't grasp that simple concept there is little point you debating the subject. They are all poor examples as not one shows a World Champion riding in his homeland in a weaker league riding poorly while being in great form in every other format when you do find me one then let me know. if you can't grasp that simple concept then maybe you should not be debating the subject ....As has been explained to you many times by many people it is of relevance how he has been getting on elsewhere as they are much harder leagues and has also been explained your not likely to be be worried by a format that puts you in against poor sub standard heat leaders when you have beating the likes of Emil ,Nicki etc all over Europe and ever more so when your World Champion . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWitcher Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) They are all poor examples as not one shows a World Champion riding in his homeland in a weaker league riding poorly while being in great form in every other format when you do find me one then let me know. if you can't grasp that simple concept then maybe you should not be debating the subject ....As has been explained to you many times by many people it is of relevance how he has been getting on elsewhere as they are much harder leagues and has also been explained your not likely to be be worried by a format that puts you in against poor sub standard heat leaders when you have beating the likes of Emil ,Nicki etc all over Europe and ever more so when your World Champion . Apart from repeating your ill educated nonsense over and over which I have already proven to be incorrect.. (you try to ignore it, but that just makes you look silly).. your argument now is actually counter-productive. The very fact that he WAS world champion and struggling for whatever reason in the UK would have a far bigger effect than if he was just a normal heat leader. As regards riding in 'homeland', I've already given you the example of Freddie Lindgren who topped the averages in the UK in 2009, ahead of riders such as Leigh Adams, but was way below them in his 'homeland' of Sweden. To summarise your argument though, you believe that Woffinden made a conscious decision to not try as hard in Britain, to ensure his bikes weren't as quick, giving him the result of being caught up in traffic with lesser riders on a far more regular basis vastly increasing the chances of being injured, earn less money and suffer the flak from Wolves fans. When he could have just rode as he does elsewhere, won races for fun against lower standard opposition, been out in front riding safely, earned a lot more money and enjoyed the adulation of a hero. Please tell me why he would willingly choose the first of those options?? Edited October 13, 2015 by BWitcher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) Yet again another poor example as sweden is a much stronger league than the uk .try again . by the way you have not prove anything incorrect but please keep trying . Over the years there have been loads of Examples of riders not putting in 100 % effort in the uk I am sure all clubs have had one .. In Woffy case it because quite clear that he choose to put the uk last in 2014 in terms of bikes efforts etc ...I guess if your earning big money elsewhere then it's not going to matter that much, and that is the attitude that Woffy showed Edited October 13, 2015 by orion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sommelier Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 What a poor line up last night, when i look back at my 70s programmes & look who was riding, it makes my hair stand on end! Same has Swindon on Sunday, all year to plan it, & look what they dished up. I'm shure a lot of these promoters just don't care half the time! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex2000 Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 I think it will be an El and Prem mix to one big league and a national league to develop the riders before they move up to the Elitepremier mix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Sweetman Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 What a poor line up last night, when i look back at my 70s programmes & look who was riding, it makes my hair stand on end! Same has Swindon on Sunday, all year to plan it, & look what they dished up. I'm shure a lot of these promoters just don't care half the time! All comes down to finance. With the crowds Wolves have been getting,gone are the days when 16 top notch riders are paid big bucks for a nights entertainment. The Olympique used to be the highlight of the year for me(along with the Champion of Champions)and the place was rocking. As well as the locals,Cradley would probably bring along 1500 to support their heat-leaders. Plus the fact,in the early days of the competion the terraces where on both sides of the stadium,giving a much better atmosphere. It says something,when now the highlight of the meeting is the firework display. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sommelier Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 All comes down to finance. With the crowds Wolves have been getting,gone are the days when 16 top notch riders are paid big bucks for a nights entertainment. The Olympique used to be the highlight of the year for me(along with the Champion of Champions)and the place was rocking. As well as the locals,Cradley would probably bring along 1500 to support their heat-leaders. Plus the fact,in the early days of the competion the terraces where on both sides of the stadium,giving a much better atmosphere. It says something,when now the highlight of the meeting is the firework display. Yes, the memorys of Olsen riding his socks off 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIRKYLANE Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 I agree. The Olympique used to be a quality meeting with an excellent field. This year the field was the poorest yet. I did not go for the first time in a few years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveEvans Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 At least Wolves run the meeting to close out the season. Now so many teams simply shut down for the year once their league program is done. