Birmingham - The Future?

[stansolo]

 

What brought that on? Not that I'm complaining...

No fair play you are fantastic, you really know the right way forward ......keep on keepin on babe?

 

What brought that on? Not that I'm complaining...

What a C--k.....................

[proud panther]

Stansolo you seem to need the shock factor to post on here. Stick to sensible debate, & we can enjoy your input.

[The Pedaler]

I've spoke to a few people about it and have had decent feed back and around 15 people I've spoken to would join such a scheme some prepared to make 15 to 20 pound donations...with the club shutting mid season most these people have saved 300-400 quid anyway with admission programme drinks fuel if not more ....

 

There are a lot of Birmingham supporters prepared to believe in anything that will offer them hope. I hope you are not preying on them. Bear in mind your previous promise, and I quote from you...

 

I have spent all day getting lots of people ready to make donations including 4 people willing to donate 200 pound each I think we could hit 25000 in a few weeks I've managed to line up 3000-4000 just today.

 

If you raised £4000 in one day, where is it? It certainly didn't jump-start the fighting fund which grew gradually from zero and took a while to get beyond your first day's efforts.

 

Basically, don't promise what you can't deliver. The fans don't deserve to be taken for a ride in this fashion.

[stansolo]

On a personal note .........a big CHEERS for them pm's I received......................One Love folks......

Fair play Deano......................you did a crackin job there.......................

Still being received and appreciated - 23/07/14

Stansolo you seem to need the shock factor to post on here. Stick to sensible debate, & we can enjoy your input.

I agree proud panther, and there are load of shockers on here who need the x Factor......

 

There are a lot of Birmingham supporters prepared to believe in anything that will offer them hope. I hope you are not preying on them. Bear in mind your previous promise, and I quote from you...

 

 

If you raised £4000 in one day, where is it? It certainly didn't jump-start the fighting fund which grew gradually from zero and took a while to get beyond your first day's efforts.

 

Basically, don't promise what you can't deliver. The fans don't deserve to be taken for a ride in this fashion.

£4000 in a day in speedway supporter terms is unheard of.........must be a business/sponsor getting involved.....well done !

[The Pedaler]

£4000 in a day in speedway supporter terms is unheard of.........must be a business/sponsor getting involved.....well done !

 

Let's congratulate him when we see the colour of the money and it is handed over...until then it is is nothing but forum flannel.

[stansolo]

Off topic, thanks again for the pm's I have received - you guys understand the economics of was is currently happening regarding the Birmingham team...cheers...

 

 

But I must comment others have there own agenda regarding myself ......let them continue, let them carry on .....they do nothing but be a negative source atm......

 

 

What's said has been said in the past, time to move on...............

[SteveLyric2]

For many non-Birmingham fans that are nevertheless trying to understand the detail of what has actually gone wrong at Perry Barr, the posturing of several 'I'm more important than you' individuals on here is not doing any good for anyone - least of all Brummies Speedway!!!?

 

Factual clarification is what is needed!

[P T Preece]

A bit of info please, I still cant get onto the Brummies forum has anybody esle been able too, it lets you in but when you sign in there is nothing.

[*JJ]

A bit of info please, I still cant get onto the Brummies forum has anybody esle been able too, it lets you in but when you sign in there is nothing.

That's the old one. Try: www.brummiespeedway.net

[Nigel]

I believe it is a widely held view that Tony Mole will be the saviour of Birmingham Speedway. ( if he runs it) It is a view I disagree with.

My argument is this:- Over the years Mr Mole and his bed fellow CVS, have been and still are highly influential men at the BSPA, during which time I have not witnessed any leadership, influence or direction in encouraging investment to modernise the sport, taking it into the 21^st century and appealing to the younger generation. The only initiatives in the face of the downward trend in spectator numbers appears to have been based on the Mole /CVS business model, “Cost Cutting” i.e. 2013, fortnightly meetings, 2014, draft riders.

