iris123 Posted July 10, 2015 Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 How on earth is telling people to be offended by something that isn't intended to be offensive educational? It's just creating a problem in places where previously it didn't exist. There are always going to be places where racial tension exists unfortunately but why create a problem ? If people aren't offended by something, why tell them they should be? Can't you understand a simple statement?It isn't about telling people to be offended.It is telling people that it is a controversial emblem that does offend others.It also has nothing whatsoever to do with Somerset,so there is no real reason to use it.So why use something that offends others when it is quite easy to use something more relevant to Somerset that isn't controversial.It just appears to me to be stupid and inconsiderate to continue with it once it ha been pointed out how offensive and controversial it is 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted July 10, 2015 Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 How on earth is telling people to be offended by something that isn't intended to be offensive educational? It's just creating a problem in places where previously it didn't exist. There are always going to be places where racial tension exists unfortunately but why create a problem ? If people aren't offended by something, why tell them they should be? ........................ and therein lies the problem. Good Post. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFCB Wildcat Posted July 10, 2015 Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 (edited) Can't you understand a simple statement?It isn't about telling people to be offended.It is tellings people that it is a controversial emblem that does offend others.It also has nothing whatsoever to do with Somerset,so there is no real reason to use it.So why use something that offends others when it is quite easy to use something more relevant to Somerset that isn't controversial.It just appears to me to be stupid and inconsiderate to continue with it once it ha been pointed out how offensive and controversial it isBut it's only offensive because people either choose or are told to be offended by it. Can't you understand that? Like I said, most people are happy to get on with life whatever colour they are. If my biggest problem in life was a flag I would be a happy man! Edited July 10, 2015 by AFCB Wildcat 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatface Posted July 10, 2015 Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 and that's the problem. We've had to be told that it's offensive or to be offended by it where as previously we didn't know or weren't offended. This is the PC that people complain about. There wasn't a problem and now there is. I Actually what happens is that humanity evolves. What is right and accepted and the norm changes. You only have to watch a 70s sitcom to see what is considered acceptable then is offensive now. Or would you be happier for black people to be referred to it an openly derogatory way now? With regards to the confederate flag, I am not massively offended, nor massively in support. I am indifferent to it. Which I suspect you are too. But other people are hugely offended by its connotations. So what takes priority - our indifference or the huge offence taken by others? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsunami Posted July 10, 2015 Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 Actually what happens is that humanity evolves. What is right and accepted and the norm changes. You only have to watch a 70s sitcom to see what is considered acceptable then is offensive now. Or would you be happier for black people to be referred to it an openly derogatory way now? With regards to the confederate flag, I am not massively offended, nor massively in support. I am indifferent to it. Which I suspect you are too. But other people are hugely offended by its connotations. So what takes priority - our indifference or the huge offence taken by others? There are always some who take offence at anything. You saying we should just lie down and go with them on everything. Move on. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted July 11, 2015 Report Share Posted July 11, 2015 (edited) Another use of what is a legal flag,but one that is often used by neo-nazis and caused quite a storm near me last year amongst the allotment holders.Again,there was no real reason to hoist the flag and the guy swore he wasn't right-wing,said he was just a fan of eagles,but eventually removed it and probably has now been kicked out o the garden community... http://www.bild.de/regional/hamburg/kleingaertner/hisst-reichsflagge-in-hamburg-37204558.bild.html Edited July 11, 2015 by iris123 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahLapworth Posted July 11, 2015 Report Share Posted July 11, 2015 Another use of what is a legal flag,but one that is often used by neo-nazis and caused quite a storm near me last year amongst the allotment holders.Again,there was no real reason to hoist the flag and the guy swore he wasn't right-wing,said he was just a fan of eagles,but eventually removed it and probably has now been kicked out o the garden community... http://www.bild.de/regional/hamburg/kleingaertner/hisst-reichsflagge-in-hamburg-37204558.bild.html If i'm right that is the old German Imperial Navy flag? