Warsaw Gp Saturday 18th April

[BWitcher]

So why didn't they just improvise, see my post again...

 

I've read your post and as usual it makes no sense.

 

You agree its quite easy to run a meeting on a green light start.. indeed we saw that.. but you disagree that it had any impact upon the riders??

 

The riders kicked off about it, tried to stop the meeting at the point the green light start was being used.. from there, they were just waiting for an excuse.

 

Fortunately, the unfit Batchelor, who shouldn't have been allowed on track in the first place provided it for them.

[Starman2006]

 

batch has stated he was unfit and couldn't hold onto the bike properly.. so his opinion is redundant. He should not have been on the track and was endangering the lives of others by doing so.

You were talking about the start gate, stop changing the post to suit yourself.

 

I've read your post and as usual it makes no sense.

 

 

Nah it wouldn't do would it. read it S L O W L Y... I suppose like Gavan, you wasn't old enough either to remember the Billy Janeiro situation, worked well , no problem there. its called improvising.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Starman2006

[tocha]

The track was more then rideable, it was raceable - as demonstrated by the 12 heats run.

The reffereing was questionable right from heat one. Heat one with Batch could have gone either way but after that it went downwards.

The starting gate - a shambles. Cant believe no backup. As already said there must be something more up to date then having tapes wafting about. Transponders like F1 and Moto GP already in use and work, so why not speedway. The green light system seemed to work very well anyway.

 

Plus point - Harris performance. I was very critical of him last year and I stick by that - he should not have been in the 2014 GP series the way he rode. But Saturday was different. I never saw him in his "good years" but Sat. he gated, raced, passed....the full monty. Just hope he can keep it up.

 

To those who say they not going to Cardiff because of Saturday..... have no worries, they dare not get Cardiff wrong this year, and if they can get it right at Cardiff then that sets the stage for all other indoor meetings.

 

And I reckon there could be a chance for anyone on the forum who fancies taking on temporary track preparation, if heads must roll it seems arguably the most popular one to go is Ole Olsen. Anyone fancy starting a new business in track preparation?

 

And very possibly there has not been many statements form the various organisations involved with Saturdays event because every word spoken/printed will be examined by lawyers. Its just like being involved in a road accident - you are advised to never admit guilt. The legal guys will already be working on this because I reckon there will be serious consequences following last Saturdays let down.

I'm sure Len Silver would give it a go. First instruction, TURN OFF ALL THE STOP-COCKS!

[Starman2006]

 

batch has stated he was unfit and couldn't hold onto the bike properly.. so his opinion is redundant. He should not have been on the track and was endangering the lives of others by doing so.

But he still rode it, so that gives him a slight advantage over you and your brother Gavan, I would say... As for the start gate, please read my post again, S L O W L Y..

[The White Knight]

Point one - no it wasn't, the riders deemed it unsafe, and they're the best placed to judge

 

Point two - the entire GP problem since its inception, and the effect on UK speedway, is Ole Olsen, no-one else

Point One - 100% CORRECT!!

 

Point Two - 100% CORRECT!!

 

Great Post.

[E I Addio]

Obviously Paul Bellamy has just published exactly what he was dictated by IMG's lawyers.

It is meant to be a statement that deals with the need for him to say something, whilst actually not saying anything at all.

 

Clearly legal action is likely to follow, in more than one direction I imagine.

So that is all he can do at this stage.

 

The two points I would raise are:

 

1) Does this not highlight the folly of the 'set up' we have with shared, mixed and, indeed interwoven, responsibilities.

The mix of PZM, BSI, FIM and SpeedSport could now be a lawyers wet dream.

 

2) How are subsequent GPs to be run later in the year if the riders have the final say over the track; and yet only Ole is allowed to build it?

And even one that is relatively OK gets cancelled just because no one has big enough balls to handle prima donnas.

 

.

 

Nothing wrong with the set-up per se. Other sports around the world manage similar when TV is involved, but like any other organisational arrangement it depends on people doing their jobs efficiently. We saw for a start Jim Lawrence was not the sharpest tool in the box and hopefully we won't see him in charge of a GP ( or an EL meeting) for a long time. Tony Steele lost his credibility at the Pool/Belle Vue rain off a couple of years ago and he hardly restored it in Warsaw.

 

If we put to one side our differing opinions on the track for a moment the situation seems to be this:-

 

The FIM jury apparently accepted the track as being in a fit state to race and at heat 12 they decided it was not fit to race so one of the following scenarios must apply-

 

1. Either the FIM accepted the track as fit when it wasn't or

2. They decided at heat 12 that the track was unfit when it still was or

3. the track was so poorly prepared that it went from being fit to unfit in the space of 12 heats which presumably hangs the blame round Olsens neck.