 

Ask yourself this:- If Mr Mole is running Brum in 2015 will he.........

a)Invest in modernising the the sport fit for the 21^st century and appeal to the younger generation, and therefore more likely increase spectator numbers.............or

 

b)More of the same old thing, “I’m sending some riders around the track please come and watch” , pull the purse strings so tight that even the moths asphyxiate, with a budget premier league team that won’t win anything, but he will still turn a profit from the ever decreasing crowd numbers until it finally closes.

 

The Mole ‘business model’ will not in my view solve any of Speedways problems, it is the problem... focused on cost cutting instead of investment.

 

Any business whatever it may be cannot survive without investing in the future/modernising

 

Speedway needs a new generation of go ahead young promoters who will modernise the sport.

 

Should Mole be running Brum in 2015 I believe we will get nothing but bare bones speedway, not so much as a flag on the centre green , certainly not 2 paramedics as at some other tracks, so you will still be twiddling your thumbs for 20 mins while the medic puts a sticking plaster on a rider’s finger. No improvement in the inadequate outside viewing. A huge screen on the back straight with all the possibilities for modern showmanship and presentation ....and possible interaction with the i-phone generation.. Absolutely no chance...

 

I firmly believe that Brummies want speedway but not at any price, we are in the age of sophisticated computer technology, speedway has to drag itself from the 1930s and its nostalgic attitudes. A modernised show would I believe pull in the crowds at Perry Barr.

 

And to pre-empt the obvious accusations, I have nothing personal against TM (or others) I am sure he is a decent human being of integrity. My argument is against his and others methods of conducting their Speedway operations and its impact on the health, well being and future of our beloved sport.

 

Speedway the extreme sport 0-60 in 2.5secs and no brakes, its dangerous it’s terrifying,

it’s Awesome

Edited July 26, 2014 by Nigel

[*JJ]

Except, of course, the times when the Brummies were profitable was when the team was being run by Tony Mole. The young promoter could be Phil Morris (I hope).

[The White Knight]

Except, of course, the times when the Brummies were profitable was when the team was being run by Tony Mole. The young promoter could be Phil Morris (I hope).

A very good shout that JJ. :approve:

Edited July 26, 2014 by The White Knight

[bluejam]

I believe it is a widely held view that Tony Mole will be the saviour of Birmingham Speedway. ( if he runs it) It is a view I disagree with.

My argument is this:- Over the years Mr Mole and his bed fellow CVS, have been and still are highly influential men at the BSPA, during which time I have not witnessed any leadership, influence or direction in encouraging investment to modernise the sport, taking it into the 21^st century and appealing to the younger generation. The only initiatives in the face of the downward trend in spectator numbers appears to have been based on the Mole /CVS business model, “Cost Cutting” i.e. 2013, fortnightly meetings, 2014, draft riders.

 

Ask yourself this:- If Mr Mole is running Brum in 2015 will he.........

a)Invest in modernising the the sport fit for the 21^st century and appeal to the younger generation, and therefore more likely increase spectator numbers.............or

 

b)More of the same old thing, “I’m sending some riders around the track please come and watch” , pull the purse strings so tight that even the moths asphyxiate, with a budget premier league team that won’t win anything, but he will still turn a profit from the ever decreasing crowd numbers until it finally closes.

 

The Mole ‘business model’ will not in my view solve any of Speedways problems, it is the problem... focused on cost cutting instead of investment.

 

Any business whatever it may be cannot survive without investing in the future/modernising

 

Speedway needs a new generation of go ahead young promoters who will modernise the sport.

 

Should Mole be running Brum in 2015 I believe we will get nothing but bare bones speedway, not so much as a flag on the centre green , certainly not 2 paramedics as at some other tracks, so you will still be twiddling your thumbs for 20 mins while the medic puts a sticking plaster on a rider’s finger. No improvement in the inadequate outside viewing. A huge screen on the back straight with all the possibilities for modern showmanship and presentation ....and possible interaction with the i-phone generation.. Absolutely no chance...

