SPEEDY69 Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 As we all know, the regulations ask that riders remain still at the start. Many of you will have noticed, as I have, that some riders don't do this and referees do not always pick it up. I think it's a growing problem as it used to be just one or two (Hans Andersen was always noted for it) but now several riders are having a go at it because they see others getting away with it. It can really affect results of matches and is unfair on those and their teams who abide by the rules. Some riders when they get away with it end up scoring a hatful of points but at their next meeting when it's addressed by the referee they get hardly any. What can be done about it? Do the refs need to be shown videos? Could technology be used on the bike? Should they be closer to the tapes to start with? Should the rider be disqualified rather than 'all four back'? Any other suggestions or not a problem for you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racers and royals Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 They should do as they do in Poland-the start marshal has to ensure that all riders have their front tyre nearly on the tape,they are very hot on riders lining up straight as well-especially the outside start position. The start marshal only then walks away after getting confirmation from the ref that he is happy with the 4 riders positioning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewbacca Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 Go back to the sixties and seventies to see real rolling starts. In those days front wheels were regularly over the tapes and as long as they didn't actually break you were ok. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike.Butler Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 put offenders off 15m. soon put a stop to it. frequent restarts are tedious so if we are to have the no-moving rule at least give the refs some clout Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucifer sam Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 Starts are too fair these days. Should go back to allowing riders touching the tapes, as long as they don't break them. Would create some much needed controversy and talking points. All the best Rob 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevePark Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 More often than not, the start marshall has them lined up correctly, but as soon as he walks away, the rider moves back. This, to me, should be an instant disqualification/exclusion. That would then stop any rolling, as they will be lined up correctly at the tapes. Alternatively, a line behind the bikes at the start could be implemented, any back wheel that touches the line before the tapes go up, either disqualification/exclusion or a 15 metre handicap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penny Cross Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 Starts are too fair these days. Should go back to allowing riders touching the tapes, as long as they don't break them. Would create some much needed controversy and talking points. All the best Rob Totally agree. You just knew what was going happen when John Davis ,Ivan Mauger, etc, came to the tapes. The atmosphere it generated certainly added something to each meeting. I must admit, I don't like riders not lining up square to each other. At the Plymouth v Redcar meeting recently, Barker was almost at 45 degree's, aiming at Summers in the next gate. Despite Summers starting as far away from Barker as he could, the inevitable collision severely baulked Summers. I would have disqualified Barker, as it was clearly an act of revenge from their clash at Redcar the week or so before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMungo Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 I think you need to break it down between intentional and unintentional movement. If a rider is starting in a deep rut, trying to find the biting point at the start, and just goes a smidgen too far creating a slight movement at the start, that's not intentional. It's down to a slight misjudgement. However there are riders, several of them, who chose to go beyond that biting point, and hold the bike back by placing their left leg infront of the foot peg resulting in the bike looking still, but effectively isn't. Is that good starting technique or trying to gain an unfair advantage? I don't see the rolling at the start as being a major issue in the sport. It's a problem, but the sport has far bigger issues at the moment! I do like R & R's suggestion though, but the only problem with that is when it's windy conditions, we may end up with all riders getting excluded! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Smith Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 Rolling, anticipating start are ok with me. As long as they don't touch the tapes under the green light, let it go. All adds to the entertainment 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OveFundinFan Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 Stick the drop down bar in front of them like they have Moto-X, that wont stop them moving but will penalise them if they touch it as it drops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BangerBoy Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 Rolling, anticipating start are ok with me. As long as they don't touch the tapes under the green light, let it go. All adds to the entertainment Hear Hear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGT Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 The start marshall should line up the riders at the tapes. then have someone spray some of that the foam the refs were using at the world cup behind their back wheels,. Anyone who reverses over the foam is then given a chinese burn by either the start marshall, a grid girl or an independent body appointed by the SCB. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike.Butler Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 Alternatively, a line behind the bikes at the start could be implemented, any back wheel that touches the line before the tapes go up, either disqualification/exclusion or a 15 metre handicap. We need to give starting marshals some of that world cup paint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevePark Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 The start marshall should line up the riders at the tapes. then have someone spray some of that the foam the refs were using at the world cup behind their back wheels,. Anyone who reverses over the foam is then given a chinese burn by either the start marshall, a grid girl or an independent body appointed by the SCB. We need to give starting marshals some of that world cup paint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BangerBoy Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 wot about the o zone layer then ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyretrax Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 Rolling isn't the problem, the problem is refs who don't know the difference between rolling and anticipation. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screm Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 Cant we wire the tapes up to the electric, that would stop the tape touching. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BangerBoy Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 Rolling isn't the problem, the problem is refs who don't know the difference between rolling and anticipation. as long as they dont touch the tapes then it does'nt matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FAST GATER Posted July 22, 2014 Report Share Posted July 22, 2014 Who cares as long as the tapes aren't broken let them do what they like I have never had an issue with it but I was brought up on 70's speedway and no one stopped going watch the sport because of rolling starts as far as I know.The sport has a reputation for being "bland" ,predicable and boring ,nothing better than Mauger ,Olsen and Co being sent back to the pits for breaking the tapes HAPPY DAYS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.The starts are half the race for me and I hate seeing four robots in line leaving the start as if they were welded together no wonder there are so many restarts with all four riders hurtling it the 1st turn side by side.No one got injured from a flying start as far as I remember so maybe the present rules for starting could be deemed dangerous LOL 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hulvik Posted July 22, 2014 Report Share Posted July 22, 2014 Personally I think the Refs are as much to blame for this having watched the sport since the 70's I've seen a fair number of rolling starts and a fair few were the rider just antipated the tapes going up only to be called back. Added to this the fact some refs have a reputation for holding riders at the start longer than others. It's my understanding that there can be up to 5 seconds between the green light and the tapes rising maybe if the Human element was removed and this was made more randam electrionicly it might help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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