 

I find it increasingly difficult to see how the buck does not ultimately stop with the FIM jury even if they managed to hang part of the blame on someone else.

Edited April 20, 2015 by E I Addio

[Grand Central]

 

Nothing wrong with the set-up per se. Other sports around the world manage similar when TV is involved, but like any other organisational arrangement it depends on people doing their jobs efficiently. We saw for a start Jim Lawrence was not the sharpest tool in the box and hopefully we won't see him in charge of a GP ( or an EL meeting) for a long time. Tony Steele lost his credibility at the Pool/Belle Vue rain off a couple of years ago and he hardly restored it in Warsaw.

 

If we put to one side our differing opinions on the track for a moment the situation seems to be this:-

 

The FIM jury apparently accepted the track as being in a fit state to race and at heat 12 they decided it was not fit to race so one of the following scenarios must apply-

 

1. Either the FIM accepted the track as fit when it wasn't or

2. They decided at heat 12 that the track was unfit when it still was or

3. the track was so poorly prepared that it went from being fit to unfit in the space of 12 heats which presumably hangs the blame round Olsens neck.

 

I find it increasingly difficult to see how the buck does not ultimately stop with the FIM jury even if they managed to hang part of the blame on someone else.

 

If all parts of the Speedway world were staffed with persons of exemplary standard then situations like Saturday would not happen.

Or when they did the people involved would cope.

 

But we already know that that is not the case, truly don't we?

 

My god, my life following this sport has told me one thing above all others.

Do not expect too much of the people involved. Few of them are ever up to it.

 

One of the most glaring things that was clear on Saturday night was the total lack of crisis management.

Whatever the right and wrongs of each and every incident or area of dispute.

No one was in charge.

 

There was no one, no single person in the whole Stadium who could stop the spiral down the toilet, once it had started

Not one.

 

Pygmies.

The lot of 'em.

.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Grand Central

[stratton]

lol..

 

No it wasn't fact.. The meeting wasn't delayed, there was no riders meeting and guess what.. It wasn't postponed.

 

FFS

Dont get Assy take it on the chin!!

[spook]

So the backside covering has started and we have the interestingly synchronised Ole Olsen & Paul Bellamy passing the buck............... and i'm sure Paul Bellamy's statement would be going over a bit better if he hadnt waited 2 days while he consulted his lawyers first. It kind of questions how much genuine sentiment is involved.

A simple question please.............. how are the FIM jury supposed to know just how much a track will behave itself? Isnt that the job of the track curators? (the ones that BSI dictate should be used)

[stratton]

lol..

 

No it wasn't fact.. The meeting wasn't delayed, there was no riders meeting and guess what.. It wasn't postponed.

 

FFS

Dont get Assy take it on the chin!!

try reading my post properly not just choose things and twist things.

 

the track (as said by many on here) was NOT a disgrace which was my point

 

the evening descended into a disgrace due to the riders not wanting to race. Yes the starting tapes went wrong but i think the green light worked well made it a level playing field.

 

Feel free to comment on my posts but dont mix what im saying

Its not an opinion its fact

Fact, you don't know the meaning of the word, and as for the riders attitude you have not got a clue.You say you know Loram who is a real nice person and a world champ i am glad about that.My take is it is should of been a great event, a great stadium great crowd but the track and starting gate was poor.I know a few speedway riders would they be happy? with Saturday night ? i don't know would Mark be happy with that it was a poor show that was put on the other night.?

You were talking about the start gate, stop changing the post to suit yourself.

 

Nah it wouldn't do would it. read it S L O W L Y... I suppose like Gavan, you wasn't old enough either to remember the Billy Janeiro situation, worked well , no problem there. its called improvising.

Witcher can only remember Sudden Sam ride thats it,after all the times he has took the p...s. out of me supporting Martin Ashby yet he has never see the bloke ride!! Edited April 20, 2015 by sidney

[BWitcher]

You were talking about the start gate, stop changing the post to suit yourself.

Nah it wouldn't do would it. read it S L O W L Y... I suppose like Gavan, you wasn't old enough either to remember the Billy Janeiro situation, worked well , no problem there. its called improvising.

 

Here we go again.

 

WE KNOW IT WORKS WELL STARMAN.

 

That is the point we are making.

 

However what you seem to fail to grasp is that the RIDERS didn't agree. They held up the meeting to have a meeting about it.

[stratton]

Here we go again.