 

I firmly believe that Brummies want speedway but not at any price, we are in the age of sophisticated computer technology, speedway has to drag itself from the 1930s and its nostalgic attitudes. A modernised show would I believe pull in the crowds at Perry Barr.

 

And to pre-empt the obvious accusations, I have nothing personal against TM (or others) I am sure he is a decent human being of integrity. My argument is against his and others methods of conducting their Speedway operations and its impact on the health, well being and future of our beloved sport.

 

Speedway the extreme sport 0-60 in 2.5secs and no brakes, its dangerous it’s terrifying,

it’s Awesome

 

Can see where you're coming from Nigel,but we don't know who's going to be involved in the make up of a proposed consortium of former sponsors that TM is planning to meet sometime in August.

[Whisperer]

Can see where you're coming from Nigel,but we don't know who's going to be involved in the make up of a proposed consortium of former sponsors that TM is planning to meet sometime in August.

The Mole, CVS and to some extent the Machin business model maintains viable speedway and more importantly sustainable speedway. All of the bright ideas brigade have blown their combined three pennies due to relative inexperience, poor advice, too much ambition too soon and again to some extent too much money to invest which has led to a higher burn rate.

 

There can have been no greater attempt to modernise the sport and attract new customers than Nigel Wagstaff and Brian Griffin at Kings Lynn. Steve Purchase at Oxford also made brave attempts to change the status quo and no one has invested more in the sport by way of marketing and promotion than Rick Frost and Julie Mahoney. Stuart Douglas has survived his investment in Lakeside but will tell you it's been one of the toughest challenges he has ever been involved with and whilst he is a fan at heart he put experience in place partnering JC but as an entrepreneur will tell you he is mystified as to why some of the initiatives haven't worked to bring consistent improvement in crowd numbers. Lakeside at times gets fantastic TV coverage across London and the South.

 

The reality is there isn't a magic formula, as much as I despise the untruths in this weeks comic Alan Phillips has poured a small fortune into marketing and promoting Birmingham and if ever there was a recent testimony to indicate that the opportunity to bring new punters in isn't realistic then Brum are that example. I will knock him for not being entire!y honest but one thing he got right was to try and bring new people in, the fact that he failed is a mirror of all those promotions I have mentioned and not Alan Phillips. Please just be careful what you wish for Nigel as you could face an open and shut scenario on a regular basis.

Edited July 26, 2014 by Whisperer

[Nigel]

The Mole, CVS and to some extent the Machin business model maintains viable speedway and more importantly sustainable speedway. All of the bright ideas brigade have blown their combined three pennies due to relative inexperience, poor advice, too much ambition too soon and again to some extent too much money to invest which has led to a higher burn rate.

 

There can have been no greater attempt to modernise the sport and attract new customers than Nigel Wagstaff and Brian Griffin at Kings Lynn. Steve Purchase at Oxford also made brave attempts to change the status quo and no one has invested more in the sport by way of marketing and promotion than Rick Frost and Julie Mahoney. Stuart Douglas has survived his investment in Lakeside but will tell you it's been one of the toughest challenges he has ever been involved with and whilst he is a fan at heart he put experience in place partnering JC but as an entrepreneur will tell you he is mystified as to why some of the initiatives haven't worked to bring consistent improvement in crowd numbers. Lakeside at times gets fantastic TV coverage across London and the South.

 

The reality is there isn't a magic formula, as much as I despise the untruths in this weeks comic Alan Phillips has poured a small fortune into marketing and promoting Birmingham and if ever there was a recent testimony to indicate that the opportunity to bring new punters in isn't realistic then Brum are that example. I will knock him for not being entire!y honest but one thing he got right was to try and bring new people in, the fact that he failed is a mirror of all those promotions I have mentioned and not Alan Phillips. Please just be careful what you wish for Nigel as you could face an open and shut scenario on a regular basis.

