3 2 1 0 1 2 3 4 Point System

[SCB]

I thought there was another issue why they changed the points system, because the old one benefited those teams with a big home advantage. ie Poole

So more clubs should build teams that are good at home. But then you lose away and are less likely to get the 4 points (rather than 3 for a home meeting) available to you.

[Barrycuda]

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Edited June 2, 2015 by Barrycuda

[Trees]

So more clubs should build teams that are good at home. But then you lose away and are less likely to get the 4 points (rather than 3 for a home meeting) available to you.

But it is unfair if a team win more at home but by 6 or less but fail to finish top of the league! A win is a win.I understand what you are saying but the above is an issue too.

[waiheke1]

Plenty of other sports have similar systems - rugby, cricket even football's away goal rule. Agree fully with scbs op.

[SteveLyric2]

I thought there was another issue why they changed the points system, because the old one benefited those teams with a big home advantage. ie Poole

[SCB]

But it is unfair if a team win more at home but by 6 or less but fail to finish top of the league! A win is a win.I understand what you are saying but the above is an issue too.

But a win is not a win if it's agreed you get more for bigger wins

 

That was my initial reaction to Poole having a big home advantage but having checked it, amazingly, in the EL, after Eastbourne they have the 2nd biggest home advantage over the last 5 years assuming you take home scores as a % of away scores. Lynn and Wolves that are generally considered trick/difficult tracks though are quite low down!

[SteveLyric2]

But a win is not a win if it's agreed you get more for bigger wins

 

That was my initial reaction to Poole having a big home advantage but having checked it, amazingly, in the EL, after Eastbourne they have the 2nd biggest home advantage over the last 5 years assuming you take home scores as a % of away scores. Lynn and Wolves that are generally considered trick/difficult tracks though are quite low down!

Mainly due to the strength of the team rather than the track then!! Are Poole the best away side over that same period too?

Edited April 27, 2015 by Skidder1

[Trees]

But a win is not a win if it's agreed you get more for bigger wins

 

That was my initial reaction to Poole having a big home advantage but having checked it, amazingly, in the EL, after Eastbourne they have the 2nd biggest home advantage over the last 5 years assuming you take home scores as a % of away scores. Lynn and Wolves that are generally considered trick/difficult tracks though are quite low down!

But you don't get more for a big win at home you get the same this season.

 

Ha re Poole and their home track advantage, of course their bumpy, holey, slick old track creates loads of advantage

[Barrycuda]

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Edited June 2, 2015 by Barrycuda

[SCB]

Mainly due to the strength of the team rather than the track then!! Are Poole the best away side over that same period too?

This is why I hate discussing maths on here. You score more point at home as a % of your away scores. What is difficult to grasp about that? You score about 28% more (can't remember the exactly figure now but I looked it up last night to laugh at Trees suggestion) at home than you do at away meetings, that's more than any other team apart from Eastbourne in recent years.

 

It basically says if you scored 40 in an away meeting, you'd be likely to score 51 at home.

[BWitcher]

This is why I hate discussing maths on here. You score more point at home as a % of your away scores. What is difficult to grasp about that? You score about 28% more (can't remember the exactly figure now but I looked it up last night to laugh at Trees suggestion) at home than you do at away meetings, that's more than any other team apart from Eastbourne in recent years.

 

It basically says if you scored 40 in an away meeting, you'd be likely to score 51 at home.

 

So essentially Eastbourne has the biggest differential between home performance and away... followed by Poole.

[SCB]

 

So essentially Eastbourne has the biggest differential between home performance and away... followed by Poole.

Correct. If it was based solely on points scored at home, Poole would be top - but that wouldn't be fair because they could in theory score 70 at every away track and 55 at every home meeting.

[Daniel Smith]

Think it's shown with tonight's sky meeting that Belle Vue got their required points early on and fell asleep, almost allowing King's Lynn back in to a point.

[SCB]

Lynn were never going to get a point once the TR had failed!! Probably one of the worst meetings to use to prove this point

[Grachan]

Lynn were never going to get a point once the TR had failed!! Probably one of the worst meetings to use to prove this point

To be fair, the scored a 5-1 in heat 13 and then led out the gate in heat 14, which did leave a brief moment of wonder of they could get a point.

 

But who cares? It means nothing to hardly anyone in the stadium because the home team wouldn't lose one.

 

The reasoning for dropping it is not a good one. There are some strange scorings about though. Rugby Union is very odd. If you look at the league table it bears no relation whatsover to the matches won, lost or drawn.

 

That's because you get an extra pont if you score 4 or more tries plus and extra point for losing by 7 (I think) or less. And if you go to a match there's no announcements at all about it. It's just assumed that you know.

 

So it's not just Speedway. But there used to be a symmetry to it, which has been lost.

