Cost Cutting - How

[Bruiser McHuge]

£400 to paint a helmet !.....some riders don't half waste money..

 

I can't see a standard engine ever being brought in worldwide....most professional sports get dictated to from the very top and there are too many vested interests involved for that to be brought in....these GP riders are running 9 or 10 bikes , all professionally tuned...they aren't going to give that up easily regardless of whether the sport as a whole would benefit..

 

I've always been amazed at the money some riders spent which never needed to be spent....going back to when my brother in law rode he did a full British League season on one bike and one engine...it didn't look fancy and I saw him hammering rocker arms straight in my garage to save a few quid...he drove a knackered old van to meetings that riders took the Mickey out of...he did all the bike maintenance himself.....at the same time I saw junior riders getting engines back from Otto Lattenhammer at ridiculous expense, wear the flashiest of leathers, the smartest looking bikes....I cringed at their outgoings and their was no real need for it at their level at the time

I do think costs need to be cut but while the GP riders are earning what they earn and run 10 bikes at the same time then they will call the shots and nothing will really happen

[Blackadder]

League riders are underpaid for the job that they do, and the risks they take. As there are no signs of a few extra thousand fans coming through the turnstiles any time soon, the only realistic way to increase their income is to substantially reduce their costs. Let the GP riders ride what they like, but changes to equipment used in British leagues need to be done with urgency. There aren't very many winters, if any, left before it's too late.

[ford]

 

Until riders start using 'standard' engines with selected parts...

 

Then have a clause that any one can buy the winning engine from the rider for retail price plus a bit more to cover the cost of an engine rebuild the rider might have incurred.

[highside]

Promoters can agree on a pay scale and ALL stick to it .riders go back to having 1 bike half a dozen spanners instead of 3 bikes and a toolbox bigger than a F1 garage,and a car with bike on the back not a fancy van/motorhome .Simple but will never happen.

[speedibee]

I heard a story recently of a NL rider having his helmet taken off him by a machine examiner. The helmet was cracked, most agreed with that. The young rider in question kicked off as he'd just spent £400 having it painted and personalised. He was a NL rider, he had paid 3-4 meetings worth of earnings (without taking out expenses) on a helmet paint job FFS!

 

When I hear of riders doing things like that i struggle to have much sympathy for them when they plead poverty.

 

Before we standardise bikes, why not start by standardising helmets?

And I would agree , however most machine examiners are completely unqualified to pass judgement on the safety or otherwise of helmets . In my own experience of machine examiners . one asked me how to adjust the chain on his sons bike who had just started riding which pretty much demonstartes a lack of mechanical nowse . this was in october . and so you can imagine how shocked I was come the following march , when the same bloke approached me proudly displaying his SCB machine examiner tags !! and was none too pleased when I refused to let him examine my sons bike and Insisted on the chief examiner doing the scrutineering

[Bruiser McHuge]

Promoters can agree on a pay scale and ALL stick to it .riders go back to having 1 bike half a dozen spanners instead of 3 bikes and a toolbox bigger than a F1 garage,and a car with bike on the back not a fancy van/motorhome .Simple but will never happen.

I remember as a kid even world champions turned up in cars, the Citroen Safari seemed to be the car of choice, with a bike strapped to the back and all the tools and accessories in the back......imagine that now !...that was only in the late 70's and early 80's.

I think the only van I ever saw was Ivan Mauger's and the kids loved it....a van !.....all sign written as well...brilliant

Then Kenny Carter had that huge massive motor home that could never fit in the pits...sponsored by the Ham brothers I think before they took over Bradford....that was a huge thing and must have done about 2 miles to the gallon !! ...

When was the last time you ever saw a car with a speedway bike with name cover on the back.....

[Leicester Hunter]

I remember as a kid even world champions turned up in cars, the Citroen Safari seemed to be the car of choice, with a bike strapped to the back and all the tools and accessories in the back......imagine that now !...that was only in the late 70's and early 80's.

 

I remember having to move a CX Pallas estate around the forecourt at the garage I worked at in the early 80's, and getting them to stop smoothly was quite an artform until you got used to it. Like the DS before it, it didn't have a brake pedal, but a brake button. Gawd, talk about left foot braking....

 

I think the only van I ever saw was Ivan Mauger's and the kids loved it....a van !.....all sign written as well...brilliant

 

Ole Olsen was only other rider I remember having a van, a Custom Ford Transit, paid for, I believe by Castrol, who were one of his major sponsors at the time. But yes, Ivan certainly knew how to get a sponsor.... that van was Volkswagen LT, fully kitted out and signwritten by VW GB themselves. And it was a great advert for the sport at that time.

 

When was the last time you ever saw a car with a speedway bike with name cover on the back.....

I can't remember. All the riders seem to have vans these days, usually a Mercedes Sprinter, fully signwritten and everything.

