Warsaw Gp Saturday 18th April

[weatherwatcher]

All I can say is. What a bloody shambles.

[Red Panda]

Sorry but the track was raceable and rideable, did you not watch it properly and see Harris?

 

The only riders who fell was an unfit Batchelor and a struggling Holder.

 

The track was difficult but not unsafe.

 

Seem to remember a track at Belle Vue not so long ago that was waterlogged yet the meeting continued when it was far far more dangerous than last night. Poole werent worried about that track i seem to recall.

 

The riders (not all of them) bottled it.

 

The starting gate looked farcical.

The track wasnt great.

 

But the biggest farce was the huge delay while the riders had a meeting and got the meeting called off

didnt see any riders congratulating each other they were hugging and congratulating Gollob.

so unlike you get something wrong

I dont think a Poole fan can give any credibility on track safety as they need to get their own house in order first.

Quite happy to race in a monsoon at Belle Vue where riders couldnt see, yet think last night was dangerous!

Sorry but what has That Belle Vue meeting got to do with this.............I was one of the Poole fans who did not want it run.............but then again remember if Belle Vue had not faked a burst water main when the original meeting should have taken place then none of that would have happened............not Poole's fault that Belle Vue could not get their riders back in time..........funny how Matej Zagar was tweeting about being bored in a Manchester hotel room the same night....................

 

RP

Edited April 19, 2015 by Red Panda

[foreverblue]

The fans are the big losers here, some friends were considering going to this one and they are so glad they didn't, what a farce. The track looked raceable to me and Cardiff was like that in the early days, when Harris won Cardiff the track was worse than last nights in my opinion. What is it with riders these days,got to have perfect conditions or they want it called off.We had the german gp a few years ago called off for rain in a covered stadium and now they can't even prepare a track to last one meeting.

[dave69]

I don't know why this Warsaw GP was even held in Poland.They should have had the Polish GP in Britain so the Polish fans didn't have too far to travel.

[topaz325]

How did the ref get the decision so wrong in heat 1.......then is just went downhill fast.

[Midland Red]

The track looked raceable to me

Sorry, but that counts for nothing - whether sat in the armchair in front of tv or up in the stands at the stadium, what it looks like to you - to me, to everyone else - is totally immaterial in deciding whether it is safe to continue

[screm]

From Fredrik Lindgren Twitter Feed

 

Fredrik Lindgren @FLindgren66

 

Good call by ref Heat 1 whatever @nigelpearson and @Kelvin_Tatum says. Everyone going for same line first corner.

 

Wow?!? How can referees sometimes see an unsatisfactory start when it's been an ok start, but when the tapes go up uneven they don't see?

 

So was Jim Lawrence right and correct with the first heat decision according to Freddie.

 

And is Freddie right that referees see unsatisfactory starts when it's been an ok start, but when the tapes go up uneven they don't see?

 

For what its worth where is the flag man now on the fourth turn with the red flag that shows that the tapes have gone up uneven.

 

Do you think Lindgren, and the good folk on here would be saying the same if Pedersen had had Batchelor off, somehow I think not.

[lastword]

Well this guy thinks he knows where to put the blame, and he's not afraid to say so

 

link: http://www.sportowefakty.pl/zuzel/515699/wladyslaw-komarnicki-110-proc-winy-dunczykow-olsen-powinien-zbankrutowac

 

Use Google translate to get an approximate idea of what he says........................

[E I Addio]

Shame about last night. Hero to zero in 3 hours. A massive crowd in an impressive stadium, Greg H suggesting that this was the closest he would get to Wembley in his career (ie the longest of any of them) . Eurosport offering their informed, enthusiastic coverage which disentegrated into waffling by the end. Speedway is trying very hard to make an impact, for which the organisers should be congratulated. Yes, it brings in the cash but it takes plenty just to put these meetings on. However it would seem not enough of the budget is being spent on track preparation. I would love to ask the eventual "winner" why he chose not to practice. If it is an unsurmountable task to prepare a temporary racing surface to the safety (and racing) standard required, then the GP series will wither and die, as sponsors and spectators lose interest. Only good race of the night for me was when Kelvin referred to Gollob beating Nilsson years ago, and I watched it on Youtube while I awaited the farce to finish. Safety is paramount, so if Greg Hancock says it's not acceptable, that should be good enough for any speedway fan to acknowledge. This is not a time for hysterical reactions (and that other nonsense about flags, Poole, etc) but an assured response that this will not happen again. This requires explanation as to how they will acheive this. If we expect the authorities to be explicit in their details, the least we can do is a considered and measured response to the plans. Not a Pavlovian dismissal from the armchair experts.