 

I am somewhat disappointed to see a negative and down beat post against modernising speedway and I am not swayed by your arguments. Without wishing to be rude, you seem to be stuck in the past, surprising since no doubt you are much younger than me.

 

Philips did nothing to bring in the crowds, he drove them away.... a PR disaster

 

You think bare bones Speedway is sustainable and will survive..?

 

but this is about the future not the past. we must move into the 21st century or die

Edited July 26, 2014 by Nigel

[Guest]

...but this is about the future not the past. we must move into the 21st century or die

Great summary. Like it.

[Deano]

Nigel speaks some sense when it comes to the concept of selling speedway in Birmingham.

 

When you have Poole who have been going for yonks, Wolverhampton who have been going for yonks along with Cov, then there is Birmingham where most of the city can't remember it.

 

So perhaps those in Birmingham judge it against all other current attractions that are perhaps more with it and upto date.

 

If speedway feels twenty years out of date, the new fans won't come back in their droves.

[Whisperer]

I am somewhat disappointed to see a negative and down beat post against modernising speedway and I am not swayed by your arguments. Without wishing to be rude, you seem to be stuck in the past, surprising since no doubt you are much younger than me.

 

Philips did nothing to bring in the crowds, he drove them away.... a PR disaster

 

You think bare bones Speedway is sustainable and will survive..?

 

but this is about the future not the past. we must move into the 21st century or die

Your points are of course reasonable but not proven by previous entrepreneurial actions I am in my late sixties and have pumped a small fortune to help riders and clubs over the years.When promoting or marketing a product or service you have to look at the market potential. There are three market conditions to consider, a declining market, a static market and a growing market and which you invest in. Clearly everyone invests in a growing market for obvious reasons and protecting your share of a static market requires careful investment but to invest in a declining market can only have one outcome. Since 2007 Speedway attendance's have been in steady decline now don't look to blame anyone individual or body it is a fact for whatever reason. That decline has been influenced by the economic trends not necessarily the BSPA or your local Promotion so in that cruel market the opportunities to succeed are very limited indeed.

 

Now you may be disappointed that my realistic and qualified opinion isn't what you desire but harsh reality rarely is. Timing and market conditions are absolutely critical when it comes to a growth challenge, I don't wish to appear condescending Nigel but the expertise to achieve what you would like to see just isn't in British Speedway in a sufficient capacity to make a difference. Most of those who have had those skills have been dissed or driven out of the sport. Regards.

[orion]

 

 

 

Philips did nothing to bring in the crowds, .

 

 

What about putting a side together that was the best in the land .

[Deano]

Your points are of course reasonable but not proven by previous entrepreneurial actions I am in my late sixties and have pumped a small fortune to help riders and clubs over the years.When promoting or marketing a product or service you have to look at the market potential. There are three market conditions to consider, a declining market, a static market and a growing market and which you invest in. Clearly everyone invests in a growing market for obvious reasons and protecting your share of a static market requires careful investment but to invest in a declining market can only have one outcome. Since 2007 Speedway attendance's have been in steady decline now don't look to blame anyone individual or body it is a fact for whatever reason. That decline has been influenced by the economic trends not necessarily the BSPA or your local Promotion so in that cruel market the opportunities to succeed are very limited indeed.

 

Now you may be disappointed that my realistic and qualified opinion isn't what you desire but harsh reality rarely is. Timing and market conditions are absolutely critical when it comes to a growth challenge, I don't wish to appear condescending Nigel but the expertise to achieve what you would like to see just isn't in British Speedway in a sufficient capacity to make a difference. Most of those who have had those skills have been dissed or driven out of the sport. Regards.

 

Interesting.

 

So who previously did you think had these skills?

 

Do I assume it's the people you mentioned in your previous post?