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Belle Vue -v- Swindon Monday 17th August


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Thought last night was a very entertaining meeting and glad to have made the trip. Yes there were lots of inconsistencies and some the robins benefited from, some they didn't. Just the normal issues of speedway seen across Britain today, they crop up here more often than abroad. thought this meeting would be won at reserve and it proved to again be key, Aces deserved the win but am happy to come away with a point. Full marks to the Aces and Lemo for his comments after. Reserves will continue to be the most important part of a team under current format, one of the better draft reserves can easily cause a 8-10 point swing and Aces have 2 good ones in Nielsen & Worrall as do the Bees.

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I agree. What I'm trying to say is that he could be a bit more graceful in defeat and not spit his dummy every single time.

 

Have a read of mark lemons take on it on the BV website.

 

That is a dignified and fair response. Congratulated Swindon on the point. Despite that it could prove crucial to us in the end.

 

Rosco is a big baby. Always has been always will be.

Rosco said the track was poor and the ref was poor by all accounts and going by what the neutrals who were there said they both were .. nothing wrong with that .

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So some think it was a poor meeting. But due to the added meaning of this meeting due to the play-offs, some found it far more exciting. Now had there been no play-offs this would have probably been a naff meeting to everyone there.

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No, nobody was excluded for failing to be ready within the 2 minute time allowance in heat 14. I thought it was just last night's referee who made things up as he went along.

You replied to a comment about what common sense says....so following that trail my reply is what common sense would suggest...not what actually happened. I thought it was just last night's referee who couldn't keep up with proceedings.

Edited by Reliant Robin
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No, nobody was excluded for failing to be ready within the 2 minute time allowance in heat 14. I thought it was just last night's referee who made things up as he went along.

He'd already been taken out of the race, replaced, and the riders had made a start. I don't really see how he could have been put back in again.

 

I don't know how thi stands with regards to rules, but it seems a very strange decision.

 

Belle Vue were at fault by replacing him, and the ref should have pointed it out before the restart.

 

What's the betting it was a fan somewhere who pointed it out, and knew better than the team manager and the ref!

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Damn......My prediction was 1 point out....

 

Sounded like a good meeting......Cant believe it wasn't shown on sky.

 

They only show 1 meeting a week (if any) and they chose to televise Poole v Swindon this week (for the obvious reasons)...which you should be happy about as you 'claim' to be a Poole supporter. But oh no, you'd rather they show BV v Swindon. Unfortunately Sky (like everyone else) has no power to see into the future and know this meeting was going to be highly eventful. What a complete and utter :icon_smile_clown: yet again!!

 

Edit: The Poole meeting is now not being televised (due to the weather forecast I would guess!), it's KL v Bees instead :cry:

Edited by chris4gillian
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Rossiter is correct that the ref was poor. After Zagar was disqualified when he and Max tangled as they came off the home straight, many fans around me were unsure why all four back wasn't called. I explained that some refs can and do disqualify riders in these situation it's just a pain as all ref don't do the same so the lack of consistency causes confusion. As soon a Ward took Stefan off I said "oh o" looks like he's out, but no. He then did the same when Morris took Steve off so it seemed, if you were a robin it wasn't a problem. Lack of consistency with the same meeting doesn't sit well with me especially if it favours one team.

 

I've never been as pleased to see the opposition take a 5-1 than in heat 13. I'm pretty certain the ref would still be running it now until the desired result was reached.

 

Heat 14 will more than likely see the ref face a disciplinary as all of it was just awful.

I'm still waiting for and answer to why Craig was disqualified after the race was stopped following Zengot's disqualification. ???

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Rossiter is correct that the ref was poor. After Zagar was disqualified when he and Max tangled as they came off the home straight, many fans around me were unsure why all four back wasn't called. I explained that some refs can and do disqualify riders in these situation it's just a pain as all ref don't do the same so the lack of consistency causes confusion. As soon a Ward took Stefan off I said "oh o" looks like he's out, but no. He then did the same when Morris took Steve off so it seemed, if you were a robin it wasn't a problem. Lack of consistency with the same meeting doesn't sit well with me especially if it favours one team.

 

I've never been as pleased to see the opposition take a 5-1 than in heat 13. I'm pretty certain the ref would still be running it now until the desired result was reached.

 

Heat 14 will more than likely see the ref face a disciplinary as all of it was just awful.

I'm still waiting for and answer to why Craig was disqualified after the race was stopped following Zengot's disqualification. ???

Ref was completely correct excluding Zagar, Fricke the gate off gate 4 and Zagar off gate 2 went wide and rode straight into Fricke putting them both in the fence.

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I've never been as pleased to see the opposition take a 5-1 than in heat 13. I'm pretty certain the ref would still be running it now until the desired result was reached.