It took 618 posts to get there but at last someone had managed a sensible, balanced and unhysterical post.

 

I am quite shocked by the number of posters that are prepared to "do a Briggo" and pass judgment on the state of the track from their armchairs, based on what they see on their TV screens. It's all very well to say that Bomber and others could ride the track but they must have agreed to the refusal to ride as they could have insisted on carrying on as Kenny Carter did at yhe British Final years ago and the protest would have collapsed.

 

Whether riders have raced on worse tracks in the past is irrelevant. This situation has been a long time coming. Poorly prepared temporary tracks have been a problem for a long time and this was bound to reach a tipping point and boil over sooner or later. It's just a pity it didn't happen a long time ago, then we might have been on an upward curve by now.so for my part I don't think we should be pointing the finger at the riders until more information leaks out, as no doubt it will,in time.

 

It's also a bit premature for the lynch mob to start accusing Phil Morris. Ashley Holloway has tweeted that the problem lies with others, not Phil, and I guess he has a bit more insight than most of the armchair experts on here.

 

Ole Olson , I have long felt is more trouble than he is worth . I think he has a lot to do to escape blame because the bottom line is that it's his track. A simple legal principle is that if you hold yourself out to be an expert you take the blame if the product is no good.

 

As for Jim Lawrence I have never in the past seen or heard anything that persuades me that he is anything other than a poor referee, although presumably one with friends in high places. We can make a judgment on him because he is in charge and the buck stops with him, although I daresay there are a few other nameless ones lurking in the shadows who should perhaps be taking some of the abuse being hurled at Phil Morris and the riders.

 

Bottom line though is that for my part I hardly watched any GP's last year, and whatever the rights and wrongs of last night I can see this year being the same. I am sure there are many more coming to the same view of the appropriately named "circus"

[pugwash]

Lastly I was extremely dissapointed with the total lack of information coming through from Eurosport and the commentators as to what was happening

 

. Eurosport offering their informed, enthusiastic coverage which disentegrated into waffling by the end.

Problem is Eurosport are only 'garden shed' broadcasters with no one trackside.

Ole Olson , I have long felt is more trouble than he is worth . I think he has a lot to do to escape blame because the bottom line is that it's his track. A simple legal principle is that if you hold yourself out to be an expert you take the blame if the product is no good.

 

 

Unfortunately his association with BSI is 'fireproof' so he wont get the blame.

[Gavan]

So why did the riders get the meeting called off then ?

 

Really, you need to pay a visitation to one of our sponsors, Specsavers.. very disrespectful to all the fans that were present. But i don't expect a clown like you to understand that.

i have no idea what you are wittering on about you fool. I've said the track was not to dangerous that the meeting had to be abandoned which is a view held by many on here. You really are a prat

[iris123]

Well this guy thinks he knows where to put the blame, and he's not afraid to say so

 

link: http://www.sportowefakty.pl/zuzel/515699/wladyslaw-komarnicki-110-proc-winy-dunczykow-olsen-powinien-zbankrutowac

 

Use Google translate to get an approximate idea of what he says........................

And a viewpint from Denmark.....again you need to translate it,but I do see Chris Harris getting into the GPs in front of a deserving German or two is also listed as part of the incompetence over the years

 

FARCEN I WARSZAWA

Problemer med bane og startmekanisme var ikke aftenens største skandale. Det var den totale mangel på krisehåndtering.

Af Ib Søby.

Enhver speedwayfan ved, at den elskede sport har sine skrøbelige sider. Man tilgiver regnvejrsaflysninger, lunkent fadøl, timelange pauser, ekstra banepleje og elendige højtaler forhold.

Det eneste der ophidser en ægte speedwayfan, er når vedkommende ikke får at vide at vide, hvad i alverden der foregår.

Når man ikke ved hvorfor der ikke sker noget.

Lørdag aften kunne publikum på stadion og tv seerne ved selvsyn konstaterer, at noget var rivende galt på denne festaften, hvor den gamle og hede polske drøm, om at køre i hovedstaden endelig skulle gå i opfyldelse.

Allerede omkring den aflyste fredagstræning begyndte alarmklokkerne at bimle. Skulle sporten nu oplevet et nyt Gøteborg 2003, et nyt Gelsenkirchen 2008.