Edited April 28, 2015 by grachan

[Sir Sidney]

The reasoning for dropping it is not a good one. There are some strange scorings about though. Rugby Union is very odd. If you look at the league table it bears no relation whatsover to the matches won, lost or drawn.

 

That's because you get an extra pont if you score 4 or more tries plus and extra point for losing by 7 (I think) or less. And if you go to a match there's no announcements at all about it. It's just assumed that you know.

 

So it's not just Speedway. But there used to be a symmetry to it, which has been lost.

Not entirely true. If you look at the rugby Premiership table http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/english-premiership/table it bears a very close similarity to the relationship between matches won, drawn or lost - the bonus points only split the teams who have won the same amount of matches.

[jenga]

and here,s what you could have won!!

[Grachan]

Not entirely true. If you look at the rugby Premiership table http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/english-premiership/table it bears a very close similarity to the relationship between matches won, drawn or lost - the bonus points only split the teams who have won the same amount of matches.

That may well be the case, but that's not my issue.

 

I went to a rugby match recently and looked at the league table on the Aviva Premiership website. It showed no mention of bonus points.

 

There was no relationship with the matches won drawn and lost and the match points. It was quite difficult to find out how it worked too.

[Sir Sidney]

That may well be the case, but that's not my issue.

 

I went to a rugby match recently and looked at the league table on the Aviva Premiership website. It showed no mention of bonus points.

 

There was no relationship with the matches won drawn and lost and the match points. It was quite difficult to find out how it worked too.

It's a shame you found it difficult to find out how the system worked or that the club didn't provide the info - I'm sure that if you had asked someone around you they would have been only too happy to explain - usually a very friendly lot, just like speedway. Obviously I can't say what was on the website when you looked but it's fairly clear and well explained now http://www.premiershiprugby.com/matchcentre/tables/aviva_premiership_table.php#gCZ0hcjfKJStIlbC.97

 

I think rugby union has got plenty of more difficult things to explain to casual observers that the match points issue, but that's not for a speedway forum. Where there are parallels though are in what the majority of casual observers need to know or are interested in and whether that is different to regular and committed supporters.

 

As someone who lost his speedway club a number of years ago I probably count as a casual observer at speedway now. I probably go to no more than 5 meetings a year now rather than more than 50 a year in the past and don't follow any particular team. As such I've very little interest in the match points outcome, only worrying about the quality of the racing. Before my club closed I had an involvement in encouraging new supporters via promotions to schools and I can say that people were encouraged to return based on whether they found the racing exciting rather than the result. It was only once they were hooked and had an alliegance that they worried about that. What's that got to do with this thread? We'll I'd say speedway often creates more problems than it solves by tinkering with rules, simplicity and clarity often work best and until the speedway authorities manage to crack how to attract a whole new generation of supporters they can ill afford to confuse or allienate those that they have.

[Grachan]

It's a shame you found it difficult to find out how the system worked or that the club didn't provide the info - I'm sure that if you had asked someone around you they would have been only too happy to explain - usually a very friendly lot, just like speedway. Obviously I can't say what was on the website when you looked but it's fairly clear and well explained now http://www.premiershiprugby.com/matchcentre/tables/aviva_premiership_table.php#gCZ0hcjfKJStIlbC.97

 

I think rugby union has got plenty of more difficult things to explain to casual observers that the match points issue, but that's not for a speedway forum. Where there are parallels though are in what the majority of casual observers need to know or are interested in and whether that is different to regular and committed supporters.

 

As someone who lost his speedway club a number of years ago I probably count as a casual observer at speedway now. I probably go to no more than 5 meetings a year now rather than more than 50 a year in the past and don't follow any particular team. As such I've very little interest in the match points outcome, only worrying about the quality of the racing. Before my club closed I had an involvement in encouraging new supporters via promotions to schools and I can say that people were encouraged to return based on whether they found the racing exciting rather than the result. It was only once they were hooked and had an alliegance that they worried about that. What's that got to do with this thread? We'll I'd say speedway often creates more problems than it solves by tinkering with rules, simplicity and clarity often work best and until the speedway authorities manage to crack how to attract a whole new generation of supporters they can ill afford to confuse or allienate those that they have.

It's ok. I found it out in the end anyway!

 

With regards speedway scoring, a lot of people say it's just about the racing. But it's not just that for me. it's about so much more than that.

 

There's averages, scoring, tactical moves etc, plus match scores. These are a very big part of the sport. Some people might like that it's 4 blokes with no brakes on an oval circuit, but to a lot of people who see it as that it is the reason it becomes boring.

 

What really got me into speedway was the maths of it. Sure, I love the racing, but as a teenager it was all the nerdy stuff that went with it that really drew me in.

Edited April 29, 2015 by grachan