 

Heat 14 will more than likely see the ref face a disciplinary as all of it was just awful.

I'm still waiting for and answer to why Craig was disqualified after the race was stopped following Zengot's disqualification. ???

 

You should have stood on the third bend, it was much more interesting. The tannoy wasn't working so no-one had a clue what was going on, which prompted a great deal of ridiculous and bizarre speculation.

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That's a good point.... A fit rider has to have a minimum of 3 rides (does he?)

If he gets excluded for a tapes or 2 minutes offence, in the last available race that his 3rd race can take place in, what happens then? Is this the cause of the unrest over the Cookgate incident last night.......?

Pretty straightforward actually basically the race starts with 3 riders.

 

18.15.7 In order that a Rider takes the "minimum" number of rides, then changes must be made to a Heat Line up, (excluding any nominated or Highest Scorers Heat) or sufficient Heats must start with no replacements.

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Pretty straightforward actually basically the race starts with 3 riders.

 

18.15.7 In order that a Rider takes the "minimum" number of rides, then changes must be made to a Heat Line up, (excluding any nominated or Highest Scorers Heat) or sufficient Heats must start with no replacements.

So was Cook excluded on 2 minutes or not? If he was then it should have been 3 riders only - which only gives a swing of 3 points and BV still win. Looks like the referee had a shocker. I read Rosco's comments and I can't understand what issue anyone could have with what he has said because it seems to be a fair reflection of things (which others who attended have agreed with).

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Cook was excluded and a reserve put in to replace him.The fact that whoever, including the referee, thought he could be replaced confirmed his match was over, so why shouldn't he go and get showered. The race was even started with Worrall but had to be rerun and it was only then that the question arose as to whether Cook had to have a third ride. In those circumstances he had to be given time.

Certainly Belle Vue wouldn't have raised it and obviously the ref was unaware so my guess is that it was Rosco who raised the issue of Cook needing a third ride, thinking Wight would beat him given a 15 metre start and Cook's poor performance up to that point. Unfortunately, it backfired and so instead of accepting it in good grace he feels peeved.

That's a fair post . Of course we only have Rosco's word for it that Cook stormed off in a temper and threw his toys out of the pram. The other side of the coin is that's rider needs permission of the Clerk of the Course to leave the pits. Now if Cook had been incorrectly given permission the it's understandable that he should come back because it's not his mistake. If he did leave the pits withouT the CoC' s permission how come Rosco didn't mention that ?

 

So what is the truth if the matter. According to Rosco's rant on the.Swindon website Cook slammed the dressing room door so hard he took the door clean off its hinges . Really ? Frankly I find, that very difficult to belive. For one thing if Rsoco was in the pits he wouldn't know what happened when Cook was in the changing room. Secondly it s very difficult indeed to take a door off BOTH hinges unless it's loose anyway. Thirdly if the door was taken off its hinges someone else must know about it but we only have Rosco's word on this when he clearly wasn't there to see what happened.

 

Unless someone knows something about the door coming off its hinges or Cook storming off without permission of the CoC Its looks like another one of Rosco's rants that we have seen with increasing frequency in the last few years.

It's a shame to read Rosco's comments. Sounds like a bad loser.

" In victory- magnaminity, in defeat-defiannce". - Winston Churchill

 

"In victory- go round crowing about it, in defeat- have a rant". - Rosco

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Hartley Hare....you have to be certain age :)

 

I'm of that certain age !....my old favourite when I was at school........showed him to my kids via YouTube and they were horrified....something out of a horror movie they said !......I never felt like that back in my childhood !

Could cook not have taken his 3rd ride in ht 15? And is it correct that a tapes exclusion doesn't count as a ride?

 

It used to count both as a ride and a zero for averages purposes, even if a reserve did replace them......obviously it doesn't now but I'm going back at least 20 odd years to when I know for certain that they did count

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Not sure about Rosco's grievances to be honest.....It sounds a bit of a shambles at the end but the chequered flag coming out after 3 laps didn't affect anything as Swindon got a 5-1 in the re run which they were not on in the first race......it shouldn't happen but Swindon gained from that and certainly didn't lose anything...........as for Cook, well if he touched the tapes then it was only the rules that he had to go from 15 metres to complete his rides....if he had got changed then it's not his fault but is the refs fault ...I assume Swindon would have preferred Cook off 15 to a reserve level from the tapes, and so would Belle Vue on the night I think so I doubt Rosco complained at the time about Cook having to get back changed ....if he'd had come in last , as expected, then he wouldn't have batted an eyelid........again , this shouldn't happen but the fact Cook got the 5-1 has caused Rosco's frustration, yet the reserve replacement would probably had got the 5-1 as well so Swindon didn't lose out there as well in my opinion.

Yes it's a bit of a shambles but neither incident was particularly result affecting.

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