Coventry V Poole 1/6/15

[marko]

Why not just have a meeting format then of just 10 heats? costs in wages will be less, they can charge the fans less and the fans will not have to stand around for so long.

The BSPA and Sky have engineered the whole situation and i for one do not feel sorry for them if they loose money over it.

 

I do feel sorry for the fans though, but its a clear message to all though, if there is any doubt about rain, do not attend!

[orion]

it was raining before heat 1! in your world do you ever look outside and look up at the clouds and the wind and rain and think "you know what its going to get wet" or do you sit in the armchair with a nice fire and think "its not raining here" The pictures do not show how bad the weather was.

the point of this as someone who went and through loyalty to the sport still went in knowing i was getting mugged off, it wont be happening again!

?? I watched the match tv and the track was fine for 6 heats I am sure most agree on that ....what do want the new rules to be ..don't start a match on a perfect track in case something bad happens ...during the day bar going on the forcast there was no reason for cov to called that match off on indeed not start the match .

 

When I go to any speedway match myself and more so away matches I look at the forcasts and see if there is likely to be a rain off etc and take my chances ...you must known yourself that last night might have been called off at some stage so you took a chance and went ...no one ask you to and you knew the risks so you only have yourself to blame .

[SCB]

Why not just have a meeting format then of just 10 heats? costs in wages will be less, they can charge the fans less and the fans will not have to stand around for so long.

The BSPA and Sky have engineered the whole situation and i for one do not feel sorry for them if they loose money over it.

 

I do feel sorry for the fans though, but its a clear message to all though, if there is any doubt about rain, do not attend!

Exactly. If the format allows for a result at heat 10, just make all meetings 10 heats. Or why not just go all the way and have a 5 heat format and be done with it.

 

Too many meetings are started with the intention of getting to heat 10. It happened at Coventry in the recent meeting vs Lakeside and how many people complained then? One, thats how many. Now coventry have been screwed over by it a load of Coventry fans are in uproar. Maybe they should have cared a little more 4 weeks ago?!

[jim3751]

Sky are on again on Wednesday and I just hope the weather is 100% better and with the heatwave forcast all will be forgotten. But I would like to see Nigel and Kelvin discussing the matter while it's fresh in the mind. I know they come in for much criticism but can anyone doubt their enthusiasm for the sport? After the meeting they must have been gutted.

I have no way of knowing but it wouldn't surprise me if they were told at the outset FFS be enthusiastic and promote the sport no matter how dire the conditions.

 

The worst meeting I ever saw in wet conditions on Sky was one from Ipswich. They were just riding around in mud. I wonder how Chris felt about that but I guess we'll never know until Sky drop speedway for good.

[kenny bee firefly]

I heard that as well but didn't someone from Coventry say something like 'you might as well run heat 10 if you run heat 9' then there were some ironic 'yeh!' noises. I'm guessing the 'inspector' agreed and cracked on with heat 10.

 

Havelock should have been asking for the inspection at heat 5 or 6 but there was only 2 points in it then, it only became dangerous for the riders when Coventry were 9 behind.

The track was perfectly raceable until heat 6 . The Janowski/King clash for 2nd was def the race of the evening !

[SteveLyric2]

I said earlier the 10 heat rule should be abolished

In addition, I would say, for the sake of British speedway, let's do away with live televised meetings

Perhaps a weekly " highlights" programme - there still are highlights in this wonderful sport

Get the remains of the speedway public back in the stadia instead of their armchairs

This is one of the most sensible posts I've seen on this thread - Agree 100%.

[pugwash]

Whilst I appreciate that a Forum is for people to voice their own opinions - and indeed, what would anybodys opinion be if it were not their own...? Far too many people on this Forum are purely driven by a terribly painful view which extends no more than one degree either side of their own mind.

 

I speak as a very long time speedway fan - which team I support is irrelevant here.

 

Speedway has struggled very badly to become a sport of the 21st Century - despite the very best efforts and cash from John Postlethwaite / BSI some years ago.

