John Cook Talks A Lot Of Sense

[TonyE]

A mixed reaction as expected. A few saying JC says one thing then does the opposite etc. he is part of the problem etc.

 

JC is but one member of the promoters' club (BSPA) - if not sufficient others believe in his ideas/proposals then they will not happen - is that his fault?

 

Jon wanted Hammers' fans to get the detail of the Fans Forum prior to general release and posting on the Club's website (as happened later), would have circumvented that desire. Was he right to do it this way, opinions may differ but it was his choice.

 

As one who attended the Forum, it was clear that there are elements within BSPA who are not 'forward/greater picture looking' and that JC is banging his head against a brick wall (outvoted) etc when trying effect meaningful change. I certainly got the impression he is just as frustrated as many of the fans.

 

To both his, and the Lakeside promotions' credit, he does at least put himself up to engaging with fans in an open and constructive way.

Edited May 30, 2015 by TonyE

[MattK]

A mixed reaction as expected. A few saying JC says one thing then does the opposite etc. he is part of the problem etc.

 

JC is but one member of the promoters' club (BSPA) - if not sufficient others believe in his ideas/proposals then they will not happen - is that his fault?

 

Jon wanted Hammers' fans to get the detail of the Fans Forum prior to general release and posting on the Club's website (as happened later), would have circumvented that desire. Was he right to do it this way, opinions may differ but it was his choice.

 

As one who attended the Forum, it was clear that there are elements within BSPA who are not 'forward/greater picture looking' and that JC is banging his head against a brick wall (outvoted) etc when trying effect meaningful change. I certainly got the impression he is just as frustrated as many of the fans.

 

To both his, and the Lakeside promotions' credit, he does at least put himself up to engaging with fans in an open and constructive way.

 

Did he give an example of a specific area where he was outvoted?

[marko]

Is this the same Jon Cook who was co promoter at Eastbourne often bending every rule in the book and using every trick up his sleeve to screw other teams over including my own beloved Hammers! Now he pretends that never happened and he is somehow holier than thou and wants to put everything right? Too late Mr Cook, sooner he jumps back into bed with the Dugard family the better.

[oldtimer]

Exactly that. The sports panders to the oldies. It plays old music, it's lets old people in for less, the presenters are meetings are generally in their 50s or 60s. Everything is about how things used to be done. The sport needs a kick up the arse to modernise itself - it doesn't need rules for that!

I'm an oldie, 69 years next month, but I am also fed up with the old music that is played at my home track. Decent music can create an atmosphere, that's why they have background music in films. Tracks can't create the atmosphere of the Cardiff GP because there is not enough people, but they can create the excitement and the music and presentation, why they can't be bothered beats me, perhaps you have to have a Performing Rights licence and pay a fee to play music that is less than 30 years old. Also agree the presenters and the presentation needs to be updated.

[Trees]

Exactly that. The sports panders to the oldies. It plays old music, it's lets old people in for less, the presenters are meetings are generally in their 50s or 60s. Everything is about how things used to be done. The sport needs a kick up the arse to modernise itself - it doesn't need rules for that!

Is this because the promoters aren't on the ball when it comes to music, I'm old but I like loads of modern music, I love loads of old music too, a mixture is the way to go.

 

Come on you 20 somethings, what else do u want?

Is this the same Jon Cook who was co promoter at Eastbourne often bending every rule in the book and using every trick up his sleeve to screw other teams over including my own beloved Hammers! Now he pretends that never happened and he is somehow holier than thou and wants to put everything right? Too late Mr Cook, sooner he jumps back into bed with the Dugard family the better.

On the other hand it could be he has now seen the light

 

I don't mind my Lakeside trips must admit, the mic man is bias towards the home team and that is how it should be, the track staff should all be high fiving their riders, playing some winning music (wipe out used to be played at Peterborough when they 5-1'd, it annoyed me sooooo much) etc. That just winds the away fans up which ultimately makes for extra atmosphere. Better excuse my language now lol

 

The promoters and riders just need to think about what the fans want to hear and see and put it into action, I don't think it would be very hard to turn things around for the current fans, if they can get the basics right then hopefully it will attract newbies?

 

The fixture list, rules and double uppers etc, more difficult to get right!

[E I Addio]

Look at the club's website! And apologise to Jon Cook perhaps?

 

No chance of that Bryn. Easy to put jump in feet first and get it wrong. It takes someone with a bit of backbone to apologise and it pretty clear from Mr Westons persistent whinging he hasn't got one.

