mdmc82 Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 Not sure if this has already been answered elsewhere but aren't Stefan, Fricke & Bech riding in the same u21 meeting in Italy? If so why was Bech able to ride but not the Belle Vue riders? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil The Ace Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 (edited) Not sure if this has already been answered elsewhere but aren't Stefan, Fricke & Bech riding in the same u21 meeting in Italy? If so why was Bech able to ride but not the Belle Vue riders? Uncertaint with fricke but stef ain't set up abroad like bech so had to drive over. Bech will fly over Edited May 30, 2015 by Phil The Ace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdmc82 Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 Uncertaint with fricke but step ain't set up abroad like beck so had to drive over. Bech will fly over Thanks. 👍🏻 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waco Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 I too was standing on the back straight a little in front of the line and i thought it looked from that angle that Adam had won.. But ..the ref Barbara Horley, and i am one of her biggest critics,, has the best view in the stadium right on and over the top of the line looking down and you have to respect that decision..Ben had initually come from behind Adam twice to beat him, and it took some great team riding from Nillson to stop him doing it a third time in heat nine..That of course is my opinion others may disagree as is thier right 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedwaysliders Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 (edited) I too was standing on the back straight a little in front of the line and i thought it looked from that angle that Adam had won.. But ..the ref Barbara Horley, and i am one of her biggest critics,, has the best view in the stadium right on and over the top of the line looking down and you have to respect that decision..Ben had initually come from behind Adam twice to beat him, and it took some great team riding from Nillson to stop him doing it a third time in heat nine..That of course is my opinion others may disagree as is thier right love to know if anyone from re-run videos is reading this,who film right next to Barbara Horley in the refs box, if they were asked by the ref if she could look at the video or have seen therir own footage to clear who won hieat 2.To me if the ref never used the video replay to confirm her decision when the operater is sitting right next to her a few feet away in the same box!!! is 100% wrong and stupid Edited May 30, 2015 by speedwaysliders Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob B Posted May 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 love to know if anyone from re-run videos is reading this,who film right next to Barbara Horley in the refs box, if they were asked by the ref if she could look at the video or have seen therir own footage to clear who won hieat 2.To me if the ref never used the video replay to confirm her decision when the operater is sitting right next to her a few feet away in the same box!!! is 100% wrong and stupid Do they have a monitor/screen there that they can rewind it and view it back back on straight away? Most places just have a camera and can't expect a referee to look at a camera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 Most, if not all, video cameras have a monitor/screen! Frank Ebdon consulted the Re-run video footage some years ago to inform his decision making. Wow! Belle Vue won away. Can we use that team every week... please! All those that scoffed at our team before last night's result - IN YOUR FACE!!!!! Don't worry about the sport's current state, a Belle Vue away win has to be good for speedway. Nah... several guests and a lower than average Lakeside crowd... people will always moan. If all teams chose their guests as well as Belle Vue did last night, speedway wouldn't have any losers. Now... who's in our team next time? Not all teams get a wide range of guests to chose from - it so depends on who else is racing at the same time and/or available. Last night's BV team make up (and the Hammers' at Wolves) just make a mockery of British EL Speedway. The defeat will not impact what Lakeside achieve (or not) league-wise this year but it could well impact on their financial viability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackadder Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 Rule 14.9.2 includes:- Except when a recognised TV Company is in attendance who provide multi-angle replay views to the Referee, all decisions taken by a Referee shall be made without referral to a TV / Video monitor or replay thereof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 That sounds more related to on track incidents rather than start/finish line positions but hey ho etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aces51 Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 Not a win I take great delight in but we're not the first team to take advantage of rider absences. I do wonder if Lakeside are now regretting not agreeing to Belle Vue's request to rearrange the fixture. However, it is possible we would have won with our regular 1-7. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob B Posted May 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 That sounds more related to on track incidents rather than start/finish line positions but hey ho etc. It says "all decisions taken by a Referee" are deciding the positions over the line not a decision then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 How wrong was the ref in heat 2? everyone in the stadium could see Ellis had pipped Morley on the line. That error alone would have given us the draw. From where I stood I thought Adam nicked but I wasn't at a particularly good angle. However as they slowed down after the race I noticed Ben punched the air so he clearly thought he got it, and Adams body language didn't particurly suggest anything so who knows. Can't argue though because Adam passed Ben several times but instead of closing the door on him he stayed wide and kept letting Ben back . That seems to be a continuing problem with Adam . In the second reserves race he had what should have been a controlling lead and if he had moved over to the White line Ben would have been shut out , but instead he once again last a gap and Ben came through, then shortly after that Adam had his obligatory fall with nobody near him. This happens so often it is a worry.. Ben is an enigma. He rides Lakeside with the maturity, grit and determination of a far more experienced rider , I have seen him in PL meetings at Rye House and he seems to be going through the motions, without making any impression on the race, almost a completely different rider. I have to add though that Heat 2 was probably the best race of the night which shows that the fast track system can be very entertaining with evenly matched riders, but instead the powers that be have completely messed it up by including riders like Auty and Blackbird who are far too good for that system and just clear off and easily win the reserves race from the gate . 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagpuss Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 I actually thought the riders in the reserve draft made it far more balanced this year, Auty, Wright and Birks were added to give everybody (in theory) a strong senior reserve and a much more even set of number sevens. Lakeside IMO have been very unfortunate that Birks didn't recapture his 2013 form for Swindon and Ellis just hasn't kicked on at all. As I said on a different thread I thought the Hammers' pair would be one of the stronger ones but it may didn't turn out that way. Out if interest if Lakeside hadn't protected Ellis would they have got an earlier pick than Birks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 Out if interest if Lakeside hadn't protected Ellis would they have got an earlier pick than Birks? I think they would have got a better pick but it's logical to pick Ellis because he is an asset and nobody could really have foreseen that Ellis would have more or less gone backwards this year. He is banging the maximums at Brum and breaking the track record but his EL form is very hit and miss. Equally nobody could really have predicted that Birks would be so far down on his 2013 form. Therein lies the problem . If your top tier reserve is failing there is very little to choose from by way of replacement. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcon Hammer Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 I actually thought the riders in the reserve draft made it far more balanced this year, Auty, Wright and Birks were added to give everybody (in theory) a strong senior reserve and a much more even set of number sevens. Lakeside IMO have been very unfortunate that Birks didn't recapture his 2013 form for Swindon and Ellis just hasn't kicked on at all. As I said on a different thread I thought the Hammers' pair would be one of the stronger ones but it may didn't turn out that way. Out if interest if Lakeside hadn't protected Ellis would they have got an earlier pick than Birks? Only Charles Wright Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tocha Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 Only Charles Wright That wouldn't have worked. Charles is a Somerset asset riding on Friday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcon Hammer Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 That wouldn't have worked. Charles is a Somerset asset riding on Friday. Forgot about that, so we basically had last pick whatever happened... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted May 31, 2015 Report Share Posted May 31, 2015 . It says "all decisions taken by a Referee" are deciding the positions over the line not a decision then? Hence the 'hey ho' in my post. The reference to multi angle would appear to infer it is aimed primarily at exclusion scenarios - you don't need multi angles for a well placed camera on the start line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marko Posted May 31, 2015 Report Share Posted May 31, 2015 The problem is the FTR system is really an asset system, if you have good contracted riders you can hold on to them, which means if you finish bottom of the league one year despite having the first pick the next still end up with almost no choices because the other seven or eight clubs have already protected the Garrity's and Newman's of this world. It should either be a free for all which means any FTR rider can be drafted to any track based on who has first pick or some sort of average/grading system should be used because the difference between some of these riders is huge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aces51 Posted May 31, 2015 Report Share Posted May 31, 2015 The problem is the FTR system is really an asset system, if you have good contracted riders you can hold on to them, which means if you finish bottom of the league one year despite having the first pick the next still end up with almost no choices because the other seven or eight clubs have already protected the Garrity's and Newman's of this world. It should either be a free for all which means any FTR rider can be drafted to any track based on who has first pick or some sort of average/grading system should be used because the difference between some of these riders is huge. It was worse than that this year. Clubs could protect a rider they had used the previous year even if he wasn't an asset ie.Garrity at Coventry which, as I have pointed out before meant the advantage they gained from first pick in 2014 carried on through to 2015 despite the fact they had finished much higher up in 2014. The continuation of that formula will mean very few tier one riders will be available for the bottom club to choose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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