 

Speedway needs to be run by a 'professional' body who have the business of speedway as their primary goal, not the interest of their own club read:own pockets at heart. British speedway is just surviving now because of Sky; without the Sky money more than one team a year would be going down the drain. But Sky have no loyalty to Speedway, they only show it because they have a market for it and, as such, have been slowly drawing back their attention to the sport over the past few years. If the powers that be are not extremely careful, Sky will walk and take their money with them and, although I hate to say it, it will be the final nail for British Speedway as we know it.

 

Speedway fans are a pretty loyal bunch, some may say stupid; paying out good money week on week just to be treated like a commodity with poor stadiums, poor catering, poor facilities and, worse, diabolically low appreciation from the management of the clubs they support.

 

Lat nights race meeting at Coventry was not a great spectacle for the sport BUT it was a scheduled race meeting that was deemed fit to begin by the adjudicating powers. And this is a crucial point; the independent powers that are vested to run the meeting are the powers that should take charge. Both teams, their management and riders have committed, contractually, to attend and compete in this meeting. It is not for either side to attempt to coerce or pressure the meeting officials to make decisions based upon the vested interest of one side or the other. And, to do this in front of the cameras is fundamentally damaging to the sport.

 

Wherever there are rules - i.e. everywhere in life - people will attempt to 'fracture' them, everybody plays to the rules and then attempts to push the boundaries just a little in an added attempt to win or gain the slightest advantage. Most humans do his everyday; sports people do this all of the time, it is what winning is all about.

BUT totally undermining Officials at a speedway meeting is pure anarchy, it cannot be allowed because without officials officiating within the framework of the sport it may just as well be a free-for-all.

 

So, to last nights match;

 

1. Gary Havelock should have his management licence suspended for refusing to send out riders for Heat 10.
   • It is the paying public - 'his' own fans - who he is depriving of their paid for entertainment
   • He is seriously damaging the entertainment scheduled by Sky Sports - love or hate Sky, it costs a lot of money to show a speedway match
   • If a rider does not want to ride then that is their decision, NOT Havelock's
   • Havelock took out two of the most experienced riders from Heat 10, two riders who were quite capable of riding the track. It was not as though they were two teenagers in their first ever meeting who he was trying to protect
   • This was the actions of a petulant little boy who has just lost all of his marbles on the school playing field
   • He has no right to undermine the officials of the meeting, he is NOT speedway, he is NOT the governing body
   • Regrettably, these past few weeks, Havelock has made himself look a fool with unnecessary, unconsidered and. some may say, pathetic comments in front of the cameras. He has let himself - and his club - down very badly. I feel he may well have a lot to give young riders but, as a manager - in sport or otherwise - it is part of your role to stand atop any melee, keep a clear head, and make calculated, decisive actions to lead your team on a more positive and successful path, not lose your head and start blaming everybody/everything else for the problems being encountered.
2. One should not attempt to cite that bad conditions lead to worse/more accidents. By far the worst accidents I have seen have occurred on hot, bright sunny days when everybody pays absolutely no attention to the weather/track conditions and rides at 100 percent. When weather is an issue it is up to a rider to ride within those conditions, and usually they do. Sometimes they slide out, sometimes they get bogged down in deep mud but these are professional riders who make their living from riding bikes and getting paid by US to do this. The real danger is riders who are not capable of controlling their bikes - Garrity - but then these are also the very riders that take everybody else down when it is dry and sunny, so really there is no argument here either. Don't take the moral high ground and argue against riders getting hurt; riders get hurt ALL of the time; this is just what Speedway is!

Speedway needs;

1. a clear vision of where it is in 2015 and where it needs to be in 2025 - which it does not have
2. a completely new, non-speedway, and non-CLUB affiliated Tier 1 management structure - which it does not have
3. a total review and reshaping of the rules, with ultimate decision making by a non-speedway biased, commercially aware Board structure (See point 2)
4. a total review and reshaping of the structure of the sport - e.g. realignment of race nights to two nights a week; team squad system etc.
5. a TOTAL re-positioning of the sport. Speedway, if it wants to continue, cannot remain a sport of the 1950's/60's/70's, a 'blue-collar', working class sport. It has got to become a sport for ALL.