Nej så galt kan det næppe gå, da ikke i Polen, da ikke til en sæsonåbner i hovedstaden på et af Europas nyeste stadionanlæg, da ikke for næsen af 60.000 publikummer og millioner tv seere over hele kloden.

Det ville jo svare til at det internationale Melodi Grand Prix blev aflyst efter 12 sange, fordi lyden forsvandt !

Men som vi alle ved, skete det alligevel på en mareridts aften for VM arrangør BSI/IMG, den polske motorunion PZM, racedirector Phill Morris fra den internationale motorunion FIM og den danske banebygger Ole Olsen.

Vi anerkender alle, at kørernes sikkerhed kommer i første række, men i mine øjne var krisehåndteringen den største skandale.

I Gøteborg gik daværende BSI boss John Postlethwaite ud sammen med Tony Rickardsson og forklarede publikum og tv seere, hvorfor man udsatte man løbet en uge. I Gelsenkirchen aflyste man kl. 13.00 og havde allerede en plan klar, at køre i Bydgoszcz ugen efter.

I lørdags lod man publikum og tv seere vente uden information, man lod kommentatorer som Jan Stæchmann og Tommy Knudsen sidde hjælpeløst og gætte på hvad der foregik fordi BSI/IMG, der styrer tv produktionen blot fodrede verdenen med publikumsbilleder i en time.

Man har en world-feed reporter i pitten, den samme som laver engelske interviews med kørerene i slæbepauserne. Hvorfor fik han ikke lov at komme på skærmen og berette om hvad der foregik ?

Man vil gerne klippe ned i pitten når Nicki Pedersen et i håndgemæng med f.eks Matej Zagar, men når der sker noget kontroversielt, som i lørdags, efterlades publikum og tv seere med rungende tavshed og senere et kort statement fra FIM.

Speedway er ikke den eneste sport som drives af en kommerciel virksomhed. Og mange er rigtigt glade for de store initiativ som BSI/IMG har taget med at bringe sporten ind på store stadions som i Cardiff, Parken og Stockholm.

Men ægteskabet mellem FIM og BSI/IMG har også sine skyggesider. Der er stor fare for at man piller ved sportens grundkerne, og gennem ægteskabet har speedwayfans set flere besynderlige afgørelser. Chris Harris blev for et par år siden tildelt en plads i Grand Prix kvalifikationsfinalen for snuden at to tyske kørere, Leon Madsen blev snydt i Vetlanda kvalifikationsfinalen i 2008 og man gav et wildcard til Hans Andersen, der havde klaret sig betydeligt dårligere i Sverige.

Omkring Hold VM har man nu seedet værtslandet til finalen, hvilket, mildest talt, er en sportslig katastrofe, især udstillet i Prag 2013, hvor Tjekkiet var statister i finalen. Man gør det for at være sikker på at sælge billetter, men piller ved billedet af, hvem der er verdens fire bedste speedwaynationer.

Dette års Hold VM finale køres i Vojens med Danmark seedet direkte til finalen. Hvordan hænger det sammen med at BSI/IMG og Ole Olsen i flere år har bedyret, at Vojens ikke længere er gearet til speedway på verdens niveau ?

Jo det skal selvfølgelig hænge sammen økonomisk, for speedway er en skrøbelig og lille sport, hvor tusinder af frivillige og ulønnede fans arbejder hårdt i fritiden, for at holde sporten kørende.

Man risikerer at fjerne det grundlag, ved ikke at tone rent flag, ved at stikke hovedet i busken når noget går imod forretningen.

Medier og tv stationer står af, fordi der på grund af tavsheden er sået tvivl om troværdigheden.

Og farcen i lørdags blev fuldbyrdet, da man efter aflysningen ville hylde Tomas Gollob på det halvtomme stadion.

Total mangel på situationsfornemmelse for stakkels Gollob og et forrygende eksempel på dårlig krisehåndtering.

[Barrycuda]

Post removed

Edited June 2, 2015 by Barrycuda

[sommelier]

It took 618 posts to get there but at last someone had managed a sensible, balanced and unhysterical post.

 

I am quite shocked by the number of posters that are prepared to "do a Briggo" and pass judgment on the state of the track from their armchairs, based on what they see on their TV screens. It's all very well to say that Bomber and others could ride the track but they must have agreed to the refusal to ride as they could have insisted on carrying on as Kenny Carter did at yhe British Final years ago and the protest would have collapsed.