 

WE KNOW IT WORKS WELL STARMAN.

 

That is the point we are making.

 

However what you seem to fail to grasp is that the RIDERS didn't agree. They held up the meeting to have a meeting about it.

You can always go on Google Witcher!!

[g13webb]

WHAT meeting are you referring to?

 

The meeting, we were told about, by the TV commentators, that took place between the Riders and official, during the interval, where it was decided to call a halt to the proceedings....

 

That meeting.......

[PHILIPRISING]

So the backside covering has started and we have the interestingly synchronised Ole Olsen & Paul Bellamy passing the buck............... and i'm sure Paul Bellamy's statement would be going over a bit better if he hadnt waited 2 days while he consulted his lawyers first. It kind of questions how much genuine sentiment is involved.

 

A simple question please.............. how are the FIM jury supposed to know just how much a track will behave itself? Isnt that the job of the track curators? (the ones that BSI dictate should be used)

I'M sure Paul would have been instructed by his bosses not to say anything until the in-house IMG lawyers had been consulted. Standard procedure I imagine.

 

It is the referee, along with the Jury, who ultimately determines the condition of the track. Not the Race Director, not the people who built it and certainly not BSI.

 

The meeting, we were told about, by the TV commentators, that took place between the Riders and official, during the interval, where it was decided to call a halt to the proceedings....

 

That meeting.......

OKAY, it was the riders who met behind locked doors and would only allow the Race Director, a member of the FIM Jury (Tony Steele), the CCP Director (Armando Castagna) and the PZM (Wojciech Stepniewski) into the room at various stages. It was the riders who were not prepared to talk to the media or even TV which is why none of us knew exactly what was going on although it wasn't hard to put two and two together.

 

The PZM actually held a press conference later but few of us knew it was taking place.

[Sotonian]

So, Olsen and Paul Bellamy now have their Teflon jackets on. The latter's statement adds nothing that couldn't have been inferred by anyone who watched the events unfold. Over to you Speedway Star and Phil Rising, don't let us down this time!

[Barrycuda]

Post removed

Edited June 6, 2015 by Barrycuda

[PHILIPRISING]

FOR what it's worth, I think had the meeting progressed at a normal pace and not suffered so many interruptions, which allowed the riders' feelings to fester and for them to have a series of meetings, the event might actually have got through to at least Heat 20. The longer they sat around waiting for the starting gate to be fixed, frustrated and with growing anger, the more a rebellion became likely.

[spook]

I'M sure Paul would have been instructed by his bosses not to say anything until the in-house IMG lawyers had been consulted. Standard procedure I imagine.

 

It is the referee, along with the Jury, who ultimately determines the condition of the track. Not the Race Director, not the people who built it and certainly not BSI.

OKAY, it was the riders who met behind locked doors and would only allow the Race Director, a member of the FIM Jury (Tony Steele), the CCP Director (Armando Castagna) and the PZM (Wojciech Stepniewski) into the room at various stages. It was the riders who were not prepared to talk to the media or even TV which is why none of us knew exactly what was going on although it wasn't hard to put two and two together.

 

The PZM actually held a press conference later but few of us knew it was taking place.

 

standard procedure? i'm not sure about that ...... It is not giving anything away that evening to apologise (in the way that he has ended up doing anyway) and then to promise a statement on Monday. It needs to be understood that no fan knew what was happening that night either during the racing, the riders' meeting, or after....... and in fact two more days have elapsed since. Comparison of the FIM regulations and the SGP ticket terms & conditions also throws up a big question mark over ticket refunds... and yet there has been no word about this either....... a fairly important subject matter I would have thought.

 

It seems to me that the Jury are a bit of an unecessary third wheel when it comes to 'determining the condition of the track' ........... and as we now see, they are looking like the patsies...

[Barrycuda]

Post removed

Edited June 6, 2015 by Barrycuda

[Fromafar]

FOR what it's worth, I think had the meeting progressed at a normal pace and not suffered so many interruptions, which allowed the riders' feelings to fester and for them to have a series of meetings, the event might actually have got through to at least Heat 20. The longer they sat around waiting for the starting gate to be fixed, frustrated and with growing anger, the more a rebellion became likely.

Don't know why there was such an issue over the starting gate though,not ideal bur hardly a huge issue they should have been told to get on with it.To much time wasted trying for solution.They have rules in place is this occurs.To mess 50,0000+spectators about is unacceptable?Why would they have got through 20 heats the track would have been in same condition,the riders dictated things IMO .poor excuses from everybody concerned Edited April 20, 2015 by Fromafar