OK, diatribe over, now I am off to save the rest of the World from itself... Oh, it's a tough life

Does anybody fancy a pint.

[philfromcov]

Whilst I appreciate that a Forum is for people to voice their own opinions - and indeed, what would anybodys opinion be if it were not their own...? Far too many people on this Forum are purely driven by a terribly painful view which extends no more than one degree either side of their own mind.

 

I speak as a very long time speedway fan - which team I support is irrelevant here.

 

Speedway has struggled very badly to become a sport of the 21st Century - despite the very best efforts and cash from John Postlethwaite / BSI some years ago.

 

Speedway needs to be run by a 'professional' body who have the business of speedway as their primary goal, not the interest of their own club read:own pockets at heart. British speedway is just surviving now because of Sky; without the Sky money more than one team a year would be going down the drain. But Sky have no loyalty to Speedway, they only show it because they have a market for it and, as such, have been slowly drawing back their attention to the sport over the past few years. If the powers that be are not extremely careful, Sky will walk and take their money with them and, although I hate to say it, it will be the final nail for British Speedway as we know it.

 

Speedway fans are a pretty loyal bunch, some may say stupid; paying out good money week on week just to be treated like a commodity with poor stadiums, poor catering, poor facilities and, worse, diabolically low appreciation from the management of the clubs they support.

 

Lat nights race meeting at Coventry was not a great spectacle for the sport BUT it was a scheduled race meeting that was deemed fit to begin by the adjudicating powers. And this is a crucial point; the independent powers that are vested to run the meeting are the powers that should take charge. Both teams, their management and riders have committed, contractually, to attend and compete in this meeting. It is not for either side to attempt to coerce or pressure the meeting officials to make decisions based upon the vested interest of one side or the other. And, to do this in front of the cameras is fundamentally damaging to the sport.

 

Wherever there are rules - i.e. everywhere in life - people will attempt to 'fracture' them, everybody plays to the rules and then attempts to push the boundaries just a little in an added attempt to win or gain the slightest advantage. Most humans do his everyday; sports people do this all of the time, it is what winning is all about.

BUT totally undermining Officials at a speedway meeting is pure anarchy, it cannot be allowed because without officials officiating within the framework of the sport it may just as well be a free-for-all.

 

So, to last nights match;

 

1. Gary Havelock should have his management licence suspended for refusing to send out riders for Heat 10.
   • It is the paying public - 'his' own fans - who he is depriving of their paid for entertainment
   • He is seriously damaging the entertainment scheduled by Sky Sports - love or hate Sky, it costs a lot of money to show a speedway match
   • If a rider does not want to ride then that is their decision, NOT Havelock's
   • Havelock took out two of the most experienced riders from Heat 10, two riders who were quite capable of riding the track. It was not as though they were two teenagers in their first ever meeting who he was trying to protect
   • This was the actions of a petulant little boy who has just lost all of his marbles on the school playing field
   • He has no right to undermine the officials of the meeting, he is NOT speedway, he is NOT the governing body
   • Regrettably, these past few weeks, Havelock has made himself look a fool with unnecessary, unconsidered and. some may say, pathetic comments in front of the cameras. He has let himself - and his club - down very badly. I feel he may well have a lot to give young riders but, as a manager - in sport or otherwise - it is part of your role to stand atop any melee, keep a clear head, and make calculated, decisive actions to lead your team on a more positive and successful path, not lose your head and start blaming everybody/everything else for the problems being encountered.
2. One should not attempt to cite that bad conditions lead to worse/more accidents. By far the worst accidents I have seen have occurred on hot, bright sunny days when everybody pays absolutely no attention to the weather/track conditions and rides at 100 percent. When weather is an issue it is up to a rider to ride within those conditions, and usually they do. Sometimes they slide out, sometimes they get bogged down in deep mud but these are professional riders who make their living from riding bikes and getting paid by US to do this. The real danger is riders who are not capable of controlling their bikes - Garrity - but then these are also the very riders that take everybody else down when it is dry and sunny, so really there is no argument here either. Don't take the moral high ground and argue against riders getting hurt; riders get hurt ALL of the time; this is just what Speedway is!