 

Whether riders have raced on worse tracks in the past is irrelevant. This situation has been a long time coming. Poorly prepared temporary tracks have been a problem for a long time and this was bound to reach a tipping point and boil over sooner or later. It's just a pity it didn't happen a long time ago, then we might have been on an upward curve by now.so for my part I don't think we should be pointing the finger at the riders until more information leaks out, as no doubt it will,in time.

 

It's also a bit premature for the lynch mob to start accusing Phil Morris. Ashley Holloway has tweeted that the problem lies with others, not Phil, and I guess he has a bit more insight than most of the armchair experts on here.

 

Ole Olson , I have long felt is more trouble than he is worth . I think he has a lot to do to escape blame because the bottom line is that it's his track. A simple legal principle is that if you hold yourself out to be an expert you take the blame if the product is no good.

 

As for Jim Lawrence I have never in the past seen or heard anything that persuades me that he is anything other than a poor referee, although presumably one with friends in high places. We can make a judgment on him because he is in charge and the buck stops with him, although I daresay there are a few other nameless ones lurking in the shadows who should perhaps be taking some of the abuse being hurled at Phil Morris and the riders.

 

Bottom line though is that for my part I hardly watched any GP's last year, and whatever the rights and wrongs of last night I can see this year being the same. I am sure there are many more coming to the same view of the appropriately named "circus"

I do agree with you on the points you make on Phill Morris, what a nightmare of a GP for him, no one could have predicted all that happened last night

[Ghostwalker]

Quite possible there have been worse tracks then this but possible they riders just had enough and last night was the thing the tipped it over the edge?

Possible, less experienced/notable riders wouldn't complain because their opinions would have the same merit as the ones of Hancock/Pedersen

which is likely why just those two, the two most senior riders in the SGP-series, gathered the other riders and asked what they thought about the situation.

 

Would PL-riders have the guts to tell the referee that the track is unsafe? I think not and that why that is not a relevant comparison.

 

I am not against this temporary tracks as a concept and I think it is a necessity too have a few stadium GPs every year but as a complement to the permanent purpose built tracks.

Edited April 19, 2015 by Ghostwalker

[SPEEDY69]

After going to the Riga fiasco last season, feel sorry for the fans in Warsaw. Why can't speedway take a lower risk approach and follow the lead of other sports - e.g. Athletics where no major event can take place in a stadium which has not held at least one previous event. This way things like starting gates, lighting and the track can be tested before the world's media descends and the important event is upon them. The track was not that bad, they have had much worse in the past but probably that along with the tapes and inept referee just took them over the edge.

[tocha]

Quite possible there have been worse tracks then this but possible they riders just had enough and last night was the thing the tipped it over the edge?

Possible, less experienced/notable riders wouldn't complain because their opinions would have the same merit as the ones of Hancock/Pedersen

which is likely why just those two, the two most senior riders in the SGP-series, gathered the other riders and asked what they thought about the situation.

 

Would PL-riders have the guts to tell the referee that the track is unsafe? I think not and that why that is not a relevant comparison.

 

I am not against this temporary tracks as a concept and I think it is a necessity too have a few stadium GPs every year but as a complement to the permanent purpose built tracks.

 

 

And therein lies the problem. Purpose-built speedway stadiums don't have sufficient spectator capacity, the largest of which for this series, is Torun 15500.

Edited April 19, 2015 by tocha

[g13webb]

How I look at all the problems with our beloved sport, is that everyone want to make a big profit out it. The Promoters, the Riders, the Organisers, the Governing bodies.

 

What they don't appreciate is that we, the supporters, bare the blunt every time there's a problem....

 

If those pre-mentioned people had thought about the fans first, then the problems wouldn't have existed......

[Midland Red]

i have no idea what you are wittering on about you fool. I've said the track was not to dangerous that the meeting had to be abandoned which is a view held by many on here. You really are a prat

How do you know the track was not too (spelling) dangerous? I repeat " . . . whether sat in the armchair in front of tv or up in the stands at the stadium, what it looks like to you - to me, to everyone else - is totally immaterial in deciding whether it is safe to continue"

[jim3751]

Andy and Scott at Eurosport did the best they could not knowing what was going on. Andy even said he was trying to access twitter but to no avail. So accusation of waffling is very unfair. And bear in mind that Scott only started full time last year yet was never stuck for something to say - which is what a broadcaster has to do. Dead air is not an option.

 

And just to show how much attention is paid to the commentary Kelvin and Nigel even got the blame for referring to the "highlights" when all they did was the race commentary. The highlights - for that was what the races were compared to shots of the spectotors - had to be shown again and again.