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted July 11, 2015 Report Share Posted July 11, 2015 If i'm right that is the old German Imperial Navy flag? I don't think so - see here: http://www.bild.de/regional/hamburg/kleingaertner/hisst-reichsflagge-in-hamburg-37204558.bild.html It mentions Nazis - my German is very limited. Perhaps iris 123 could help us out here. There is no Maltese Cross on the Flag either. I could well be wrong though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Third Man Posted July 11, 2015 Report Share Posted July 11, 2015 Another use of what is a legal flag,but one that is often used by neo-nazis and caused quite a storm near me last year amongst the allotment holders.Again,there was no real reason to hoist the flag and the guy swore he wasn't right-wing,said he was just a fan of eagles,but eventually removed it and probably has now been kicked out o the garden community... http://www.bild.de/regional/hamburg/kleingaertner/hisst-reichsflagge-in-hamburg-37204558.bild.html isn't that the German Imperial flag used in the First World War, why is that offensive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted July 11, 2015 Report Share Posted July 11, 2015 isn't that the German Imperial flag used in the First World War, why is that offensive? Yes it is one of them.It is offensive,i guess because of what it represents,just like the Confederate flag and indeed just like the Japanese rising sun flag is controversial to some nations because of what it represents.Practically all the old red,white and black flags tend to be offensive in Germany because they are the colours that neo-nazis wear. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Japan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Skid Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 The flag has been perfectly OK until some psycho with a gun and a flag went on the rampage, would be far better to have gotten rid of the gun than the flag. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobMcCaffery Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 (edited) The flag has been perfectly OK until some psycho with a gun and a flag went on the rampage, would be far better to have gotten rid of the gun than the flag. It was never perfectly okay and was always seen as a symbol of white supremacy over the black population in the US, especially the southern states. Why do you think the psycho was so fond of the flag? It was the symbol of his racist hatred. Some people in here really need to stick to speedway. In Britain the confederate flag is seen differently; as some kind of 'cool' sign of the rebel and its deeply offensive nature to many just isn't seen here, as reflected in some of the complacent and idiotic posts in this thread. It's obvious that when the 'Rebel' identity was introduced to British Speedway back in 1972 at Oxford nobody realised how offensive it was in America, and to be honest it wasn't that relevant in a non-American sport. When South Carolina lowered the flag last week it was a deeply significant moment for the local black population as they finally had that potent symbol of racist supremacy finally removed. So, it may be a trivial matter here but it isn't elsewhere. Somerset keeping the image won't cause a diplomatic incident but it would be intelligent and sensitive to consider a change for next year, but then speedway doesn't 'do' 'intelligent' does it? Edited July 12, 2015 by rmc 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truro Robin Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 It was never perfectly okay and was always seen as a symbol of white supremacy over the black population in the US, especially the southern states. Why do you think the psycho was so fond of the flag? It was the symbol of his racist hatred. Some people in here really need to stick to speedway. In Britain the confederate flag is seen differently; as some kind of 'cool' sign of the rebel and its deeply offensive nature to many just isn't seen here, as reflected in some of the complacent and idiotic posts in this thread. It's obvious that when the 'Rebel' identity was introduced to British Speedway back in 1972 at Oxford nobody realised how offensive it was in America, and to be honest it wasn't that relevant in a non-American sport. When South Carolina lowered the flag last week it was a deeply significant moment for the local black population as they finally had that potent symbol of racist supremacy finally removed. So, it may be a trivial matter here but it isn't elsewhere. Somerset keeping the image won't cause a diplomatic incident but it would be intelligent and sensitive to consider a change for next year, but then speedway doesn't 'do' 'intelligent' does it? Great post! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFCB Wildcat Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Actually what happens is that humanity evolves. What is right and accepted and the norm changes. You only have to watch a 70s sitcom to see what is considered acceptable then is offensive now. Or would you be happier for black people to be referred to it an openly derogatory way now? Well go on then im intrigued. I tried to treat your post with the contempt it deserved but explain why anything I wrote would lead you to ask that pathetic & insulting question. A bit like Iris who had to suggest that "I don't understand a statement" when in fact I just don't agree! For the record I don't think humanity has evolved. Racist remarks have had to be policed out of the mainstream but thats not to say that the same bigotry doesn't exist anymore because unfortunately it does. Sadly racial hatred & intolerance on all sides is still alive & well for those who wish to persue it but Somersets flag is the least of the problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 (edited) Well go on then im intrigued. I tried to treat your post with the contempt it deserved but explain why anything I wrote would lead you to ask that pathetic & insulting question. A bit like Iris who had to suggest that "I don't understand a statement" when in fact I just don't agree! For the record I don't think humanity has evolved. Racist remarks have had to be policed out of the mainstream but thats not to say that the same bigotry doesn't exist anymore because unfortunately it does. Sadly racial hatred & intolerance on all sides is still alive & well for those who wish to persue it but Somersets flag is the least of the problems. So is the Confederate Battle Flag - you need to change hearts and minds not the Flag. Edited July 12, 2015 by The White Knight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chunky Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 It was never perfectly okay and was always seen as a symbol of white supremacy over the black population in the US, especially the southern states. Why do you think the psycho was so fond of the flag? It was the symbol of his racist hatred. Some people in here really need to stick to speedway. In Britain the confederate flag is seen differently; as some kind of 'cool' sign of the rebel and its deeply offensive nature to many just isn't seen here, as reflected in some of the complacent and idiotic posts in this thread. It's obvious that when the 'Rebel' identity was introduced to British Speedway back in 1972 at Oxford nobody realised how offensive it was in America, and to be honest it wasn't that relevant in a non-American sport. When South Carolina lowered the flag last week it was a deeply significant moment for the local black population as they finally had that potent symbol of racist supremacy finally removed. So, it may be a trivial matter here but it isn't elsewhere. Somerset keeping the image won't cause a diplomatic incident but it would be intelligent and sensitive to consider a change for next year, but then speedway doesn't 'do' 'intelligent' does it? I hate to disagree, Rob, but while the Confederate flag has never been truly "accepted" by some Americans, the vast majority have never been that offended by it. Some may not like it, but there has never been any serious attempt to ban it. While there are obvious racist undertones, most - even black Americans - have accepted that it is a part of American history. Some of the stuff they show in TV these days can be considered genuinely offensive, yet it now becomes important to pull "The Dukes of Hazzard". Oh well, just another typical knee-jerk reaction, thanks to the efforts of lunatic activists... Steve 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sotonian Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 But I would say a major problem for speedway is that it hasn't managed to attract ethnic minorities.If it did,we might not have to speculate on how they would react and speculation is something I thought you didn't like,unless of course it suits your argument Why is it a major problem for speedway? Motor sport in general does not attract ethnic minoriites in any number as competitors or spectators. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 I hate to disagree, Rob, but while the Confederate flag has never been truly "accepted" by some Americans, the vast majority have never been that offended by it. Some may not like it, but there has never been any serious attempt to ban it. While there are obvious racist undertones, most - even black Americans - have accepted that it is a part of American history. Some of the stuff they show in TV these days can be considered genuinely offensive, yet it now becomes important to pull "The Dukes of Hazzard". Oh well, just another typical knee-jerk reaction, thanks to the efforts of lunatic activists... Steve Spot on!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 A bit like Iris who had to suggest that "I don't understand a statement" when in fact I just don't agree! No you obviously didn't understand.I mentioned education or educating people to understand the full implications of the flag and how it offends a large number of people.Rather like other examples I have mentioned in this topic.You came back with some rubbish about why should people be told to be offended!!!! You obviously didn't understand,becuse no-one has said anyone should be told to be offended,but it seems reasonable that they should know that others are and is it really a symbol worth using.........Lack of understanding on your part without doubt or you are just trying to argue for the sake of it despite understanding. And there was an article on the Beeb about the use of the flag in other countries and of course there was no mention of it in Somerset !!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 No you obviously didn't understand.I mentioned education or educating people to understand the full implications of the flag and how it offends a large number of people.Rather like other examples I have mentioned in this topic.You came back with some rubbish about why should people be told to be offended!!!! You obviously didn't understand,becuse no-one has said anyone should be told to be offended,but it seems reasonable that they should know that others are and is it really a symbol worth using.........Lack of understanding on your part without doubt or you are just trying to argue for the sake of it despite understanding. I'm all for that iris123. The Confederate Battle Flag has a great History and Tradition. It should be honoured for that. The Racist scumbags who have hijacked the Flag for their own ends are the problem not the Flag. I have said many times that a lot of brave men died under that Flag, the full implications and History of the Flag should be taught in Schools in America - you are right. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.