Speedway needs;

1. a clear vision of where it is in 2015 and where it needs to be in 2025 - which it does not have
2. a completely new, non-speedway, and non-CLUB affiliated Tier 1 management structure - which it does not have
3. a total review and reshaping of the rules, with ultimate decision making by a non-speedway biased, commercially aware Board structure (See point 2)
4. a total review and reshaping of the structure of the sport - e.g. realignment of race nights to two nights a week; team squad system etc.
5. a TOTAL re-positioning of the sport. Speedway, if it wants to continue, cannot remain a sport of the 1950's/60's/70's, a 'blue-collar', working class sport. It has got to become a sport for ALL.

OK, diatribe over, now I am off to save the rest of the World from itself... Oh, it's a tough life

problems is "deemed to be fit by the powers" actually means SKY TV, the ref has no power on the matter when sky is in town. i am not justifying coventrys actions clearly dummys were being thrown out, just the fact that it started knowing it was only going ten heats which means me as a paying punter no one gives a S*&t about me

[SteveLyric2]

 

sorry i was told at the gate that it was going to be ten heats, but i still went in! the track looked woeful. the last point the track is set up by the SKY team for the TV and not done locally.

 

So who was right in their respective interviews? Horton said in the podcast that 'Coventry had been instructed not to prepare the track they way they wanted to'!

 

Havvy said in the TV interview that Terry (the regular trackman) had worked wonders to get the track fit to race!!

[Poole Quay 7]

Nice of Neil Middleditch to pose for a photo with the local Big Issue seller

[orion]

the fact that it started knowing it was only going ten heats which means me as a paying punter no one gives a S*&t about me

It's not a fact thou ...no one knew at the start how many heats were going to run ....when the weather and the forcast was like it was last night you have a choice if you are going to go or not and you knew you were taking a risk ....not sure why you are feeling sorry for yourself as it's your own fault .

[Jacques]

Please not another TV farce. Heat 12 anyone?

 

Ok, so I forgot it was heat 10 now, but I got it right and that was two days before the meeting!

[pugwash]

Personally i enjoyed last nights curtailed meeting on tv and I'd like to thank Sky TV for putting on the meeting and Nig and Kelv for braving the elements and supplying their enthusiastic commentary.

[Game On]

It's not a fact thou ...no one knew at the start how many heats were going to run ....when the weather and the forcast was like it was last night you have a choice if you are going to go or not and you knew you were taking a risk ....not sure why you are feeling sorry for yourself as it's your own fault .

I new it was only going to be ten heats

[SteveLyric2]

PQ7 - That's the pic with the report in the Echo that makes reference to 'the Coventry team falling apart'!!

 

I cannot/ will not comment further other than to say that Poole and Kings Lynn have a great opportunity to bring some respectability back to our sport with the televised meeting tomorrow, in front of a packed house of £10 paying punters!!

Edited June 2, 2015 by Skidder1

[foamfence]

Poor show from Coventry and it looked bad on TV. Personally I was very disappointed when Bomber wouldn't ride, so much for his positivity! Isn't Havvy looking fat these days?

[Gemini]

Something to watching tomorrow. Hope it is shown in full only so I can see how bad it was.

 

Hope Gemini never forced Lucy & Molly to go and watch this. Might see them on the gogglebox

Fortunately I am on holiday in the Peak District. Mind you it was just the same weather in Bakewell so they still got soaked.

[foreverblue]

As i am one of the idiots who decided to go last night and regretted it, my view is that the meeting shouldn't have started and Coventry should have made a early decision to tell everyone including sky that the track was unfit with rain forecast all afternoon and evening, the fact that the real heavy rain didn't arrive until the meeting was well under way is in my view irrelevant and to charge 18 pounds when we all knew it would only last until heat 10 if it got that far is robbing the public which is part of the reason why very few bothered to turn up.

