Halifaxtiger Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 As a new promotion I would be speaking directly to the immigration authorities. All this 'he said' 'they said' crap is just covering up negligence. Sheffield signed the rider. Sheffield didn't ensure they knew the full picture. Sheffield are at fault. I agree with your view but as far as I am aware Sheffield were fully aware of the situation all along and simply tried to buck the system. Totally their fault and what's worse they will merely reinforce any view that the UKVI hold that speedway promotions cannot be trusted at all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Third Man Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 Any information I am given that is not to be put in the public domain I do not use in a public place to imply I know something someone else doesn't or to try and demean without being able to provide the proof That's common decency I am afraid but also anyone in this thread is only commenting on what is in the public domain, none of us know the full facts, and we never will unless all the parties involved disclose all they know. so we are commenting on what someone has been told, as presumably none of us were party to the actual discussions between the rider / promotion / BSPA, be it the truth or not Everything that needs to be known is in the public domain. Proctor didn't meet the requirements for a new visa. End of story. Anything else is just trying to deflect the blame. can you name your sources, the ones who were present at all the meetings who have told you ALL the facts, or would they rather not be named? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 but also anyone in this thread is only commenting on what is in the public domain, none of us know the full facts, and we never will unless all the parties involved disclose all they know. so we are commenting on what someone has been told, as presumably none of us were party to the actual discussions between the rider / promotion / BSPA, be it the truth or not can you name your sources, the ones who were present at all the meetings who have told you ALL the facts, or would they rather not be named? But the relevant rules are all in the public domain. If proctor was granted - or believed he was granted - special exemption surely both he and Sheffield would make sure they got it in writing from ukvi.If they did I'm sure we would have heard by now as they would have grounds to appeal. If not then we don't need any additional information, or to have attended meetings, to know where the blame lies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lioness Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 the problem is some people do get told information that is not in the public domain and cant say anything because of who told them others discuss the rights and wrongs of what is in the public domain that's life I am afraid but also anyone in this thread is only commenting on what is in the public domain, none of us know the full facts, and we never will unless all the parties involved disclose all they know. so we are commenting on what someone has been told, as presumably none of us were party to the actual discussions between the rider / promotion / BSPA, be it the truth or not can you name your sources, the ones who were present at all the meetings who have told you ALL the facts, or would they rather not be named? Anyone else see the irony in these two posts? Lol. Point missed methinks. You claim to have privileged info but 'can't disclose, can't say anything' (other than of course to imply that you are in the know and put across you should not be questioned) but want others to have sources and disclose them for their opinions! And even though others are pointing out how they have formed their OPINIONS you still try to stick with the 'name your sources' line pmsl 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halifaxtiger Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 can you name your sources, the ones who were present at all the meetings who have told you ALL the facts, or would they rather not be named? I'm certainly not naming my source on a public forum. SCB responded to this point rather eloquently earlier. As he said, its a matter of trust. I have crossed swords with Bewitcher a couple of times but I have never had cause to suspect that he entirely fabricates the circumstances he states or embellishes them to any degree for malicious or spiteful ends. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWitcher Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 can you name your sources, the ones who were present at all the meetings who have told you ALL the facts, or would they rather not be named? Yes, it's really very simple. For a rider to be given a new visa, he requires to have achieved a rolling average of 7 or above. Source, the rules as per the BSPA site. Proctor didn't achieve it and therefore has been rejected for a new visa.. Source, UK Immigration, this thread, Sheffield Speedway and the fact he is on his way out of the country! That is it. There is no need for any other source. What anyone may or may not have said is completely and utterly irrelevant. All that matters is what is in writing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Najjer Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 I agree with your view but as far as I am aware Sheffield were fully aware of the situation all along and simply tried to buck the system. Totally their fault and what's worse they will merely reinforce any view that the UKVI hold that speedway promotions cannot be trusted at all. What makes it even worse, is that somebody said earlier in the thread that Sheffield were singled out for praise at the start of the year for their understanding of the visa workings, apparently - looks like they have egg on their faces now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mooose Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 At last Thursday's meeting, the announcer said something along the lines of Sheffield being given duff information by a 3rd party which led to this situation. Unfortunately the announcer