Hawk127 Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 I read about the offer for the televised meeting, how long can Lakeside operate at the track? Are they looking for a site close to the existing track or in Essex generally? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 (edited) I read about the offer for the televised meeting, how long can Lakeside operate at the track? Are they looking for a site close to the existing track or in Essex generally?The point has already been done to death on other threads. The site has been earmarked for redevelopment for years as part of the Thames Gateway project. Planning permission for the site is in its early stages. The club are in discussions with the local council. Thurrock , who are said to be sympathetic and want to keep Speedwáy in the area . The latest news is that there may be a new Speedwáy only stadium (I.e. No stock cars) within walking distance of the present site but it's still in the early stages of a long process with all the usual obstacles to be overcome., The bigger problem at the moment though seems to be the threat of crowds disappearing because of the way the sport is shooting itself in the foot.EDIT It seems there will be. Speedwáy at the present site in 2016 Edited July 12, 2015 by E I Addio 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 (edited) . Edited July 12, 2015 by E I Addio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 And Lakside are not helping with the "sport shooting itself in the foot". Lakeisde are a major part of this problem. Smell the coffee. I know from your other posts that you can't stand Lakeside but out of 20 or so clubs in operation Lakeside are a MAJOR part of the problem ? Everone else only plays MINOR parts then? I said the sport (collectively) is shooting itself in the foot and clearly Lakeside are by definition part of the collective sport and not exempt from blame .You are welcome to you r opinion the Lakeside are playing a MAJOR part but if Lakeside don't survive (and we know you will be delighted if they don't) don't belive for a moment the rest of them will get their act together . Not sure what you mean by "smell the coffee" . That's usually an empty platitude idiots use in the absence of coherent argument. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 I know from your other posts that you can't stand Lakeside but out of 20 or so clubs in operation Lakeside are a MAJOR part of the problem ? Everone else only plays MINOR parts then? Lakeside are one of, if not the worst offenders for letting Poole get away with all manner of crap. That is killing the sport. Also Lakeside speedway (under it's old promotion) invented the TR - like it or not that has kept a lot of people away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammer1969 Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 The nearest track to me is Lakeside but getting there is a nightmare, my only means of accessing it is by car and I don't think that helps with getting supporters through the gates especially the youngsters who may not even have a car yet. When I first discovered Speedway I was still at school and travelled every week to West Ham by bus, get people interested in the sport young and hopefully they will stay with it for the rest of their lives. There is a bus station at Lakeside would it be possible for Lakeside promoters to perhaps think about running a shuttle bus to and from the bus station on match nights? I know the clock can't be turned back but in the 60's there was more local rivalry giving supporters more incentive to travel to away matches i.e. West Ham, Wimbledon, Hackney to name but a few all within travelling distance of each other and also all fairly easy to reach by public transport, with today's petrol prices etc. and a number of tracks being difficult to reach other than by car I doubt many supporters are able to travel to away matches on a regular basis. There 8 teams in the Elite league playing each other twice and also how can it be called 'Elite' when most of the riders also double up for a Premier Club - where's the competition in that, sort out the leagues, Elite should mean ELITE, bring back the competition even if it means joining the Elite and Premier League together. Also Speedway tracks shutting because of lack of support is a major problem and needs to be urgently addressed and although people need houses local Councils and Planning Departments need to understand they also need places to go for entertainment and football isn't the only sport on the planet people want to watch, the bikes may make some noise but so what many houses in this country are built next to major road/motorways that generate more noise permanently than a speedway meeting. I for one would rather watch a speedway meeting any day at least when riders fall off they usually get up dust themselves off and carry on unlike a lot of footballers who roll around on the ground because they have banged their big toe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Lakeside are one of, if not the worst offenders for letting Poole get away with all manner of crap. That is killing the sport. Also Lakeside speedway (under it's old promotion) invented the TR - like it or not that has kept a lot of people away. Disingenius as usual. It is the collective BSPA that lets Poole get away with all manner of crap - the Lakeside promotion know the score so little point in pursuing an issue when you know it will come to nothing. As for the TR - yes, it may have been an initiative originating from said source but it still needed agreement from the rest to become reality. