*JJ Posted January 8, 2016 Report Share Posted January 8, 2016 hope not . Formula 2 engines are just as expensive as speedway engines to maintain , they dont ride properly . and on achieving a moderate level of competence ,a whole load of new expense and a new learning curve has to be adopted switching to proper speedway equipment . budget cost engines of a sutiable nature are still available , they are called 2 valve Jawas You can buy a pre-owned 4 valve Jawa bike for about £1000, or a GM for £1500. 'F2' bikes are a dead letter; apart from the factors above, the ones I have seen are much more complicated than an ordinary speedway machine, and have a radiator! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piston197 Posted January 8, 2016 Report Share Posted January 8, 2016 (edited) Variable valve timing by centrifugal force , whatever next ? If you have ever had a BTH magneto off a Triumph, you will find on the auto advance there is a very similar system, albeit a bit cruder, on the ATD ( automatic timing device) to advance ignition timing according to revs, just looks like a more sophisticated version on the end of the cam shafts. nothing new just another use for an existing principle . Old idea , new application ! When the Japanese came out with their posi-lube automatic oil injection systems it was only a revamp of what Villiers did on their two strokes in 1927, and the Bradshaw designed , oil cooled 350cc engine of the early 1920's pre-dated the oil cooled Suzukis by nearly 60 years. Edited January 8, 2016 by piston197 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedibee Posted January 8, 2016 Report Share Posted January 8, 2016 Variable valve timing by centrifugal force , whatever next ? If you have ever had a BTH magneto off a Triumph, you will find on the auto advance there is a very similar system, albeit a bit cruder, on the ATD ( automatic timing device) to advance ignition timing according to revs, just looks like a more sophisticated version on the end of the cam shafts. nothing new just another use for an existing principle . Old idea , new application ! When the Japanese came out with their posi-lube automatic oil injection systems it was only a revamp of what Villiers did on their two strokes in 1927, and the Bradshaw designed , oil cooled 350cc engine of the early 1920's pre-dated the oil cooled Suzukis by nearly 60 years. reading that blurb , it said centripetal , is that just a posh way of saying centrifugal ? . not sure if speedways rules on engines have the same loophole TBH . I know the Ignition timing is supposed to be fixed , but modern boxes advance and retard automatically ,and speedway machine examiners dont have the technology to know whetehr its being used or not 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CS18 Posted January 8, 2016 Report Share Posted January 8, 2016 reading that blurb , it said centripetal , is that just a posh way of saying centrifugal ? . not sure if speedways rules on engines have the same loophole TBH . I know the Ignition timing is supposed to be fixed , but modern boxes advance and retard automatically ,and speedway machine examiners dont have the technology to know whetehr its being used or not In very simple terms, centripetal force is inward, centrifugal force is outward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedibee Posted January 8, 2016 Report Share Posted January 8, 2016 In very simple terms, centripetal force is inward, centrifugal force is outward. Thank you . learn something new every day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sommelier Posted January 9, 2016 Report Share Posted January 9, 2016 Variable valve timing by centrifugal force , whatever next ? If you have ever had a BTH magneto off a Triumph, you will find on the auto advance there is a very similar system, albeit a bit cruder, on the ATD ( automatic timing device) to advance ignition timing according to revs, just looks like a more sophisticated version on the end of the cam shafts. nothing new just another use for an existing principle . Old idea , new application ! When the Japanese came out with their posi-lube automatic oil injection systems it was only a revamp of what Villiers did on their two strokes in 1927, and the Bradshaw designed , oil cooled 350cc engine of the early 1920's pre-dated the oil cooled Suzukis by nearly 60 years. Variable cam timing, Alfa Romeo & Honda have had that on prouction cars for donkeys years! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erniew Posted January 9, 2016 Report Share Posted January 9, 2016 Would anyone like to guess how many riders have purchased Gerhard engines to use in the 2016 season? Simple question, As a Newcastle Diamonds supporter, it will be interesting to see if Robert Lambert uses them in the PL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Countershaftcounter Posted January 9, 2016 Report Share Posted January 9, 2016 The elephant in the room over 26 pages on this is that no one has yet mentioned a definitive price yet. Why so scared ? They know how much it has cost to get them to this point, or are they just trying to work out the maximum price they can sell it for ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erniew Posted January 9, 2016 Report Share Posted January 9, 2016 The price was set before Christmas. More expensive to buy than a GM but cheaper overall for a season if you take servicing into account. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Smith Posted January 9, 2016 Report Share Posted January 9, 2016 What may scare buyers at the moment is the fact Harris and Lambert had an engine go pop. The service intervals may be few and far between, but what's a blown engines repair bill going to be?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Skid Posted January 9, 2016 Report Share Posted January 9, 2016 How does just over £5,000 sound, but of course you need at least two, one for your two race bikes, don't think Mr.GM's for much to worry about. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sings4Speedway Posted January 11, 2016 Report Share Posted January 11, 2016 Exactly. Although most likely to be 3 engines, one for each bike and one spare that can be put in when another is being serviced and that is based on a rider doing one league only...... Plus who can service these engines? Gerhard only? How much would it cost to ship to him? How long would the turn around time be? Whilst the GM's may be far from perfect the monopoly looks certain to continue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted January 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2016 (edited) Exactly. Although most likely to be 3 engines, one for each bike and one spare that can be put in when another is being serviced and that is based on a rider doing one league only...... Plus who can service these engines? Gerhard only? How much would it cost to ship to him? How long would the turn around time be? Whilst the GM's may be far from perfect the monopoly looks certain to continue. The idea is the bikes don't need servicing. It's you buy two engines, plonk them in your frames out of the box and race them until next winter just changing the oil and basic maintained. Yes a greater cost to buy one but it doesn't need tuning before you race it and doesn't need servicing every few meetings so over a season you only spend what it cost to buy 2 engines. At least thats how I remember it being "sold". Edited January 11, 2016 by SCB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Posted January 11, 2016 Report Share Posted January 11, 2016 So I've been told there is a better quality jrm/jawa engine on its way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Skid Posted January 11, 2016 Report Share Posted January 11, 2016 If only it were true SCB, no chance. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedibee Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 The idea is the bikes don't need servicing. It's you buy two engines, plonk them in your frames out of the box and race them until next winter just changing the oil and basic maintained. Yes a greater cost to buy one but it doesn't need tuning before you race it and doesn't need servicing every few meetings so over a season you only spend what it cost to buy 2 engines. At least thats how I remember it being "sold". GM's and Jawas are like Inkjet printers. lose a bit on the initial purchase make a fortune out of replacement parts . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Countershaftcounter Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 so if i buy three engines and one goes bang….. where do i send it to be repaired / do most suppliers have a large supply of parts ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Skid Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 You send it to PJR, it comes back twice as fast, but you have to win every race to be able afford it's upkeeo 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fourentee Posted January 15, 2016 Report Share Posted January 15, 2016 Would anyone like to guess how many riders have purchased Gerhard engines to use in the 2016 season? Freddie Lindgren will have two for Britain, two for Sweden/Poland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Skid Posted January 17, 2016 Report Share Posted January 17, 2016 And Freddie will have his GM's ready to slot back in if/when he gets blown away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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