 

Going back to the cars, most seemed to be Fords, either Mark 2 or Mark 3 Cortina's, Zephyr's or Zodiac's of varying vintage, or for those with a bit more of a budget, either an early Consul GT or a Granada. Now they really were the high speed loadluggers of the day. Unless you were Garry Middleton, of course. Then, only a Rolls Royce would suffice....

Edited October 21, 2014 by Leicester Hunter

[topsoil]

I don't know if this would save money or not, but I've always thought it would make more sense for each club to own all the bikes, engines, machinery in a pool and let the riders use these. At least that way, if nothing else, the club has some proper "assets". Okay each one could be specified to each individual rider's liking if needed.

These could be transported in a single vehicle, saving a bit of travelling costs.

Also, does every rider need his own mechanic(s)? Again, I've always thought it would make more sense to have maybe have a few mechanics all working for the club, on a part-time basis, looking after this "pool" of bikes.

[SGP]

MOTORSPORT by its very nature is something that costs money. Whilst cost-cutting is good in theory, it's something you can't apply without watering down the prodcut.

 

The only way it could be slightly controlled in the UK; would be for the BSPA to wage-cap. This initself presents many problems, but it would ensure pay continuity regardless of team.

[PHILIPRISING]

I remember having to move a CX Pallas estate around the forecourt at the garage I worked at in the early 80's, and getting them to stop smoothly was quite an artform until you got used to it. Like the DS before it, it didn't have a brake pedal, but a brake button. Gawd, talk about left foot braking....

 

Ole Olsen was only other rider I remember having a van, a Custom Ford Transit, paid for, I believe by Castrol, who were one of his major sponsors at the time. But yes, Ivan certainly knew how to get a sponsor.... that van was Volkswagen LT, fully kitted out and signwritten by VW GB themselves. And it was a great advert for the sport at that time.

 

I can't remember. All the riders seem to have vans these days, usually a Mercedes Sprinter, fully signwritten and everything.

 

Going back to the cars, most seemed to be Fords, either Mark 2 or Mark 3 Cortina's, Zephyr's or Zodiac's of varying vintage, or for those with a bit more of a budget, either an early Consul GT or a Granada. Now they really were the high speed loadluggers of the day. Unless you were Garry Middleton, of course. Then, only a Rolls Royce would suffice....

I MAY have mentioned this before somewhere, but Niels-Kristian Iversen told me in Latvia that he just changed vans (a Merc Sprinter, the most popular brand because it drives like a car apparently) and that his previous one had done 660,000 kilometres. But with "one careful owner!"

[mikebv]

Six man teams?

Clubs buy and maintain box standard bikes making them club assets, only spare parts registered and approved to be used, machine examiners to review?

Salary cap of 5k a team per meeting? - anyone found contravening gets points deduction or even thrown out of the league?

 

Advantages. No big tuning costs, economies of scale when purchasing bikes/spares, clubs increase asset value with bikes to sell on 'used', just a 10k revenue from the home meeting pays for the home and away meetings - at 15 quid its an attendance of just 800 after VAT paid..

 

800? ridiculous to even discuss such low numbers but that is the reality of the sport's position, (with many not even getting that), hence to carry on paying up to 3k a night for EL riders and PL riders on well over 1K a match is simply business suicide...

 

yet it doesn't seem to be sinking in too quickly does it?

[ch958]

MOTORSPORT by its very nature is something that costs money. Whilst cost-cutting is good in theory, it's something you can't apply without watering down the prodcut.

 

The only way it could be slightly controlled in the UK; would be for the BSPA to wage-cap. This initself presents many problems, but it would ensure pay continuity regardless of team.

 

sorry i think its nonsense that the product would be watered down - its not actual speed that matters just close racing

 

i've said many times before - the tech side is very much second place to most fans - teams and riders come first

[PHILIPRISING]

THE BSPA tried a wage cap several years ago and the season hadn't even started before one track broke it. Frankly, if the leagues in Britain, Denmark, Poland and Sweden got together and imposed a wage cap, obviously with different rates in each country, it would benefit everyone but that is never going to happen sadly.

 

There are ways that the BSPA could reduce some costs for riders. They bulk buy tyres and sell them to riders. There are other bike components for which they could also negotiate a favourable deal... Chris Louis suggested clutch plates for example. Apparently riders go through them like butter, according to Chris Holder.

[Vince]

Couple of things I have seen on here where riders are criticised perhaps unfairly.

 

Everybody did used to use a car with a bike rack, however had the option been there at the time to run a van that cost no more than a car and was just as fast they all would have been in vans. The Renault Trafic we owned was better on fuel and as practical for everyday use as my wifes Megane. It even went in multi story car parks without problems. With riders required to have two bikes at a meeting these days a van is the only option anyway really and there is no cost cutting to be had by using a car.

 

Sign writing, undoubtedly some riders have it for the ego boost but for my lad and I'm sure many others the van was sign written because a sponsor wanted it to be, it is definitely an attraction to sponsors to have a travelling billboard.

 

For us travelling and time off work was the killer cost not engines. Difficult to see how to get around that when tracks mostly have to run when the landlord allows.