[Bryn]

Didn't get it wrong. You and probably of a similar age to Bryn and don't get this internet thingy.

 

Jon Cook needs to communicate with young people. He certainly won't do that through an article in a programme a week after the event.

 

And then, they put it online a week after the event.

 

No need for me to apologise.

 

Lakeside need to move in the 21st Century with their communications. At the moment they are stuck in the 1980s.

 

Sad but true

 

What a load of cobblers! It's on the website which is a good site, updated regularly and the club also have a Facebook page. And, given my mangled mitts I do practically everything (within reason! ) on the internet as do many of "similar age" to me, and indeed older than me!

Edited May 30, 2015 by Bryn

[orion]

 

 

As one who attended the Forum, it was clear that there are elements within BSPA who are not 'forward/greater picture looking' and that JC is banging his head against a brick wall (outvoted) etc when trying effect meaningful change. I certainly got the impression he is just as frustrated as many of the fans.

 

 

Who said Cook is forward thinking ...look at some of the sutpid things he put forward in the past it's no wonder people vote against him .

 

As I said he just gone along with Poole over the years and sided with them time and time again while it has ripped speedway apart ,,,if he wants meaningful change maybe he should have stood up and been counted why Poole were calling off that home match against them a season or so ago ...as they say Talk is cheap .

Edited May 30, 2015 by orion

[brandonmole]

 

What a load of cobblers!

Rather childish response Bryn!

[E I Addio]

Lakeside have one of the best web sites, but there still doesn't seem to be any feature that allows for a two-way communication with the promoters.

Jon Cook has said that any fan can go and see him at any time up to 7pm on race days. Can you imagine a website with two way communication ? It would be jammed with the P-takers on here whose only pleasure in life is moaning.

 

Look at the sequence of events. A fans forum has been called to quash rumours about the future of the club. Rumours which gained traction on a Speedwáy forum. Cook meets the fans face to face in a two hour meeting. Spedway Star publish what are basically a few comments towards the end of the meeting that are very remote from the main thrust of the discussion. The main points of the discussion are then published in the programme. Cook says in his programme notes that the best suggestion from the floor was that every promoter should meet with the fans before the AGM and he would be passing that suggestion to the powers that be. Nobody who has posted on here complaining about the sport has said that is a good idea so presumably they think it is bad one.

.

A two way communication on a website in no way compares with a face to face discussion. I am not saying Cook is right in everything he said but he is the only promoter to meet the fans this side of the AGM. I am surprised nobody has come on here and said they would like the opportunity to meet with their promoter prior to the AGM.

Didn't get it wrong. You and probably of a similar age to Bryn and don't get this internet thingy.

 

Jon Cook needs to communicate with young people. He certainly won't do that through an article in a programme a week after the event.

 

And then, they put it online a week after the event.

 

No need for me to apologise.

 

Lakeside need to move in the 21st Century with their communications. At the moment they are stuck in the 1980s..,

e

Of course you got it wrong . Your first complaint was that it was not on the Internet but it was on the Internet. When you realised that you had got that wrong you back pedalled and said it was not on soon enough which is rubbis. Cooks first duty above all else is to his own fan base, not all of whom are on the Internet but a more sizeable portion don't sit at home trawling Speedwáy sites. It's prefectly reasonable that the notes should go on within 24 hours of the programme notes, and a week after the meeting.

 

I notice you have no comment on the notes themselves. If the worst thing anyone can say is that the notes went on the Internet a week after they should have done then Speedwáy has a lot less problems than I thought.

 

BTW. You have no idea whether I get the "Internet thing" as you call it or not. Scratching round for attempted insults detracts from the main thrust of your argument (at least it would if you had one)

What other sport in the World can you still get away with cheating? s.

Cricket, Athletics, wrestling , F1, various classes of saloon car racing, and I also heard something or other on the news the other day that there is some sort of suggestion of corruption in football, heaven forbid.

Edited May 30, 2015 by E I Addio

[KevtheRev]

I applaud Jon for having the Fans Forum.

 

However, we are then presented with a situation where we have no speedway for 2 weeks, 1 meeting, no speedway for another 2 weeks, then we have 2 meetings in the space of 4 days, all because of SKY - ludicrous.

[hans fan]

was it cooks idea a few years with the farcical k.o cup ??? , if it was god help us , has to be the worse format I've ever witnessed , bordering on insane

Edited May 30, 2015 by hans fan

[SCB]

was it cooks idea a few years with the farcical k.o cup ??? , if it was god help us , has to be the worse format I've ever witnessed , bordering on insane

I normally love a bit of man-on-man but even I was embarrassed by it!

