The White Knight Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Why? How about Ove Fundin 1960? Or Peter Craven 1962? Whilst I think that over all I would put Ivan Mauger as the best. But during my deliberations, Peter Craven, Barry Briggs and Fred Williams all came a very close second. I just thought that with all his Speedway Titles, Long Track Titles and his all round professionalism Mauger, for me, was the ultimate Speedway Rider. I reiterate that my all time favourite Rider though was 'Briggo'. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OveFundinFan Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 For 10 years on the trot Ove Fundin finished 1,2 or 3 in the world, he then missed a year but came back in 1967 to win again. As "one Meeting" world championships that takes some doing and some beating. "Mr Perpetual Motion" was his title. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grachan Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) Why? How about Ove Fundin 1960? Or Peter Craven 1962? Before my time. Couldn't possibly comment. But Hans Nielsen's 12.00 league average away from home that year makes the 1986 Hansy a pretty good contender in any era. I'm not sure I follow grachan's reasoning. In what way? Edited January 26, 2015 by grachan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norbold Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Whilst I think that over all I would put Ivan Mauger as the best. But during my deliberations, Peter Craven, Barry Briggs and Fred Williams all came a very close second. I just thought that with all his Speedway Titles, Long Track Titles and his all round professionalism Mauger, for me, was the ultimate Speedway Rider. I reiterate that my all time favourite Rider though was 'Briggo'. Briggo possibly, but I am intrigued to know why you would put Freddie Williams and Peter Craven above Ove Fundin. See OveFundinFan's post above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Briggo possibly, but I am intrigued to know why you would put Freddie Williams and Peter Craven above Ove Fundin. See OveFundinFan's post above. I can only say that Fred Williams was a Rider I very much admired, both as a Rider and as a Man. A true gentleman. I know that has nothing to do with the Speedway Track but I was looking at the overall package. He, for me, deserves a place in my list of best Speedway Riders. Remember that both he and Peter Craven won the World Championship TWICE. I know that both of his Championships were won at Wembley where he rode, but you still have to win it - and Fred did - TWICE!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickthemuppet Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 I can only say that Fred Williams was a Rider I very much admired, both as a Rider and as a Man. A true gentleman. I know that has nothing to do with the Speedway Track but I was looking at the overall package. He, for me, deserves a place in my list of best Speedway Riders. Remember that both he and Peter Craven won the World Championship TWICE. I know that both of his Championships were won at Wembley where he rode, but you still have to win it - and Fred did - TWICE!!! Also Freddie Williams was a runner up to Peter Cravens third + he won three league championships in the top league. Then in league and cup matches they met in the region of 24 times and Freddie Williams won 75% of the races between them.. Although he won his two world titles at his home track he had to qualify on other tracks.as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Before my time. Couldn't possibly comment. But Hans Nielsen's 12.00 league average away from home that year makes the 1986 Hansy a pretty good contender in any era. In what way? I think you undersell your argument.world champ, world pairs chsmp, wtc chsmp, blrc champ, danish champ, nordic champ, top of test averages, highest ever bl average. It's a pretty good shout, only "blemish" would be runner up to erik in the ic final, and I guess only considered a 50/50 chance (with erik) heading into final. I think it's a pretty good srgument. I assume tge 2nd query surrounds the methodology, as to why you would use a single season peak as opposed to sustained excellence as your criteria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norbold Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Remember that both he and Peter Craven won the World Championship TWICE. I know that both of his Championships were won at Wembley where he rode, but you still have to win it - and Fred did - TWICE!!! But Ove Fundin won the championship FIVE times and was in the first three for TEN consecutive years!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 But Ove Fundin won the championship FIVE times and was in the first three for TEN consecutive years!!!!!I'd find it hard to justify anyone being included in the top five ahead of mauger, briggs, fundin, nielsen and t rick.personally, I'd say craven may make the top 10 (outside the top 5 id say you have olsen craven moore pc x2 gundersen penhall j crump all battling for places), williams I would have behind all of those plus the likes of pedersen, hancock and possibly others. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OveFundinFan Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Re Ove Fundin, apart from being in the top 3 world championship for 10 consecutive years and winning 5 times in 15 appearances over 16 years............ he also represented Sweden in the World Team Championship for 11 consecutive years, being in the winning team 6 times and runner up spot 3 times. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norbold Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 I'd find it hard to justify anyone being included in the top five ahead of mauger, briggs, fundin, nielsen and t rick. personally, I'd say craven may make the top 10 (outside the top 5 id say you have olsen craven moore pc x2 gundersen penhall j crump all battling for places), williams I would have behind all of those plus the likes of pedersen, hancock and possibly others. I'd go along with that mostly. The other two I think worth considering would be Bluey Wilkinson and Jack Young. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grachan Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 I assume tge 2nd query surrounds the methodology, as to why you would use a single season peak as opposed to sustained excellence as your criteria. Maybe. I just thought it might be fun to take it in another direction. Another one would be - best Wold champion in terms of World final dominance on the night itself. But then we're into Egon Muller territory! For me,using that in terms of World final performances in my time, then it's: 1) Anders Michanek 1974 2) Egon muller 1983 3) Bruce Penhall 1981. Well, it makes a change from greatest of all time, doesn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 Maybe. I just thought it might be fun to take it in another direction. Another one would be - best Wold champion in terms of World final dominance on the night itself. But then we're into Egon Muller territory! For me,using that in terms of World final performances in my time, then it's: 1) Anders Michanek 1974 2) Egon muller 1983 3) Bruce Penhall 1981. Well, it makes a change from greatest of all time, doesn't it? hans in 89 surely deserves a spot on that basis - utterly comprehensive, albeit agsinst a somewhat sub standard lineup.olsen in 71? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grachan Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 hans in 89 surely deserves a spot on that basis - utterly comprehensive, albeit agsinst a somewhat sub standard lineup. olsen in 71? Funny thing is I can't really recall Hans in 89. Maybe this was during the time when the World Final wasn't on TV so it less of an impact on me. "My time" begins in 1974, (plus video evidence of the two before that)! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Central Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 Maybe. I just thought it might be fun to take it in another direction.Another one would be - best Wold champion in terms of World final dominance on the night itself. But then we're into Egon Muller territory! For me,using that in terms of World final performances in my time, then it's:1) Anders Michanek 19742) Egon muller 19833) Bruce Penhall 1981.Well, it makes a change from greatest of all time, doesn't it? Using your, rather unusual criteria, the top two look worthy of their place. But Nielsen in 1989 is a contender as already stated. But then surely Jan O in 91 merits a slot? A tyre width either way, in a couple of races, in 81 and Brucey may not even have won. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norbold Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 Mauger 1968? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickthemuppet Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 Looking back on other individuals sports you will find many outstanding sportsman like Phil Taylor is surely the best dart player. Then you move on to Tennis there are Roger Federer on Grass ,Rapha Nadal on clay and probably Novac Djokovic as the best all round player of all. If you watch the 1970/80's Wimbledon finals they look no better than a club match today Then in Swimming there is Michael Phelps with 18 Gold Medals. and Usain Bolt in Athletics. I think nobody would disagree the Ronnie O'Sullivan is the best snooker player ever. What do they all have in common. They are all very modern Then we come to Speedway . I would dismiss any riders from the 1930's where riders could just about do 40 mph. I would also leave out riders from the 1960/1970's My original choice of best rider was Ivan Mauger who was voted Rider of the Millenium. Then with a little research I have to say Greg Hancock without any hesitation. He is now entering his 27th year of Speedway and is currently the reigning world champion and is fancied to possibly win it again. He has won 18 finals at GP level .and made 79 finals. He has won league titles in four different countries compared to many choices on here like Ivan Mauger who never ever rode in a foreign league. Nobody in Speedway has won as many awards as he has, so he is my choice of best world champion ever 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sommelier Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 I think you undersell your argument. world champ, world pairs chsmp, wtc chsmp, blrc champ, danish champ, nordic champ, top of test averages, highest ever bl average. It's a pretty good shout, only "blemish" would be runner up to erik in the ic final, and I guess only considered a 50/50 chance (with erik) heading into final. I think it's a pretty good srgument. I assume tge 2nd query surrounds the methodology, as to why you would use a single season peak as opposed to sustained excellence as your criteria. Highest ever bl average? don't ask me why but I have got in my head that Michanek had the highest average in 1973, but I may be wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 I would dismiss any riders from the 1930's where riders could just about do 40 mph. I would also leave out riders from the 1960/1970's I think most of the comments in regard to this thread are within your timespan? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucifer sam Posted January 28, 2015 Report Share Posted January 28, 2015 (edited) I think nobody would disagree the Ronnie O'Sullivan is the best snooker player ever. Nope, Hendry by a country mile. O'Sullivan has always been erratic, whereas Hendry was almost unbeatable for most of the 90s, winning tournament after tournament, year after year. Jimmy White played brilliant snooker in the '92 and '94 world championships, but still couldn't dislodge the impossibly-consistent Hendry. As for speedway, much harder to judge. How on earth do you separate Wilkinson from Duggan (never World champ but won the '48 equivalent) from Young from Fundin from Mauger from Nielsen from Rickardsson from Hancock? The machinery has changed too much to tell. All the best Rob Funny thing is I can't really recall Hans in 89. Maybe this was during the time when the World Final wasn't on TV so it less of an impact on me. "My time" begins in 1974, (plus video evidence of the two before that)! Muller was deserving champ in '83, but it was only Nielsen's e/f in Heat 19 that allowed him to score the full maximum. Mich in 1974, Olsen in 1975, Nielsen in 1989 and Jan O in 1991 were all more dominant performances in finals that exist on video. All the best Rob Highest ever bl average? don't ask me why but I have got in my head that Michanek had the highest average in 1973, but I may be wrong. Some research 3 or 4 of us did a few years ago. Highest-ever top-flight league averages: 1. Nielsen 11.83 (1986) 2. Nielsen 11.73 (1987) 3. Fundin 11.60 (1958) 4. Michanek 11.55 (1973) 5. Duggan 11.54 (1947) 6. Mauger 11.53* (1969) *widely reported as 11.74, but two tapes exclusions were accidentally excluded from the figures. All the best Rob Edited January 28, 2015 by lucifer sam 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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