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Disingenius as usual. It is the collective BSPA that lets Poole get away with all manner of crap - the Lakeside promotion know the score so little point in pursuing an issue when you know it will come to nothing. As for the TR - yes, it may have been an initiative originating from said source but it still needed agreement from the rest to become reality. I know they're all bad for letting Poole get away with it, I've said so many times. But Lakeside are worst, they just seem to roll over and take it. As for the TR, Ronnie Russell and Len Silver invented it, I'll always blame them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 No harm at all in blaming said two but, as acknowledged, they were just the instigators. Personally, I don't like the TR (because of the 'joker points' nature of it) neither does Jon Cook but a majority in BSPA towers seem to want it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 (edited) Lakeside are one of, if not the worst offenders for letting Poole get away with all manner of crap. That is killing the sport. Also Lakeside speedway (under it's old promotion) invented the TR - like it or not that has kept a lot of people away.The allegation made was specifically Lakeside. The previous promotion was Arena Essex. Whilst I am the first to agree the TR rule is IMO one of the worst if not the worst rules the sport has, no if I had my way it would be abolished tomorrow, the fact remains that plent y of forum members have posted on here saying they like the rule and it plays a part in bringing interest to one sided meetings. So while certain macontents might stay away allegedly because of it where is the pspecific evidence that overall , on a roundabouts and swings basis it causes more to stay away than are attracted by the rule ? For. the record the present Lakeside promotion were one of those pressing for it to be reduced from two per match to one, which is the best compromise that could probably be achieved given Sky's obsession with the silly idea O So taking your other point, that Lakeside are one of the worst if not the worst offenders for letting Poole get away with "all manner of crap " , pr precisely what "all manner of crap" are you referring to ? There was of course the controversial cancellation of the Poole v Lakeside me ting a. few years ago . If you bothered to read the Speedwáy Star report ( and I know you would prefer not to check the facts) you would see that the matter was due to go before the SCB the following July but they did no thing, so what you are saying is that it's not Pooles fault, nothing to do with the toothless SCB , but all Lakeside's fault. Let's remember that when there were allegations of Poole fiddling the averages in 2009 to get Hans Andersen in it was Lakeside that asked the SCB to investigate whil e the rest were huffing and puffing and making comments in programme notes but not actu ally doing anything, and the SCB's half hearted investigation that finished up with no action being taken. Anyway let's be generous and say Lakeside have some culpability in the Poole cancellation. What other " manner of crap " have Lakeside in particular been responsible for letting Poole get away with as opposed to the SCB, the BSPA , Swindon Coventry and all the rest And just to keep our minds focussed let me say once again that my comment was the sport is shooting itself in the foot and I have not said Lakeside have not been part and parcel of that collective process. The point I challenged was the specific claim that Lakeside a re a MAJOR part of the problem as opposed to being part of a collective failing under a weak managing body. I don't think I can put it more succinctly than that. https://www.facebook.com/4645marques Edited July 13, 2015 by E I Addio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABS Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Was there on Friday watching the Aces and have to confess that I like my visits to Lakeside. It would be great for the sport if, as part of the deal (if there is a deal), Lakeside carried on with a new up-to-date stadium which was marketed well. Before the meeting I spent some time at the Lakeside shops and didn't see any evidence of a speedway meeting that evening being marketed. Lakeside, like Belle Vue, has a large catchment area and both should be getting better crowds than they do. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 I know they're all bad for letting Poole get away with it, I've said so many times. But Lakeside are worst, they just seem to roll over and take it. As for the TR, Ronnie Russell and Len Silver invented it, I'll always blame them Well come on then lets have a specific list of all. The times Lakeside in particular have let Poole get away with things that were nothing to do with anybody else. Lakeside were the ones that let Poole get away with t he heat 10 rain off against Belle Vue and let Poole get away with Poole snatching Medzienski away from Swindon so they could get Kasprzak in ? We still keep coming back to the basic point that whatever Lakeside have done or not done it's still difficult to sustain the argument that Lakeside have played a MAJOR part in the present state of the sport while all the rest are small part players , which is what was originally said. Was there on Friday watching the Aces and have to confess that I like my visits to Lakeside. It would be great for the sport if, as part of the deal (if there is a deal), Lakeside carried on with a new up-to-date stadium which was marketed well. Before the meeting I spent some time at the Lakeside shops and didn't see any evidence of a speedway meeting that evening being marketed. Lakeside, like Belle Vue, has a large catchment area and both should be getting better crowds than they do. Advertising at the shopping centre has apparently been investigated. I forget the actual figures but at a fans forum several years ago we were told that to have a display in the car park was something like £1000 for one day, and someone said last year that even to put a small advert in the toilets was about £600 a year. The trouble with advertising in the shopping centre is that everyone has the same idea so they can charge top dollar and it's all strictly controlled by the landlords. I do think it would be an idea to try to have some sort of mutual link with the Harley Davidson shop though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 (edited) For a start what about the time they did nothing about Poole illegal team when they declared, from memory Sam Masters at number 2 but he wasn't fit but the rules said the facility should have been for Ludvig Lindgren? Or the time Poole called a meeting off with Lakeside and Lakeside just backed down? You're right about the other incidents. But Swindon did fight the Miedzinski one. And BV are not much better than Lakeside with their pandering to Poole. Edited July 13, 2015 by SCB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 (edited) For a start what about the time they did nothing about Poole illegal team when from memory they declared, from memory Sam Masters at number 2 but he wasn't fit but the rules said the facility should have been for Ludvig Lindgren? Or the time Poole called a meeting off with Lakeside and Lakeside just backed