was somewhat coy about the specifics, so we were all left wondering what the information was, who gave it, and whether this same person may have given 'duff' information to other promotions / riders. I appreciate a number of people on the forum are clearly better informed than I am and I think I now understand why Ty was refused a renewal to his Visa (although I don't agree with the decision). I can now attempt to explain to my daughter why her favourite rider has left the country. Hopefully no other riders / teams suffer the same fate during the season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spin king Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 At last Thursday's meeting, the announcer said something along the lines of Sheffield being given duff information by a 3rd party which led to this situation. Unfortunately the announcer was somewhat coy about the specifics, so we were all left wondering what the information was, who gave it, and whether this same person may have given 'duff' information to other promotions / riders. I appreciate a number of people on the forum are clearly better informed than I am and I think I now understand why Ty was refused a renewal to his Visa (although I don't agree with the decision). I can now attempt to explain to my daughter why her favourite rider has left the country. Hopefully no other riders / teams suffer the same fate during the season. I was not at the meeting this Thursday, but I am told that the the announcement was made as you have stated. Privately I have my own suspicions and theories as to what has happened, and private is where it will stay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screm Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Having signed for Workington, does Mathew Wethers have the same kind of time as Proctor to get his 7pt average. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Having signed for Workington, does Mathew Wethers have the same kind of time as Proctor to get his 7pt average. 12 months? Like all work permit riders? As it is I'm sure I read Matty Wethers has GB citizenship or right to remain here or something like that, rather than a work permit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Blobby Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) 12 months? Like all work permit riders? As it is I'm sure I read Matty Wethers has GB citizenship or right to remain here or something like that, rather than a work permit. Correct Matty now has British citizenship. Edited May 17, 2015 by Mr Blobby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Correct Matty now has British citizenship. Then he shouldn't have to worry about Visas any more. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackadder Posted May 19, 2015 Report Share Posted May 19, 2015 From the Sheffield Star. Damien Bates has paid tribute to Aussie ace Ty Proctor who has arrived back in his home country. Tigers were rocked last week when they were told Proctor had failed to meet the criteria for a working visa and had to leave the UK. It has left a sour taste in the mouth of club boss Bates, who says he received mixed messages over the matter. “It’s a week down the line and I’m still fuming about it,” he said. “As a club we were comfortable with everything. We had done everything correctly in accordance with the advice we had been given from high-ranking officials within the sport. “It’s a disgrace, quite honestly, but there is nothing we can do about it now and the lad is now back home in Australia with his career in tatters. “The sad part about it all is that he has done a good job for the team. He’s had his injury problems, but this season he has been in the points and doing a great job. “To then be told he has to go back to Australia is terrible, and I feel for the lad because he’s put his heart and soul into the situation.” Bates admits he has no option but to cast an eye towards the end of this month and a potential replacement - as well as taking a view on the Simon Stead injury situation. “We will have to look at what options may or may not become available,” said Bates. “It’s not easy at the moment, but we will get through to the end of next week and see what we can do with the team.” Sheffield host Edinburgh this Thursday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted May 19, 2015 Report Share Posted May 19, 2015 (edited) It has left a sour taste in the mouth of club boss Bates, who says he received mixed messages over the matter. Yet he chose to listen to the message that suited him? Edited May 19, 2015 by SCB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted May 19, 2015 Report Share Posted May 19, 2015 Yet he chose to head the message that suited him?And not get anything in writing from the body whose opinion mattered? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Najjer Posted May 20, 2015 Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 (edited) “It’s a disgrace, quite honestly, but there is nothing we can do about it now and the lad is now back home in Australia with his career in tatters. Hardly - he just has to ride in the State Championships in the winter and meet the correct criteria, this time. Edited May 20, 2015 by Najjer 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lewy Posted May 20, 2015 Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 Hardly - he just has to ride in the State Championships in the winter and meet the correct criteria, this time. just like jack holder and ryan fisher do i suppose najjer;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD Posted May 20, 2015 Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 Hardly - he just has to ride in the State Championships in the winter and meet the correct criteria, this time. Which are probably going to be the most competitive Aussie State Championships of all time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dontforgetthefueltapsbruv Posted May 20, 2015 Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 Which are probably going to be the most competitive Aussie State Championships of all time! or the complete opposite! wink Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.