 

The meeting itself was predictably very poor with only really a couple of actual races, everything that could go wrong for Coventry did, mostly due to Garrity who is a bit wild at times and the luckless Danny King. as someone who has always had the greatest respect for Havvy i must say i was disappointed with his actions which has showed him in a poor light. once the meeting got to heat 9 they were always going to run heat 10, if havvy thought he could change that scenario he must be mad. To make matters worse they don't serve food at the Roseycombe on a monday!!

[Game On]

11 minutes ago

 

TEAM boss Neil Middleditch said he had no sympathy with Coventry after Pirates had emerged triumphant following a controversial end to their Elite League clash tonight.

Pirates had been leading 36-22 when the meeting was abandoned due to a waterlogged track at Brandon – with Coventry refusing to send out riders for heat 10.

Both Joonas Kylmakorpi and Chris Harris were excluded after failing to make the start line in time and no replacements were offered, allowing Chris Holder and Davey Watt to race unchallenged to a 5-0 win.

 

The meeting was subsequently brought to a premature end by referee Christina Turnbull with Pirates picking up four points as the result stood following the minimum required 10 heats.

Middleditch told the Daily Echo: “It wasn’t pretty speedway, I’ve got to admit that. We could see the conditions were deteriorating but I told the boys to keep focusing on making the starts.

“Coventry were trying to get the meeting called off when they were behind but the rules state that the losing team can demand a track inspection after heat 10 and they elected not to put out riders in heat 10.

“That was their fault, not ours. We can only race who they put against us and they put nobody against so we will take the 5-0 and all the points.

 

Asked whether he had any sympathy for the Bees, Middleditch replied: “No, not really. It would have been the same if it had been the other way round. As a manager, I have to try to keep my boys focused, which was what I did.

“Coventry were basically falling apart at the seams in the pits. They were running around and nobody knew what was going on. They had had a couple of falls but that’s speedway. You can only race what they put in front of you. The conditions were bad but my boys stayed focused and that is what it is all about.”

Chris Holder drew first blood for Pirates when a superb manoeuvre saw him squeeze past Hans Andersen to take the opening heat before Kyle Newman and Paul Starke teamed up for a maximum in the next.

Although Kylmakorpi and Harris hit back and Daniel King turned heat four into something of a procession, lightning starts from both Watt and Starke in heat five saw Pirates re-establish a four-point lead.

Maciej Janowski won an epic duel with King to take second place in heat six behind Kylmakorpi, while Harris’s win in heat seven reduced the deficit to just two points.

However, Watt and Starke were gifted a 5-0 in heat eight when King failed to leave the 15-metre start line and Garrity was excluded before Pirates opened a nine-point lead thanks to Newman’s win in heat nine.

And the meeting came to a farcical end when Kylmakorpi and Harris both failed to show for the start of heat 10, with Pirates claiming maximum points as they were leading at the time of the abandonment.

[weatherwatcher]

I said on here at 6 p.m, that the weather was going to deteraite, far quicker than the forcasters had predicted. The pressure had dropped alamingly all day with a 5 mb drop in just under 7 hours. There was a huge area of low pressure coming in off the Atlantic. If anyone had cared to ask onone in the area who runs a private weather station like myself, they would have known well before hand that the meeting should never have started in the first instance. OK it costs Sky big buck to set up. But even they could have had the sence to say we will call a day on this meeting. At 6 p.m here in South Derbyshire, which is not that far away from coventry. The wind was blowing quite hard, the rain was not to heavy, but is was the strong winds that was causing the issue, making the rain far worse that with it.

Sky have far to much say, when they role into town. The start line at heat one was a disgusting mess. It really did look like the tractor had been using a 6 furrow plough on it.

The ones who run speedway the SCB and the BPSA, have got to stand up to them before we see any very serious accidents happen.

Heat 10 would have been one big pile up if 4 riders had gone out on track. Chris Holder, would have more than likely have taken all 4 riders out, he nearlly took his own team mate out, with only the 2 of them, who where not even racing as racing goes. It was just a formality for the 2 of them to get the 4 laps over and done with.