down? You're right about the other incidents. But Swindon did fight the Miedzinski one. And BV are not much better than Lakeside with their pandering to Poole. i So the best you can come up with for "all manner of crap" is actually two episodes. I can't remember the Sam Masters episode and it seems you can't remember much about it either, but. The plain fact is that sort of thing happens quite a lot and not just with Lakeside. I remember Swindon coming to Lakeside with Cory Gathercole illegally in the side bu t there was no protest because it didn't change the match result and wouldn't have been worth £500 protest fee . Similar things happen with most clubs at times. The trouble with these situations as you well know is that illegal teams are ultimately a matter for the meeting referee. If he allows the rider to ride the chance s are you are going to lose your £500 protest fee if you take to the SCB who will sit on for months and do nothing. All roads lead back to the SCB and I am surprised people can't see that. It's like the SCB not ensuring Darcy' s points scored after his breathslyser were deducted despite the FIM ruling. That's not Lakeside pandering to Poole it's the SCB I have already dealt with the Poole v lakeside cancellation in my previous post. I am not sure how you get to the point that Swindon try to fight the Medzienski thing so that's alright but the Lakeside e /Poole match goes to the SCB and its somehow Lakeside's fault that the SCB did nothing . Surely both incidents are an indictment of the SCB rather than individual clubs . Anyway. Even if we said that Lakeside were 100 % responsible for that event 3 yedars ago that is not "all manner of crap " and the argument still doesn't sustain theclaim that Lakeside are playing MAJOR part in falling crowds in 2015 as opposed to being part of a collective failing. All the matters you mention and dozens of others involving a variety of clubs are symptomatic of a sport with hopelessly weak governance not the action of one or even a few clubs. The buck has to stop with the ruling body, as in any organisation. Edited July 13, 2015 by E I Addio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aces51 Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 For a start what about the time they did nothing about Poole illegal team when they declared, from memory Sam Masters at number 2 but he wasn't fit but the rules said the facility should have been for Ludvig Lindgren? Or the time Poole called a meeting off with Lakeside and Lakeside just backed down? You're right about the other incidents. But Swindon did fight the Miedzinski one. And BV are not much better than Lakeside with their pandering to Poole. The Aces learned their lesson that action against Poole is pointless with the watering incident. Poole were the opposing team and it was Poole riders who brought the matter to the attention of the SCB. Effectively it was no different than Poole's actions in the Lakeside match, you could even argue Poole's actions were worse because they were premeditated whereas Belle Vue acted on the spur of the moment faced with having to race with a much weakened side. With Belle Vue, the SCB,quite rightly, acted immediately. Belle Vue were fined and lost league points. With Poole, the SCB did nothing until the outcry on here and social media forced their hand, they then promised action but did nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveLyric2 Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Sums up this forum when an 'Arena Essex' thread becomes 'its all Poole's fault' by the usual suspects!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 The Aces learned their lesson that action against Poole is pointless with the watering incident. Poole were the opposing team and it was Poole riders who brought the matter to the attention of the SCB. Effectively it was no different than Poole's actions in the Lakeside match, you could even argue Poole's actions were worse because they were premeditated whereas Belle Vue acted on the spur of the moment faced with having to race with a much weakened side. With Belle Vue, the SCB,quite rightly, acted immediately. Belle Vue were fined and lost league points. With Poole, the SCB did nothing until the outcry on here and social media forced their hand, they then promised action but did nothing. At least someone understands the facts. Not many people seem to. . For some reason people choose to ignore the SCB's record of indecisiveness in these matters where Poole are concerned As I recall the Belle Vue matter was done and dusted in double quick time but the Poole matter was adjourned time after time until after the play offs by which time it didn't matter anyway. No way the SCB were going to deduct Pooles play off points anymore than they are going to deduct Darcy's points scored after his breath tests . It was the same with the cheating allegations in 2009. The SCB report said they had interviewed 20 rider s mechanics and trackstaff every single one of them attached to Poole and strangely enough none of them said they knew anything about cheating so they concluded there was no case to answer, Sums up this forum when an 'Arena Essex' thread becomes 'its all Poole's fault' by the usual suspects!! What sums the forum up is a perfectly reasonable enquiry about the future of a track gets a perfectly factual answer and the thread gets hijacked by people who either can't read or read something that wasn't written. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ouch Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 BV had never pandered to Poole but have been stitched up on many occasions and not just by Poole, all with the blessing of the authorities. We did however expertly sell a pallet of bricks down south. ££££ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
customhouseregular Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 BV had never pandered to Poole but have been stitched up on many occasions and not just by Poole, all with the blessing of the authorities. We did however expertly sell a pallet of bricks down south. ££££ What has this got to do with Arena Essex? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigcatdiary Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 What has this got to do with Arena Essex? They were ground into dust to use the on the Lakeside track Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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