 

The idea of a standard engine seems a good one, however as you never get two engines to run identically those with money to waste will buy several engines, select the best and sell the others on. I doubt GM would survive if Jawa were the sole engine for league racing and how long would it be before the price of the Jawa started to rise if they had a monopoly?

 

I like the idea of engines having to be sold at say 125% of standard cost. Even better if complete bikes had a price put on them, that would really discourage people spending unnecessary money on bikes.

 

The rev limiter is a great idea imo, might be easily fiddled by an electronics wizard but its even easier to check at any time by any bloke with a rev counter.

 

Riders could help the costs for themselves by learning to do basic servicing (and by learning that bikes screaming on the stand are wearing out rapidly!).

 

Clubs owning and maintaining bikes would be OK until the end of the first season when the winning teams would be accused of cheating by the fans of every other team. This would then be killing the sport because the BSPA are useless and it was much better when riders had their own engines and you knew they weren't being stitched up by the promoters!

[PHILIPRISING]

Couple of things I have seen on here where riders are criticised perhaps unfairly.

 

Everybody did used to use a car with a bike rack, however had the option been there at the time to run a van that cost no more than a car and was just as fast they all would have been in vans. The Renault Trafic we owned was better on fuel and as practical for everyday use as my wifes Megane. It even went in multi story car parks without problems. With riders required to have two bikes at a meeting these days a van is the only option anyway really and there is no cost cutting to be had by using a car.

 

Sign writing, undoubtedly some riders have it for the ego boost but for my lad and I'm sure many others the van was sign written because a sponsor wanted it to be, it is definitely an attraction to sponsors to have a travelling billboard.

 

For us travelling and time off work was the killer cost not engines. Difficult to see how to get around that when tracks mostly have to run when the landlord allows.

 

The idea of a standard engine seems a good one, however as you never get two engines to run identically those with money to waste will buy several engines, select the best and sell the others on. I doubt GM would survive if Jawa were the sole engine for league racing and how long would it be before the price of the Jawa started to rise if they had a monopoly?

 

I like the idea of engines having to be sold at say 125% of standard cost. Even better if complete bikes had a price put on them, that would really discourage people spending unnecessary money on bikes.

 

The rev limiter is a great idea imo, might be easily fiddled by an electronics wizard but its even easier to check at any time by any bloke with a rev counter.

 

Riders could help the costs for themselves by learning to do basic servicing (and by learning that bikes screaming on the stand are wearing out rapidly!).

 

Clubs owning and maintaining bikes would be OK until the end of the first season when the winning teams would be accused of cheating by the fans of every other team. This would then be killing the sport because the BSPA are useless and it was much better when riders had their own engines and you knew they weren't being stitched up by the promoters!

GOOD points well made

[R87]

Herein lies the problem with young riders in the UK. Having fancy slogans and cool helmet designs is all very well, but they need to put the hard work first to establish themselves. Speedway riders are effectively businessmen as well, so need to organise a stable financial footing before trying to impress their mates. Ultimately, its down to being badly advised

[Humphrey Appleby]

THE BSPA tried a wage cap several years ago and the season hadn't even started before one track broke it. Frankly, if the leagues in Britain, Denmark, Poland and Sweden got together and imposed a wage cap, obviously with different rates in each country, it would benefit everyone but that is never going to happen sadly.

Except a number of major sports have wage caps, and even manage to catch the cheats sometimes. It'll never work though...

[PHILIPRISING]

Except a number of major sports have wage caps, and even manage to catch the cheats sometimes. It'll never work though...

WHICH is what I said ...

 

Reminds me of a comment by a former SCB Chairman who said, quite rightly, that is easy to impose discipline (paramount if a wage cap exists) when promoters are making shed loads of money and you can threaten to withdraw their licence. Not so easy when they are not and any such threat would probably be meant with "I'll put it (licence) in the post."

[teddy2706]

And I would agree , however most machine examiners are completely unqualified to pass judgement on the safety or otherwise of helmets . In my own experience of machine examiners . one asked me how to adjust the chain on his sons bike who had just started riding which pretty much demonstartes a lack of mechanical nowse . this was in october . and so you can imagine how shocked I was come the following march , when the same bloke approached me proudly displaying his SCB machine examiner tags !! and was none too pleased when I refused to let him examine my sons bike and Insisted on the chief examiner doing the scrutineering

Unbelievable, only in speedway!

[The White Knight]

A new engine 570cc 2 valve that hopefully will be a stock engine instead of the free for all tuning ones that speedway currently has.

Would it ever get approved the Dean? - It would be brilliant if it did.

 

MOTORSPORT by its very nature is something that costs money. Whilst cost-cutting is good in theory, it's something you can't apply without watering down the prodcut.

 

The only way it could be slightly controlled in the UK; would be for the BSPA to wage-cap. This initself presents many problems, but it would ensure pay continuity regardless of team.

Can our Sport be watered down any further in this Country?