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LisaColette Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 At least Wolves run the meeting to close out the season. Now so many teams simply shut down for the year once their league program is done.I think Poole did the Blue Riband last year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWitcher Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 Yet again another poor example as sweden is a much stronger league than the uk .try again . by the way you have not prove anything incorrect but please keep trying . Over the years there have been loads of Examples of riders not putting in 100 % effort in the uk I am sure all clubs have had one .. In Woffy case it because quite clear that he choose to put the uk last in 2014 in terms of bikes efforts etc ...I guess if your earning big money elsewhere then it's not going to matter that much, and that is the attitude that Woffy showed You're not reading are you. Freddie Lindgren was ahead of Leigh Adams. In Sweden he was a long way behind him. Your 'theory' makes absolutely no sense, none whatsoever. He was gunning for a World Championship but you choose to believe that he WILLINGLY chose to be slower in the UK, meaning he was riding in closer proximity to lesser riders, increasing his chances of accidents, plus meaning he earned less money. Interesting concept! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 You're not reading are you. Freddie Lindgren was ahead of Leigh Adams. In Sweden he was a long way behind him. Your 'theory' makes absolutely no sense, none whatsoever. He was gunning for a World Championship but you choose to believe that he WILLINGLY chose to be slower in the UK, meaning he was riding in closer proximity to lesser riders, increasing his chances of accidents, plus meaning he earned less money. Interesting concept! Freddie did not ride well in two leagues when being World Champion while riding poorly in his own weaker league ..as I said when you come up with something that gets anywhere near what happened with Tai let me know ...but seeing you had about 5 wrong efforts hopes are not high . My theory makes perfect sense a rider who takes to much on then decides not to put much effort into one he cares about the less .what in Tai case was wolves . As I said the elite league has been littered with riders for many reasons decide not to try there hardest . If we took your concept it would mean that all riders try 100 % all the time and as we know that is clearly not the case Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INCOGNITO Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 Tai had a bad 2014 season Get over it and look forward to next season or should we start a debate about Neil Evitts coming in on a 6.58 and leaving just over 3 despite being at reserve. It happens and is history. Move on 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 I agree. The Olympique used to be a quality meeting with an excellent field. This year the field was the poorest yet. I did not go for the first time in a few years. Years ago all the end of season big individuals were eagerly awaited and a great end to the season but now we have the GP series ..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevebrum Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 Why did he ride his British engine in the Gorzow GP and score 18? The British Final is a much easier meeting than a league match these days. Why was he consistently strong from mid season on in Poland, Sweden and quick in GP's but regularly poor in UK. If the British final is a much easier meeting than a league meeting why the need to bring a better engine for it?? If just don't make sense. The format is a bit more punishing these days but more difficult than Sweden/Poland? Tai never looked close to sorting out any issues he had equipment wise in the EL 2014, but we're abroad as his scores improved. More to it than just the formula IMHO. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldace Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 Years ago all the end of season big individuals were eagerly awaited and a great end to the season but now we have the GP series ..... Yep and long may it continue, if it were not for the GP there would be zero of any interest speedway wise in Britain 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWitcher Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 Tai had a bad 2014 season Get over it and look forward to next season or should we start a debate about Neil Evitts coming in on a 6.58 and leaving just over 3 despite being at reserve. It happens and is history. Move on Neil Evitts was never at reserve, that was the main problem he had that year.. another year he'd have dropped to reserve and likely got going again. Why was he consistently strong from mid season on in Poland, Sweden and quick in GP's but regularly poor in UK. If the British final is a much easier meeting than a league meeting why the need to bring a better engine for it?? If just don't make sense. The format is a bit more punishing these days but more difficult than Sweden/Poland? Tai never looked close to sorting out any issues he had equipment wise in the EL 2014, but we're abroad as his scores improved. More to it than just the formula IMHO. Totally different setups and importantly backup teams. You think if Jacko was in the UK he'd have been struggling? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 Why was he consistently strong from mid season on in Poland, Sweden and quick in GP's but regularly poor in UK. If the British final is a much easier meeting than a league meeting why the need to bring a better engine for it?? If just don't make sense. The format is a bit more punishing these days but more difficult than Sweden/Poland? Tai never looked close to sorting out any issues he had equipment wise in the EL 2014, but we're abroad as his scores improved. More to it than just the formula IMHO. Spot on Steve ..I think nearly everyone see's it that way 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.