[Trees]

It's not about using a computer programme, it's about taking the right meetings into account.

 

Belle Vue had two riders missing last night due to World U21 commitments. Clearly World U21 meetings weren't taken into account when producing the fixtures because Lakeside hadn't had a home meeting for three weeks and Belle Vue had no other Friday fixtures in May so there were plenty of opportunities to hold this meeting when riders were available.

Of course it's about inputting all meetings, that goes without saying!

[orion]

 

It's not about using a computer programme, it's about taking the right meetings into account.

 

Belle Vue had two riders missing last night due to World U21 commitments. Clearly World U21 meetings weren't taken into account when producing the fixtures because Lakeside hadn't had a home meeting for three weeks and Belle Vue had no other Friday fixtures in May so there were plenty of opportunities to hold this meeting when riders were available.

Like the night before the two Gp's you mean ?

[The White Knight]

Well done to John Cook in this weeks Speedway Star, at last a promoter who has taken his head out of the sand and spoken some sense. A cut down version of his article is as follows.

 

"Speedways hard core fans are losing heart with the sport and he feels their voices need to be heard, even if promoter's don't feel comfortable hearing what is being said. This sport is slowly losing it's hardcore and it's taking the mickey out of it's hardcore if it doesn't believe these problems aren't being felt by fans turning away from the sport. Anyone who thinks their club and the business as a whole is worth it's salt should take time to at least twice a year, meet their fans and talk openly to them. They should take the criticism because a lot of it is justified. There needs to be direct input from the fans at the highest level. Those in power have to listen to the fans. The fans are disillusioned and their patience is being tested."

 

At last a promotor who has taken his head out of the sand and said what many fans feel and why like myself after over 50 years of and on, following speedway, I don't go anymore and only watch it on TV.

Well I haven't been to a Speedway Meeting for about a year now.

 

I will not return until the 'Double Points' fiddle is history. As soon as it is removed - I will return, until then then - I am a Television viewer of Speedway only.

 

If speedway fans can't have a say on what is wrong with the sport, how are clubs going to mend what they are doing wrong?

 

John Perrin, Belle Vue promoter for two decades, used to tell fans "If you don't like it, don't come," when fans had the face to complain to him personally. Fans stopped coming.

 

If fans don't moan, and just stop attending, clubs are unaware.

 

Speedway seems so out of time right now. No one is really sure who is their rider, the season is set up with meaningless matches that are designed for the end-of-season Grand Finale of the Play-Offs.

 

It may help increase the coffers for those that make the last two, but what has it done to gates throughout the season? You know, just by the whiff of it, that some clubs are decreasing their scores, so they can pull out a plum signing at the exact moment... It is like the wrestling lark, when you know the guy getting laid-into will come good.

 

Speedway seems to have gone the way of those cheap Channel 5 programme, more there for a novelty kick than anything really serious.

 

But, sadly, the way it's going... the only ending I can see, is a CH5 programme called Speedway Riders On Benefits.

 

You can't sell a sport like speedway on majority of meaningless matches that are kick abouts for two end of season bashes.

Never a truer word spoken.

 

The 'Play Offs' is another one of my hates. As I have said many times - it often cheats the League Champions out of the League Championship for some other undeserving Club.

 

No meeting for the last couple of weeks due to the SGP. Definitely needed a meeting last night, else massive gap in fixtures

 

Impossible to predict who's going to be in the U-21's, turned out Nielsen & Fricke were selected! Stead in original declaration would've been present

 

Only Cook was originally going to miss this meeting

................ and some people say that the Grand Prix System has no effect on British Speedway. :rolleyes:

[E I Addio]

Actually Jon Cook must be as thick as two short planks.

 

To 'reveal' that fans at the public meeting had expressed a wish for more frequent meetings.

When he is the promoter of a club that is only able to put on one farcical challenge match, masquerading as a League fixture, in a five week span.

And the guy heeds to be told that by others !

 

And to have the report trailed and anticipated as some sort of Gettysburg address.

Give me strength

 

He is as culpable as all the other promoters in all the ills and yet he is portraying himself as some sort of evangelist for change.

 

Me thinks Jon lives in Cook-Koo land.

.

Perhaps it's you that is as thick as two short planks and living in cloud cuckoo land for not checking the calendar and jumping in feet first.

 

A quick look at the calendar and fixture list will reveal that one meeting in five weeks is the result of two back to back GP's a week reserved for rain-offs and the SWC. Most EL clubs are in more or less the same situation with intermittent meetings, to the frustration of all fans but one of the problems with modern Speedwáy is that domestic fixtures are wrecked by the SWC, the GP's, World u/21's and the various qualifiers.

 

He didn't say he needed to be told by others that the fans wanted more meetings. Talking in the context of the club having its own stadium , which now seems to at least be a possibility the complete sentence which you have chosen to misquote says "a regular race night , certainly a Saturday, IF WE HAVE OUR OWN HOME (I hope you read that bit), and more meetings are an absolute requirement from the views expressed" That was the context of the meeting, which lasted two hours, and which the report is only a summary.

 

Then we're do you get the idea the report was trailed? The Speedwáy Star article says they contacted him , not the other way round as you imply then said "Cook politely declined to talk about the meeting and says he will update the fans in the race day programme" How is that, by any stretch of the imagination,trailing the report like some sort of Gettysburg address as you claim?

 

On what basis is he portraying himself as an evangelist for change ? The context is about plans for a new stadium without being beholden to a stock car club.

 

I agree Cook is no angel, and I go along with what had been said for example about the crazy man on man KO cup races, but the other side of the coin is that too many people jump on the keyboard with wild exgerrations and miss the point of what is being conveyed, which takes the discussion nowhere.

 

It's interesting that of all those who jumped on the bandwagon of critcism not a single one has dais something like " I hope for the fans sake Lakeside get a new stadium , Speedwáy cannot afford to lose another club" but no interest in that aspect has been expressed at all. The unfortunate truth is thst the usual suspects who are not capable of sensible adult constructive criticism are as guilty of self interest as the body they love to complain about.

[Humphrey Appleby]

A quick look at the calendar and fixture list will reveal that one meeting in five weeks is the result of two back to back GP's a week reserved for rain-offs and the SWC. Most EL clubs are in more or less the same situation with intermittent meetings, to the frustration of all fans but one of the problems with modern Speedwáy is that domestic fixtures are wrecked by the SWC, the GP's, World u/21's and the various qualifiers.

And yet we're constantly told the SGP is good for the sport.

 

1 meeting in 5 weeks is a terrible business model, regardless of who's fault it is, and in fact a lot of speedway's problems are beyond its own control. However, it needs to find a model where fans can be reasonably assured of at least one meeting every couple of weeks, where all the advertised riders turn-up unless injured (and I mean really injured).

The 'Play Offs' is another one of my hates. As I have said many times - it often cheats the League Champions out of the League Championship for some other undeserving Club

Well I hate 'playoffs' because speedway isn't played and its a misuse of the English language.

 

However, plenty of sports have a Championship Finals system and I don't really have a objection provided higher placed teams get given some sort of advantage - whether a bye, home advantage or a second chance if they lose in the first round. In speedway it would also be possible to give some sort of handicap score.

[weatherwatcher]

It would be nice to see the team that actually finished top of the leagues get some sort of recognition for actally winning the league, but no, they have to go and take the top four finishers and after that who ever wins is declared the league chamoion. So the ppor sod who has done all the hard work all year can then end up falling at the last hurdle and finishing fourth. If they want to carry on with this then at least call the team that wins the league winner and the four teams that ride against each other, at least lets have it as a seperate tounament with a cup, but not to see who wins the league.

Somehow it despoils all the hard work done throughout the year, by the true wining team.

How would the punter of the Grand National feel if they had the top 4 horses over the line having to race off against each other as many times as the speedway teams do to be called the Grand National winner. They would be up in arms.

But the majority of speedway supporters, seem to love this stupid system that, was drempt up by the BPSA and SKY.

Edited May 31, 2015 by weatherwatcher

[E I Addio]

And yet we're constantly told the SGP is good for the sport.

1 meeting in 5 weeks is a terrible business model, regardless of who's fault it is, and in fact a lot of speedway's problems are beyond its own control. However, it needs to find a model where fans can be reasonably assured of at least one meeting every couple of weeks, where all the advertised riders turn-up unless injured (and I mean really injured).

.

I totally agree with that, but I don't see any answer while the EL remains in its present form . I love top league racing and would hate to see it go but it may be inevitable. Jon Cook said in his notes that he and Stuart Douglas have no interest in PL in its present form but would be attracted to to some kind of expanded regional competition. I don't quite know what he had in mind but that may well be where it all finishes up.